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[Request] Guitar Amplification
Alright, so here's the deal.
Imagine hooking up your electrical guitar to your n900 and playing with distortion, reverb, and all the amp effects you want right through the speakers or earphones. That would be cool, since the solution would be portable with no amps or hardware to carry. In order to achieve this, we need to:
I'm not an expert but I think these are the basic building blocks on which we can build our argument from. Some searching on signal processing for linux gave the following interesting links:
What do you think? Possible? Any experts who can chip in? |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Really nice idea!!!
I would like to use that with my electric violin. :) I would like to help you, but no skills for that. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
There probably won't be much amplifying going on considering how low the N900 is (i mean at least not by the N900 itself, if you hook it to a speaker with builtin amplifier or a standalone amplifier box or somthing obviouslly you will get amplification)
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Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Quote:
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Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Also, what will be providing power for the guitar itself? I wouldn't expect the N900's headset plug to offer anywhere near as much juice as a regular electric guitar needs, you might need to make a custom amplifier that will give the guitar power, amplifythe signal received and convert it to the format the N900 expects (current, voltage, impedance etc)
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Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Well let's separate both microphone signal amplification and output amplification. I think the former one is the one we should focus on.
@TiagoTiago: The guitar doesn't need power. What happens is that the guitar's pickups carry the signal to the wire coming out of it, similar to a microphone that singers use. So the basic concept is amplifying the guitar signal (like you would a normal voice through the mic), and then apply some audio processing on it. I use GuitarRig [URL]http://www.native-instruments.com/[/URI] for that. And what i do is, I plug the end of my guitar to the mic input of my pc, then start up guitarrig which does what i stated above. If i want to amplify the output i simply plug my pc to a speaker box, otherwise headphones would do. I think the first step to solve this microphone amp business is to connect the guitar input to the microphone section of the 3.5 inch jack. And see if the microphone catches some guitar tones (using recoreder app for example) Won't have time to do this anytime soon due to work, uni, and some traveling but if someone wants to chip in on this it would be awsome :cool: |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
This is an absolutely awesome idea! I'd love to see this happen!
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Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
2 people showing interest
2 people showing doubts That's good! More than 360 views with only 6 posts! That's bad! :) Come on peeps can't do this on my own, anyone interested to help out? :) |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Okay some comments then. :)
I've been trying for many weeks to find a splitter for the headphone/mic input with no success - any pointers are welcome. My understanding is that the ones that are available for iPhones are a different pole order (happy to be corrected). In general the userspace applications and audio processing I have played with (mostly gstreamer) are quite laggy - this doesn't mean it's a no-go just sub-optimal. There are other audio paths to try but gst is the path of least resistance for me. Audio processing is pretty processor intense and in userspace I'm not sure if much (if anything at all) is offloaded onto the DSP. We do not currently have any of LAPSDA plugins compiled or available for arm/maemo. The gst plugins available are fine (echo, volume, panorama, filters, limiter/expander etc) but aren't the sexy ones for guitar players (crunchy distortions, hi gain, big delays etc). In short there looks to be a lot of work to do. I'd be really happy to be corrected on any of this. Still, all said and done I'm by no means ruling it out completely. Just reiterating your 4 point challenge and suggesting that we don't have any quick wins on the list as far as I can see. cheers [Edit] Forgot to add that I'd had a quick attempt to see if I could get some usb input devices working with host mode. Mixed results and all short of a resounding success. Zoom H4 enumerates but doesn't get hooked up by hid. Alesis GuuitarLink (usd to jack adc built in) gets enumerated, recognized, hooked by hid but isn't exposed as a device through gstreamer. (incidently this is already quite laggy on my desktop machine where it does work). In short the USB sode of things is great from a host mode perspective but taht's as far as it goes. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Ok I'm interested in this after seeing it on an iPad commercial, it made me realize it's use.
I'm sat in the studio at work with a set of mics, a ton of xlr cables and some 3.5mm jack converters, so I can try this right now using a mic. I'll try with recorder and post back with my results. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
the effects part probably could be achieved if someone ported puredata
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Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
I'm a guitar player and i have been dreaming this days to have an app like AmpKit (Amplifiers and effects for guitars) for the N900. I love using my Laptop with Guitar Rig or using my Amplifier but i would love having an amp with fx's here in my tablet. Please let me know if it's possible to create an app or port it!
I would help in anything! |
Re: Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
You'd need some hardware for doing a such application, and I don't think many of our open-source developers would go into production with it.
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Re: Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
Hardware? You just need an adapter dude! :cool:
And.. Well... There could be a way to port it. |
Re: Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
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Re: Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
love the thought of this but would be much more happy happy with an app like guitar pro id be exstatic with both lol
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Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
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I'm no guitar player but can see the usefulness of this. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
This would be totally awesome!!!!!!!! Im a guitar player and well i know that every single guitarrist wants to use his guitar everywhere and been carring a f*cking amplifier of 10kg or more is just ******ed lol...
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Re: Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
Imagine playing your guitar with your N900 in your pocket and recording your playing with effects... Damn i would jizz in my pants :(
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Re: Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
"Is it possible to make an app for guitars?"
Only if your guitar has a computer in it... |
Re: Is it possible to make an app for guitars?
Rofl... Is it possible to make an app for the N900 to be the amp for guitars?
Happy now? :( |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
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The iRig is a commercial product made by a large company which has spent years perfecting their DSP algorithms... With opensource the best bet would probably trying to apply LADSPA plugins in real-time and hope the delay isn't unbearable. Also the hardware is not just a plug adapter, a DI unit/buffer amplifier is required and likely powered by the mic bias voltage. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
I was looking for the same kind of application, even started a thread "guitar pedal effects". I was searching for a way to run this: http://fly.srk.fer.hr/~mvlah/fx_processor.html
source:http://linux-sound.org/ It seemed that it was the simple way for me to begin develop this kind of program. I also know that there is a lot of software and hardware for the same purpose, but I really also wanted to try running this on N900. That info about the mic voltage bias, what we need to know is wether N900 sound (hardware)driver would be able to supply current to the guitar pickups, right? |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Mmm i'm pretty sure that the n900 has nuff juice for the guitar.
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Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
I figured I'd dig up this grave since I'm curious if ExEf could be a candidate for a functional effects processor on nxx0's
It's bloody well old enough.. :D https://web.archive.org/web/20100219...//exef.xko.cz/ http://sourceforge.net/projects/exef/ rzr even did a custom deb for it ....it is possible he doesn't have it after such a long time..(mental note...should ask him) uses alsa ..ExEf as a whole seems pretty lean compared to the more recent and modern processors..I'm wondering if it can jury-rigged for us. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
To answer a couple mentions about "enough power" or "the nxx0 having enough for powering _ _ _ _" whatever...
The point of "a" pickup...or pickups is that "noise" is fed no differently than a microphone. You don't need any more additional input power... or needed power to run a pickup or pickups... just microphone in... for that matter ..I don't see why the necessity of an "input" mic port is even a need....since there isn't really an "mic" input port...but there is a natural device inbuilt mic on the nxx0. So some silicone putty and slapping your nxx0 either on the inside of the instrument or outside (on the soundbox/chamber of course...where the most vibration can be picked-up would work)..of the instrument...turning the nxx0 into an outrageously capable oyster pickup. (Personally I use dual stereophonic pickups and oysters in my harps and dulcimers..straight to one of my laptops...and use rakarrack, native, etc.... and then out through the headphone jack to either headphones for personal use ...or straight into one of my multi- effects processors and then from there straight to one of my amps) .as far as output from the nxx0 goes...output through the headphone jack on the nxx0 to "power" something like an amp...well that is just silly...how many handheld devices do you know of that power amplifiers? It doesn't "power" anything...for lack of a better term...to keep it simple...the pickup uses a very insignificant amount of juice to "transmit" the sound to an amp/ effects processor/ laptop ...whatever...transmitting yet again from that point to another after altering the sound to amplify it ...that doesn't have to be a huge consumer either...the output from the end point to be audible or stadium blasting is dependent on the power supply "from" the amp itself ...not the device "medium" (nxx0). If you wished to use the (nxx0) speakers...you'd have to jury-rig a usb mic input...or something like that with a very loooong cable to the instrument...since if you have the device in close proximity or contact with the instrument utilizing the (nxx0) onboard mic. ..and outputting to the (nxx0) onboard speakers...you are gonna get feedback...don't need that...probably end up roasting your nxx0. So yeah. there are saner options here... 1-Best option...(my fav. concept ) get an effects processor functioning on nxx0 (I would hope even through easy debian we could get ExEf running properly)...get some silicone...put a generous wad on the (nxx0) device..or a proper flexilble clamp to hold the (nxx0) device mic as close as possible to the where sound emits in greatest concentration (sound hole(s) ) in such a way as to still view and utilize the (nxx0) device screen to be able to play/ change your (nxx0) device onboard effects (ie- ExEf) on the fly. Then simply output to your headphones .. or output from the headphone port 1/8" male to 1/8" male to your mic input on computer... or utilize a couple of gold-plated 1/4" female to 1/8" male adapters http://www.ebay.ca/itm/290634585862?...84.m1436.l2649 cheap or expensive ...depends on what quality you want.. and output to your amp 2- Not-as-fun-option ....No need for an (nxx0) onboard effects processor....just use a flexible clamp or silicone putty to position the (nxx0) device mic. doesn't matter if it is easily accessible (ie- inside the soundbox or out of sight since the nxx0 is acting simply as "the" pickup ...nothing more). Then Utilize the (nxx0) device bluetooth (or other methods of transmission) straight to a laptop and utilize whatever from there...more processors tools and from there feed it through the laptops headphone jack to headphones or an amp... |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
After some mad hunting...
Most definitely there may be a better than ExEf... Like ...gtkgep.. hell you can create effects..plugins.. for it. gtk base.. the base audio requirement is soundblaster 16 which just so happens to work already...perfectly fine... for dosbox...even on the 770. The system requirements are nice and low... No impossible demands it seems... If any effects processor looks JUST perfect for our devices from the 770 on up to the n900.. with a nice looking interface that functions with our devices... that appears to have the best audio alternative for us... and all around looks like the one which is the most hassle-free in getting it working for us it's gtkgep. http://gtkgep.prv.pl/ I'm rooting through the files for it as we speak.. This program I want to definitely see on our devices.... Pitchbox is a possible (conceptually odd program) one as well...it would necessitate the use of easy debian at the least...for the jre 5 (or higher) requirements...and would be limited to perhaps just the n900 http://www.pitchtech.ch/PitchBox/index.html |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
i would avoid pitchbox because of jre requirement. i did take a quick look at exef yesterday but didn't go any further because of the tcl/tk interface. Like gtkgep, the interface would need some work to make it usable for us. Maybe a tabbed interface like pierogi or a screen full of buttons that present dialog boxes. gtkgep would probably be easier to adapt however when was it last updated?
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Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
I concur with your estimation of pitchbox's viability ...
when was gtkgep last updated? yeah...that is the million dollar question. Lotta distros used this program... seems that some still use it .... freebsd and 'buntu studio I believe do...(or did anyway..it is confusing since I have seen this for example for freebsd 8.2-released in 2013- -which is still a viable release until the year's end- and gtkgep is there in the package list http://distrowatch.com/table.php?dis...on=8.2#pkglist..)... (correction it was on a wishlist for 'buntu studio. But it was made for freebsd, arch and slack.. as well as mandriva, ROSA and ALT.. I know there are more though.) it depends ..also I have read in the same breath that it is available for freebsd 8.2 it has been abandoned due to lack of maintenance...back in 2011-ish ...so I'm finding conflicting info... I believe what is supposedly functioning and what has been abandoned are (hopefully) ports .. and nothing more... .I've mucked about with arch and slack a bit more than the rest ...for sure, I like freebsd...but it doesn't play well with any of my computers... mandriva ROSA and ALT I know very little about...Tried Rosa out ...love the set up...but boy I found it irksome to use....All in all...I cannot say I would be accomplished enough to be effective after mucking about with distros I am not comfortable with (due to lack of exposure).....all the way to distros I've never ever used... making me feel downright alien in...and I've played with some off the beaten track distros in my time...but these distros aren't my norm...or else I could test out gtkgep. I do know that ROSA 2012 release actually has the gtkgep package... http://pkgs.org/rosa-lts-2012/rosa-c...86_64.rpm.html properly maintained too...but the distro itself I had probs with...perhaps I simply need a day or two from it to mull it over... Correction again...Openmandriva also has gtkgep(gtk guitar (don't see why it won't work for any electfied instrument with proper pickups) effects processor) I don't know what was up with Rosa...couldn't wrangle it... Openmandriva I finally muddled through...weird since it pretty much IS Rosa ... Anyway... Openmandriva 2014.1 is what I have on a small hard-drive I use for distro testing and the like... in a secondary removable bay on one of my Xperimental laps. Anyway...Openmandriva 2014 has gtkgep 2013 available for it. And after running down the dependency rabbit hole on an rpm.. I am completely not familiar with...(actually I'm not familiar with rpms at all..I'm sooo ignorant ...noob central here..with my city map in hand...binoculars and camera around my neck...like a complete tourist ) Anyway...got gtkgep installed and running... but my awkwardness around rpms doesn't help... especially since I am at a loss for the proper installation/ manipulation of the plugins files ... why o why couldn't they just make a deb for cryinoutloud. But yup...it sure isn't dead... she ain't abandonware that's for sure. but I think someone more savvy than I will have to work this into our devices who knows more about such magics beyond my ken... I imagine for someone who is familiar it won't take a heartbeat to do... If this is left to me to figure out for our devices... I'm quick on the uptake and all...buuttttttt... oooh...we'll be waitin' a while. http://s26.postimg.org/h807kw1p5/29_...0_06_18_AM.png It installed without any problems. the program works... but I'm stumped getting the plugins functioning.. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Ok ...
got some help from a grand fella... Boy o boy ... [palm-smack to forehead] the reason why I couldn't get the plugins to work is... I didn't install them properly .. I did install gtkgep properly... but not the necessary libraries.. here is the real simple way of installing it on Openmandriva 2014 86_64 with the files from the previous post. as terminal as root # urpmi gtkgep and # urpmi lib64gtkgep0 if your arch is 64bit or # urpmi libgtkgep0 if it is 32bit aaaannnnd it works! http://s26.postimg.org/v5s111vh5/30_...8_20_38_AM.png halfway now to getting this on a .deb :D speaking of which... I have mucked about with this and "alien" perhaps it's me and I'm not doing something right... or there is something I've not considered... but I'm not having good luck with the "easy" way to turn this .rpm to a functioning deb. I need to mull it over while I play with the brand new toy. ok enough fun with the new effects processor. So yeah... I used the "easy" way with "alien" sure it makes the debs but there is definitely errors in the outputted dialogue flashing by ...with the headers if my vision and short-term memory isn't too skewed .. :D the debs install into a fresh lubuntu 15 64bit fine and dandy... the title shows up inthe menu under "audio and sound" but the gtkgep icon is instead a "cog" icon.. and naturally the program launches (or attempts to rather) but nothing happens. Still mulling it over... I'm thinking perhaps the "easy" way of turning this into a .deb will possibly end up becoming the "hard" way ... Hm...I'm going to try something.. back tomorrow.. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
From: https://abf.rosalinux.ru/import/gtkg...41c55cf3.patch
debian rules would be pretty straight forward. the real issue is dependencies, like gtk1 from what i've found. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
yeah...I thought it might be gtk1 being a prime factor.
Hm...what debian based distros would have no prob with old gtk1..? antiX possibly? or maybe use some old resurrected distro to pull it off? Hm..tracked down the gtk and glib for 1.2.10 ...but neither wish to play well with the latest lubuntu... meaning...resurrecting a corpse out of the distro graveyard and beating what is needed into it. or... using antiX ...they look like one of the only debian distros left that are still keeping the old gtk1 flame alive... annnnddd ... they just finished getting antiX 15 out of beta... sooo I'll be messing with that over the week and see what I shall see concerning getting gtkgep on it. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
you could try porting it to gtk2, but there's quite a few changes:
https://developer.gnome.org/gtk2/sta...anges-2-0.html etch had gtk1 so you could try those debs. no guarentees though. seen a few ppa's for ubuntu 12.xx as well. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Hm...yeah...
worst case I'll head to the mausoleum pull out a fresh one... but until then there is either antiX 15 ...even 13 could very well be successful.. also there is this... https://launchpad.net/~gabriel1984si...untu/aplicatii guys got glib1.2 and gtk+1.2 in it ... I just threw the ppa in a fresh install of 14.04 lubuntu ...but it is late here and I'm beginning to get stretched at both ends..after I hit the snort-fort I'll see what's what with this ..if it is a mirage or an oasis. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
2 Attachment(s)
Couldn't let it go.
Again the same thing... only this time I am absolutely frickin' certain ... the problem(s) isn't what we or I thought it was The output dialogue showed the same thing with the other distros. the one thing I KNOW though... I installed the readily available synaptic packages glib1.2.10 devel and gtk+1.2.10 devel which the absolutely brand spanking new antiX 15 64bit has...(I'm sure 13 has them as well). I installed alien via apt I used the two very specificly particular openmandriva gtkgep rpms ...the libraries 1st...and gtkgep second. and so made my 2 debs got the same bloody output dialogue in the doing... took the debs and threw them into gdebi. installed .. and.. absolutely nothing in the menu which even remotely resembled gtkgep.. went back to the terminal.. refused to believe it was impossible with every dep and requirement met... typed gtkgep and voila Here we go. GTKgep running fine in the latest antiX 15 as a .deb http://s26.postimg.org/dcab4zgk9/01_...2_34_36_AM.png There is a real good possibility to really make this happen for our devices. I'm tired. it's 3am. I'm going to bed. Here are the debs.. use them with antix (13 or) 15 64bit ... in synaptic enable all jessie repos then install - libglib1.2-dev then - libgtk1.2-dev then install the lib64gtkgep0 deb next followed by gtkgep deb . then as root in terminal. $ gtkgep (for those having issues getting gtkgep to start...it's simply a matter of the dsp ...) as root in terminal. $ apt-get install oss-compat $ modprobe snd-pcm-oss then $ gtkgep have fun. someone please please please finish this for the 770,n8x0 and n900 my mad mad mad need to puzzle-solve is killing me. :D |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Some help here would be appreciated...
I'm thiiiisssss close [gestures with eensy-weensy space between finger and thumb] We have [I believe] all the necessary dependecies covered...right down to "deb farm" catalogue libgtk1.2-dev and libglib1.2-dev I just can't for the life of me figure out what I'm doing wrong in turning the gtkgep rpm and libgtkgep0 rpm into armel's. I'm past stumped... either I'm doing something wrong or omitting an important something-something in the process Well ..thought I'd try something..... fired up old Bessy...(one of my n800's with turbo and easy deb squeeze) managed to get alien on it.. managed to convert the original gtkgep and libgtkgep rpms into generated i386.debs and it isn't like I don't know where to look ...but I'll be durn'd if I can find where alien dumped the generated debs for me to fiddle with... nary a Debian file anywhere... Hmmm... well after screaming and pleading at old Bessy.... finally got them into i386.debs... my brain is turning to fudge as you read this... I've muddled through this far... but this isn't really my forte.. and can't say I'll be able to wrench it into an armel.. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
i'm on holiday at the moment so nothings getting done :)
I'll write you a debian control/rules etc. when i get back to try. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
That would help a great deal Android,
I'd appreciate that. I've been mucking with the debian control ...the architecture and the dependencies but hm...it isn't turning out well for me. I'm wondering just how much harder it would be to take the best aspects of this program...and use it to just make a whole new program instead...tailored for our devices specifically... less of a headache? more of a headache? |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
without source i can't say. it would remove gtk1. if its only audio parts we need, i'm sure a new ui around them would be doable.
coming home tomorrow so should be able to have a proper look sunday or one evening in the week. might take a look at building marxians latest hildon-components for thumb tonight if he hasn't put up a build yet. depends on time how much downtime i have tonight. |
Re: [Request] Guitar Amplification
Hm..
I'll put up the folder in my cloud with all the variants... including the source variants I've collected .. and pm you the link... it'll save some small amount of time instead of hunting stuff down... |
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