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-   -   MicroB crashes when OC (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=62396)

toxaris 2010-09-16 16:43
MicroB crashes when OC
 
Hello.
I have found a strange behavior when OC to 850mhz.
I open up www.dn.se and navigate to almost any underpage, the browser starts to load the page and after a while after some scrolling/zooming the page reloads and the phone crashes.

This never happens if the phone is running stock clock (600mhz).

See this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8D1e_9kXz8

Anyone else experience this?

ossipena 2010-09-16 16:47
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
it is the biggest risk from OCing: memory corruption.

shadowjk 2010-09-16 20:20
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
The fix is obvious: Don't overclock

casper27 2010-09-16 20:27
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
If a packet hits a pocket on a socket on a port, and the bus is interrupted at a very last resort, and the access of the memory makes your floppy disk abort, then the socket packet pocket has an error to report.

:D

lma 2010-09-16 23:11
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ossipena (Post 818042)
it is the biggest risk from OCing: memory corruption.
That's peanuts, a much bigger risk is frying one or more chips permanently.

toxaris 2010-09-17 09:02
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowjk (Post 818270)
The fix is obvious: Don't overclock
Truly. No more OC for me on regular usage.

Renkon 2010-09-17 10:01
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
This is a problem with the flash player. No crashes on mine with flash disabled. It only happens when microB tries to use the plugin.

Be sure to reboot again the regular way after an automatic crash reboot. Sometimes it will eat up a lot of cpu after turning on again.

maxximuscool 2010-09-17 10:22
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lma (Post 818438)
That's peanuts, a much bigger risk is frying one or more chips permanently.
love fry chips :D Yummie, I think it will go well with Liquid Nitrogen frizzy :D

kureyon 2010-09-17 11:00
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
OC'ed to 900MHz, microb and flash works fine here - ymmv :)

ossipena 2010-09-17 11:26
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lma (Post 818438)
That's peanuts, a much bigger risk is frying one or more chips permanently.
it depends on point of view. but if I've understood correctly, the probability of memory corruption vs frying chips is much greater.

so memory corruption is easier to trigger than to fry a chip.

kureyon, I didn't know that your and OPs devices are exact replicas.... (read: there is variation between device hw)

gabby131 2010-09-17 11:38
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
what memory corruption? my microSD card always says corrupted file and so whatever and im overclocking up to 1150mhz.

is that the memory? :)

Renkon 2010-09-17 13:18
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Speeding up the processor results in speeding up the internal system clock, it's the heartbeat of the system and measures almost everything.

If you're speeding up too much / heating up the hardware to limits the clock dependant components will miss a beat or see it as "background noise" (remember, everything is analogue signals, they're being digitized and filtered).

So the clock will have somewhat an arrhythmia and therefore precise timing operations are more likely to fail. This includes RAM and also disk- / mmc-writes.

The faster you go, the faster will the flanks of the signal rise and fall.
The lower voltage you go, there is more possibility the signal will decarded as noise.

Explained in layman's terms, reality is somewhat complexer.

Good news:
- it COULD break your filesystem -> reflash
- nothing to worry about if you keep regular backups (!!)

munkiii 2010-09-17 13:20
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by toxaris (Post 818039)
Hello.
I have found a strange behavior when OC to 850mhz.
I open up www.dn.se and navigate to almost any underpage, the browser starts to load the page and after a while after some scrolling/zooming the page reloads and the phone crashes.

This never happens if the phone is running stock clock (600mhz).

See this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8D1e_9kXz8

Anyone else experience this?
I've had 2 n900's now (accident, insurance replacement).

1st N900, i had on an 850 OC all the time and it worked fine.

2nd N900, i OC'd it to 850 and it crashed all the time, so i dropped it down to 805 and it's worked fine ever since.

(It actually works fine on 1000 OC aswel, just not 850, strange).

johnel 2010-09-17 13:21
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renkon (Post 818913)
Speeding up the processor results in speeding up the internal system clock, it's the heartbeat of the system and measures almost everything.

If you're speeding up too much / heating up the hardware to limits the clock dependant components will miss a beat or see it as "background noise" (remember, everything is analogue signals, they're being digitized and filtered).

So the clock will have somewhat an arrhythmia and therefore precise timing operations are more likely to fail. This includes RAM and also disk- / mmc-writes.

The faster you go, the faster will the flanks of the signal rise and fall.
The lower voltage you go, there is more possibility the signal will decarded as noise.

Explained in layman's terms, reality is somewhat complexer.

Good news:
- it COULD break your filesystem -> reflash
- nothing to worry about if you keep regular backups (!!)
That's a great description of the overclocking effects on the n900. Your post should be in the wiki!

Renkon 2010-09-17 13:23
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
@munkiii:
what voltage profile you're on?
xlv, ulv, ul, ideal, default?

@johnel:
Well, let's wait some more time to be corrected by someone else :)
Maybe there is someone with more knowledge on this area, I've just remembered this from my univ. course about digital signals. Mileage may vary from device to device, this is just the general concept.

toxaris 2010-09-20 07:36
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by munkiii (Post 818915)
I've had 2 n900's now (accident, insurance replacement).

1st N900, i had on an 850 OC all the time and it worked fine.

2nd N900, i OC'd it to 850 and it crashed all the time, so i dropped it down to 805 and it's worked fine ever since.

(It actually works fine on 1000 OC aswel, just not 850, strange).
Yea, maybe go down to 800. But the bigest reason to OC for me was lower the voltage and save energy. Its very rare that Im in need of 800mhz. Maybe I should go make a new profile with just lower voltage.

RobbieThe1st 2010-09-20 08:13
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
You -need- to make your own voltage profile. By this I mean you need to test each frequency under load, undervolt it till it crashes, then up it by 2 units.
Each N900 is different, and as such you can't assume any profile will work with yours.

SAABoy 2010-09-20 08:28
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renkon (Post 818918)
@munkiii:
what voltage profile you're on?
xlv, ulv, ul, ideal, default?

@johnel:
Well, let's wait some more time to be corrected by someone else :)
Maybe there is someone with more knowledge on this area, I've just remembered this from my univ. course about digital signals. Mileage may vary from device to device, this is just the general concept.
x2, i cant believe everyone was so quick to critisize without even asking of the voltage profile. For me, as per Jakiman's recommendation, i do

kernel-config load lv
kernel-config limits 250 850

If I were to try 850 without lv then all my stuff crashes too. but then, when I go to 900, if i turn on lv everything crashes :P its tricky, but try different voltage profiles at 850.

atilla 2010-09-20 09:01
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
i have titans lv profile at 850 mhz but no crash at this site.
but the site is eating cpu and ram resources like hell.
you should try another app that eats much cpu and ram like a emulator or a big movie.

9000 2010-09-20 09:50
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by toxaris (Post 818039)
Hello.
I have found a strange behavior when OC to 850mhz.
I open up www.dn.se and navigate to almost any underpage, the browser starts to load the page and after a while after some scrolling/zooming the page reloads and the phone crashes.

This never happens if the phone is running stock clock (600mhz).

See this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8D1e_9kXz8

Anyone else experience this?
Some time a particular freq. range doesn't work for you, consider changing to some other range.

If you look at the OC profile you selected(starving in this example, and provided that you're using titan's power kernel), you can find a list of selectable freq.:

Code:
FREQS="0:22,90 125:22,90 250:28,180 500:29,360 550:32,400 600:34,430 700:41,430 750:42,430 805:45,430 850:46,500 900:49,500 950:52,500 1000:55,500 1100:63,520 1150:69,520"
Say if the max. freq. 850 caused problem on your N900, you may step up or down, say 805 or 900, to see if the same thing would happen again.

Similar case for min. freq., though I usually set it to 500 for OC.

In my case, 500-950 is more stable than 500-850. YMMV. :)

Load up OC profile only when need(to save your battery, to make phone app more stable, etc.). You may setup Queen's Becon Widget to load/unload OC profile on desktop.

Hope this help.

toxaris 2010-09-20 14:34
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 9000 (Post 821296)
Some time a particular freq. range doesn't work for you, consider changing to some other range.

If you look at the OC profile you selected(starving in this example, and provided that you're using titan's power kernel), you can find a list of selectable freq.:

Code:
FREQS="0:22,90 125:22,90 250:28,180 500:29,360 550:32,400 600:34,430 700:41,430 750:42,430 805:45,430 850:46,500 900:49,500 950:52,500 1000:55,500 1100:63,520 1150:69,520"
Say if the max. freq. 850 caused problem on your N900, you may step up or down, say 805 or 900, to see if the same thing would happen again.

Similar case for min. freq., though I usually set it to 500 for OC.

In my case, 500-950 is more stable than 500-850. YMMV. :)

Load up OC profile only when need(to save your battery, to make phone app more stable, etc.). You may setup Queen's Becon Widget to load/unload OC profile on desktop.

Hope this help.
Yea, I made a QB widget to set LV profile and 250-805 Mhz, now www.dn.se works fine.

But I think I shall try Starving profile too, it would be even better to save som battery.

toxaris 2010-09-21 11:35
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
BTW
What happens if I run throu QueenBecon
"sudo kernel-config load ideal;sudo kernel-config limit 250 600"

Will that result in voltage profile ideal and limit 250 to 600 mhz?

9000 2010-09-21 13:11
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by toxaris (Post 822230)
BTW
What happens if I run throu QueenBecon
"sudo kernel-config load ideal;sudo kernel-config limit 250 600"

Will that result in voltage profile ideal and limit 250 to 600 mhz?
Better use && instead of ;

Run under xterminal to make sure sudo works for u.

munkiii 2010-09-21 15:08
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renkon (Post 818918)
@munkiii:
what voltage profile you're on?
xlv, ulv, ul, ideal, default?
Ideal.

But i've noticed that image gallery thumbnails (and sometimes images) keep getting corrupted.

I wonder if this is connected to OC'ing.

gabby131 2010-09-21 15:17
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by toxaris (Post 818039)
I have found a strange behavior when OC to 850mhz.
I open up www.dn.se and navigate to almost any underpage, the browser starts to load the page and after a while after some scrolling/zooming the page reloads and the phone crashes.

This never happens if the phone is running stock clock (600mhz).
i did try opening the URL you provided on the quoted post above with all the settings, and noticeable that microB on my n900 crashes @1100MHz-1150MHz in IDEAL, ULV, XLV settings.

LV settings works fine up to 1150mhz.

Starving setting is not stable (reboots the n900) on my part so i cant make an output.

9000 2010-09-21 17:23
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gabby131 (Post 822445)
Starving setting is not stable (reboots the n900) on my part so i cant make an output.
Do you have smartreflex on?

SAABoy 2010-09-22 00:51
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 9000 (Post 822543)
Do you have smartreflex on?
What is smartflex?

9000 2010-09-22 01:23
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SAABoy (Post 822902)
What is smartflex?
smartreflex... :)

Run the following to see if they are turning on:

Code:
cat /sys/power/sr_vdd1_autocomp
cat /sys/power/sr_vdd2_autocomp
1=on, 0=off

munkiii 2010-09-29 14:51
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by 9000 (Post 822922)
smartreflex... :)

Run the following to see if they are turning on:

Code:
cat /sys/power/sr_vdd1_autocomp
cat /sys/power/sr_vdd2_autocomp
1=on, 0=off
I've just checked on mine, and both of the outputs there are 0, so Off.

What does this effect?

gabby131 2010-10-24 12:58
Re: MicroB crashes when OC
 
@9000

no.....or maybe smartreflex is on by default on starving?


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