Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Interesting article from theregister.com.

Are analysts delusional?

Are shareholders sh**ing themselves?

At £429 is it good value for money?

Do you really care?

What colour underpants am I wearing today?

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

It should've read

"Bullsh** analysts: N8 will save Nokia" :D

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

lol

u never list to analysts - they write it because they are told to write it

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Well I suppose that if the comment about the operators being interested in the N8 holds true, then there could be.some truth to this prediction...

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

I do not think it will *save* Nokia because Nokia is not in the same state as Palm was... But it will give a bit of fresh air and (hopefully) stop the hemorrhagic high-end (note high end please) slide of marketshare.

I do not see why N8 is not going to be a very good seller and you will see Nokia trumpeting "millions of N8s sold". Still I am waiting to see what they bring with MeeGo (not even the "N9") and Symbian^4.

I would believe that this is a good strategy for now. Bring N8 with very good features, still try to be relevant and build some much needed developer support and come back full force with the next devices. If not then I guess some concrete shoes would go well with whatever they will be wearing.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

429£ is probably in the low range for such a device, so yeah good value for money s long as you aren't allergi to symbian like me.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

If the photos and video rival decent "point &shoot camera's" then yes.. n8 will sell like hotcakes to the 'average' consumer... else its gonna bomb.

I suspect its the E7 that will bomb if its Symbian.. the UI layout and overrall feel is just outdated when compared to the competition. Nokia can remedy this by promising dual boot support with Meego, but they won't.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

They have enough problems supporting (or not supporting to be more accurate) single-OS devices. Their problem is differentiation - too many models differentiated by the number and nature of defect - instead of making a few top-notch models and support them properly, they make loads of crippled ones and give them little or no support.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Yes, it does look like Nokia is going back to its "old ways" of removing features from one model to save sales on another model. Eg.

Will E7 have xenon flash? or have same video/photo quality but at lower res?

Why would anyone buy the E7 knowing the N9 is coming very soon? the only solution is to allow dual boot Meego or at least "hint" that it can be hacked to do so.

The E7 hardware design is an absolute dream form factor, but I'm going to hold off until the N9 details are revealed.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

exactly. When analysts say something, one should contra them because

a) they know too little about things they analyze
b) they have certain motives
c) they function as packs and follow others blindly

with n8 it has been pretty convenient to bash it when everything is pure speculation and their word matters because of lack of real information (stock reacts down=they are buying) and turn around when there are clear indications of success (further boost stock up=they are selling)

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

keep on dreaming.
E=business=medicore camera
N=multimedia=top of the line cameras

N8's cam module is huge, the space is used to other features (probably battery?) considered more important to business users

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

At 429, I could buy you pants of the same colour, and tell you everyday. But no, definitely not a N8.:cool:

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

All this tells me is that Morgan Stanley and Merrill Lynch, have in some way or another interests in Nokia stock going up.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Are you completely blind? Anybody over the age of 20 looking for a phone. Should I buy this, so I can install a light sabre and a nice looking compass? or should I take the other one with xenon flash and the best camera out there with real optics, and HDMI and HD video capture (+ light sabres and compasses)? hmmm.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

That was the point, is the business model of having a separate N and E series still viable today?

I strongly believe the current market is yearning for a mix of both. They should have just created the E7 with the same camera optics, a small bulge for a kickass camera is quite acceptable..

Or is the N9 finally the device that will mix both?

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

I started praying just after I realized that the meego device could have N8 camera module plus fcam. :)

and I understand the point of various hw options: anyone can choose the best compromise for himself. Even with such options you cant please everyone, how could it be possible with fewer options?

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

I think the N8 will sell a whole lot, though I don't think Nokia needs saving anymore than Apple and its 4 straight quarters of losses needs saving. Nokia's profitable, has momentum, and an ace in the hole with MeeGo in the N9 right behind it.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Whoa whoa WHOA-- some of us analysts don't fit that description! :(

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Didn't you get the memo...?

Ever since the iPhone, high Tech specs are not the only way to sell high end mobile phones anymore.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Well, I'll find out in about 2 weeks when I get my hands on the N8. I reckon it has good enough specs to sell millions. Maybe not for us geeks but to the masses, it has good enough of a formula to be successful. (one of best camera on a mobile phone so far, xenon flash, hdmi out with DD5.1 and mkv/avi playback, free OVI maps etc)

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Yep. Fart apps is how you do it now.

Seriously... I cannot get behind a Symbian phone as a "saviour" for Nokia when I know Maemo 5 was better and MeeGo is coming.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

In my opinion, N8 nor N9 can save NOKIA from their sin, only god can save them now.

Seriously, what can N8 do? and so called rumour N9? Both device looks terribly ugly. Seriously SYMBIAN will save NOKIA? Not even maemo5 could, what make people think Symbian will?

N9 has to be beyond iPhone4 in term of hardware(s) spec and Meego has to be on multi devices like HTC, Samsung, SONY to be able to catch up with the technology and market.
And what is the good of an OS without users or developers?

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

The so-called-leaked N9 photos looked pretty nice to me. Also, N9 should be every bit beyond iPhone4 in hardware.
iPhone 4 didn't break any new ground imo. I was disappointed at the specs. Infact, even N8 beats it in in many areas. (Camera, xenon flash, HDMI, microSD support, USB host, Bluetooth 3.0 etc) Not sure why everyone hates Symbian. It's not as bad as everyone makes it out to be. But yeah, it never took off in apps support like the other OS.That wasn't the fault of the "OS".

Maemo wasn't supposed to save Nokia. It was more like a side project really. (well, IMO)

But yeah, I hope MeeGo gets good apps / dvs. It better match Android at worst. My friend sold his Galaxy S and went to iPhone this week due to lack of apps on the Android. (yes, compared to iPhone, Android just doesn't have anywhere near as much)

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Nokia makes great hardware. Unfortunately for them everyone else has caught up. Aside from that, the reason they are losing out to the competition is the software. Symbian has hardly changed in the years since it was introduced. Maemo is a vastly superior operating system, yet Nokia fumbled it so badly that no one will remember it next year aside from a small group similar to those that remember Amiga. MeeGo has unlimited potential and maybe Intel will pull it up by it's bootstraps, but after seeing how Nokia handled Maemo it's really hard to believe that they won't fumble MeeGo into obscurity as well.

So no, the N8 won't save Nokia. The only thing that will is a radical restructuring of how they promote their devices, and how they develop their software. They need to spend LOTS of money getting their software and services on par with Google and Apple, and they need to spend the money to make sure that the OVI store has more than a handful of mostly useless apps on it. They cannot rely entirely on opensource community apps, as great as many of them are. They need to pay developers bounties, like Microsoft is doing for Windows Phone 7. Right now even that turd looks more promising because at least it's got some backing from companies that are actually in the software business.

For more than 10 years I used to pull really hard for Nokia, but it'll be a cold day in hell before I waste any more money testing their lame duck software for them. I feel sorry for the guy that paid almost retail for my n900.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

yep, those are the analysts who get ignored by default in media... didn't bother being more precise with it, sorry.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

and I really hope some people will get it some day: symbian is superb when you need to do budget phones. Meego would be overkill for N8 hw, android would be at least a bit laggy, .....

...and the masses don't care if you have "the best OS" or not. if it suits you, you are fine. it isn't any more complicated than this.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

That's why Android and iOS haven't managed to affect Symbian at all. People don't care if all that cash they dropped gets them the latest and greatest features or not, they just want to make phone calls!

*loses 30% market share between 2006 and 2010*

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

The N8 will save Nokia because most of the investors in nokia are americans and the N8 is an attempt at something very iphone-like (which is what the US investors have wanted for a long time).
The investors don't care about the technical stuff as much as we, the people of the internets, do. Satisfying/impressing the investors and the big analysts (like Merrill Lynch and Morgan Stanley) is pretty important.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Interesting yet annoying article in todays Helsingin Sanomat (Helsinki's main newspaper).

Some reviewer not reviewing the N8 but just comparing it to the iphone saying useful things like "I want to use the camera but I can't because the icon is in a different place to the iphone"!!!!

Well no sh_t jerkoff it is a different device! That is like giving a laptop a bad review because the on/off button is in a different place.

Great stuff. No wonder the title if the article is "N8 will not save Nokia"!!

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Care to show some proof?

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Little bit unrelated, but I'm kind of jellous. As my wife had her birthday last week, instead of a present she got to preorder the N8 and it's supposed to land in the end of this month.
I'm amazed over the vidoes I've seen, it's like carrying around a full featured media player.that you can connect anywhere and look at movies with great video and sound. Next step is to buy her one of those stylish 2.5" harddrive (fitting the color of her N8 of course), then she'll have her complete storage solution for it too with the USB OTG.

I think this device will do just great in sales, Nokia will do their needed comeback.

BUT...I just hope that they won't do the same mistakes with the N8 as with the N900. The amazingly bad support for that device made me promise myself never buy anything (for my own use) with the Nokia brand ever again.
I do realize N900 is a different kind of device and I DID buy it as a portable linux computer with a "phone feature" but it doesn't really matter, the customer care was a complete failure.
When are they going to compensate us poor N900 users, huh?

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

N8 will save Nokia but Android will Kill N8

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Most consumers are not interested in what "OS" a device runs but instead concentrate on the features a device advertises - e.g. 12 megapixel camera, screen size etc.

Unfortunately for Nokia the OS itself has become a feature - e.g. android or Windows mobile and to a certain degree iOS (many users equate the OS = iPhone).

Symbian as a mobile OS is fine - it requires minimal resources and has proven over time to be quite reliable (we won't mention early releases of the n97!).

But times are changing.

My partner owns a 5800 Music Xpress phone. She has had it for a year and a half and really likes the OVI store (she will only use free stuff and refuses to buy any apps because her device is "just a phone")

It's a robust phone - this has been proven - somebody spilt a full glass of wine over it but the 5800 eventually sorted itself out and still works! (not to mention the many times she has dropped it or kicked it across the floor!)

The phone even has a tv-out but my partner never uses it. She has seen my n900 plugged into the t.v. and she thinks its "cool!".

Her contract is due for renewal next year and I assumed she would get another Nokia but I was wrong. She does not like iPhone but is really impressed with android.

Her next purchase will be an android-based phone. Mainly 2 reasons for this; (1) She has read an awful amount of press about it and (2) the availability of apps. Actually there is a third - "because the phones look nice".

I'm pretty sure she has seen the N8. She likes the look of it but asked if it was android. She is not interested in the n8.

I think Nokia's problem is the customer's perception of a "smartphone". They equate a smartphone to Iphone, android, blackberry rather than it's actual capabilities.
Also the availability of apps is an important factor too. Symbain has many but people seem to overlook it.

At the moment Nokia are going for the lowest-common-denominator and selling cheap phones. But people are demanding more from their phones and at some point selling a symbian-based phone will not be enough.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

So you're saying: forget about the consumers, all the "analysts" and "investors" will be buying the N8 and hence save Nokia :confused:

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

nokia is doomed. nuff said.

and if somehow the N8 brings them back from the dead, they'll do something daft anf f**k it up anyways.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

Nokia fuc*ed up the N97, N97 mini once and twice the N900... What make you guy think Nokia won't Fu*ked up again? Seriously, Nokia needs to stop pumping out those new phones every frigging 6months. Make a device future proof and make money out of it and upgrade it once a year or so. Even top of the line won't even last more than 6months lol.

Look at Apple, Iphone 3GS is still in the market and still in production, still support, and hardware is still up to date not yet far behind from today technology. Apple seems to make their device 1year a head of others in term of hardware specs. Iphone4 will last 2years at least, then it will bringing something twice as better than its competitors again.

Nokia needs to learn to hold back a little on rushing things and trying to shoot many targets at the same time in the hope of hitting a few. It's a mess if you are one of the people who keep buying Nokia every year.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

The N8 will be another mass seller. But it won't save Nokia. Nokia's software creation process isn't about striving for the best like Apple, it always defaults to "good enough". Coupled with the fact that Nokia is spending something like 13-16% of its turnover on R+D wereas Apple spends something like 3% then you have an unsustainable situation.
I forecast a massive cull in Nokia's symbian division after the very,very,very delayed release of the N8. Its the only way Nokia can keep the market sweet.
Just to summarise the N8 is nowhere near the iPhone UI. The N8 is nowhere near the latest Android devices that HTC is turning out.
The real threat to Nokia is Android devices - once they get to that magic retail price/BOM price then Nokia will be in dire straits.
The Nokia CEO has dodged so many calls for him to step down - I don't think he's going to be able to dodge this next one.

One last rant - the N900 - it could of been Nokia's saviour - a long term strategy. However it was half finished and only appealed to experts in Linux etc. In my mind for a platform to be successful it has have a mainstream audience which can provide revenue to programmers to develop for as well as the tools to make development fun and easy.
IMHO Nokia should have reworked the N900 by fixing the niggles and making it usable by normal users. It should have released another form factor of the N900 that was slimmer but still supported the previous N900 users. Instead it kicked it into the bin and its now in a chilled state where only minor upgrades are offered. Meego was the bullet in the head to the N900. Again its Nokias old mentality - we don't make money from the phone software, we make it from selling the next hardware model.
I feel this will be the legacy that the CEO will leave Nokia - he focussed on that clusterf*ck called OVI yet didn't change the revenue generation model of Nokia. Symbian has become a mill stone around its neck.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

thanks for the straw man and missing completely my point.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

errr... a device that was said to be "step 4/5" when it was announced? get real.

Re: Bullish analysts: N8 will save Nokia
 

why have steps ? is Nokia so unable operate in a continuous improvement mode ? Truth is Nokia never has actually been able to provide a rolling production level release process. Instead it operates in a compartmentalised branch release mechanism. Once you buy a N97 - new features in later phones that are entirely in s/w are never back ported to the N97 release..