Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

I ask this question because I really don't know the reason. As I know, maemo is more open than Android. E.g. we can develop C/C++ program on it instead of only Java on Android (Am I right?).
So could anyone give me the real reason? Commercial factor or pure technical factor?
Someone told me that is because maemo can be only used in Nokia device/phone, like N810 and N900. And Android can be ported to many phones, but why?
Thanks!

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Personally, I just think it's because it's backed by Google.

Google to the current generation is what window was to my generation, it's all they know...Google this, Google that...so as soon as a phone was realised that was backed by Google, everyone jumped at it...

This is just my opinion, 99% of the people using it don't care about its open-ness, all they know is Android is backed by Google!

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Because Google actually care (or just want increased profits).

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Google is powerful and cool company

AND Nokia have been doing strange(stupid?) movements in the last years, for many people Nokia was synonym of quality, standards(chargers,batteries),..

Nokia could sell more devices to technical people or supporters of free software with a cheaper price, however N900 is too expensive and its not very popular in the streets.

Why not a cheaper maemo device?
Why they sold notebooks with windows instead of maemo/linux+QT?

Nokia have the technology, staff, etc to fight face to face with apple or android, but they are fighting with Samsung and Motorola.... (no comments)

I think their biggest problem come from the top of the company, and their bad decisions

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Because Maemo 5 is on like 1 device that's still sold on the market and Android is on a ton? Also Android is a *bit* more polished? Also it's kind of a silly question.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

How about this question? Can maemo be easily ported to other phones? I saw that Android could run in N900.
What blocks maemo to be ported to other devices?

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

It's pretty obvious nokia doesn't know where it wants to go as a company. maemo 5 is unsupported, they've announced they won't make new versions of symbian, and they're taking a gamble on meego. They are lost and instead of supporting their products to give their customers confidence to win their trust, they announce new stuff all the time. That's not the case with google.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Maemo 5 was never meant to be popular and mainstream, That was meant to be Maemo 6 but will now be MeeGo

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

1. A single device versus dozens.
2. Work in progress UI versus polished user interface
3. hundreds of apps versus thousands of apps
4. Open market phone versus Carrier subsidized.
5. No new devices in 18 months versus new devices every month.

Maemo / Meego has a tough road to go. I hope they succeed. I'll back them because the openness of the platform is worth the drawbacks so far.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

NvyUs has hit the nail on the head so to speak.

Maemo was step 4 in a 5 step plan, or 5 in a six step plan, i can never remember which...
But in thory it was building up to harmatten and now MeeGo... Since the structure of nokia has changed, no-one knows how this may affect the path. But it doesnt change the fact Maemo was a specialist project and more likely a learning curve.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

they have not announced there will be no new versions of symbian.
what they announced was they have dropped Symbian^3 and Symbian^4 names etc.
Symbian will still be enhanced and have its UI developed just that you dont have to wait for new versions of symbian for certain features from the road map b/c it will be a continuous development process Starting with recent S^3 devices.
which is a better model b/c you can buy a device now and be guaranteed to get all future upgrades made to the platform.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Maemo is not licensed. An OS can't be popular if it only can be used on a few Nokia devices, most of which are no longer competitive.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Just for starters, there is only one GSM/phone (computer with phone capabilities) running Maemo out there in the wilderness! Maemo was not to be distributed to other manufacturers. If Maemo had been available to other manufacturers it would have been more popular... if more than android we never get to know. Maemo was a niche OS back at N770 so were the devices even N900. A change in marketing and development was not to become true as it was meant to be learning stages till Maemo6 or now Meego/Harmattan. Nokia did waste more money on research as any other.. if it was a waste? To give up Maemo for Meego was a good step forward you might think! If it really was, the future will tell only. If and only if Meego will become a successful distribution, it will rule the consumer market in about 3 years like no other.

Successful in this case means, if all the companies having their money in game now decide to stay there and keep the one-system-to-rule-them-all strategy up. It wont help anybody if BMW's Meego for ICE is getting closed down to BMW only, without any capabilities to sync with your Meego phone or netbook OTG. We will see what happens next in about 5 month.

(Sometimes I'd love to have a "Rubbish!" button next to "Thanks!")

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

I would also like to argue that Maemo is no more open with its open-source than Android. MeeGo, on the other hand, will hopefully end up being a different story. But that's not addressing why Android is far more popular. As others have pointed out, and I agree, Maemo runs on only one "current" device (which isn't even very current at all anymore and about to be replaced with a whole new device with a whole new OS--leaving everyone to be supported by a half-or-less open OS by the community) while Android is actively being developed, supported and run on a plethora of handsets, tablets and even netbook/desktop devices with no shortage of customizations, kernels and updates to keep even older hardware fresh for those who care to maintain things themselves. Nokia really didn't treat their customers very well, either, even as the single vendor--so people who HAD been customers of the 770/N8x0 devices were far more wary with the N900. I'm sure that counted for something, too. As a phone, the N900 seems to be crippled and performs terribly--but then Maemo was never intended to be a phone OS, and Nokia ended up shoe-horning it into one.

Effectively: Memo sucks as a phone OS, Android shines with this respect. Maemo has no polish, lack of popular applications, effectively no support, open-core (not open-source, thereby lacking a community of support/upgrades, even less so than Android) and an appalling history of abusing its customer base (abandoning support for the N810 and N810WE less than a year out!!!) and a refusal to provide openness/fixes for software that even only belonged to Nokia (i.e. calendar, media player, etc.). Android platform, by comparison, "just works" for most people and keeps getting updates and patches for all the critical apps, despite the OS version (Google Maps, for example, gets updates even if you're still only on 1.6 or 2.2 alike).. when was the last time Wayfinder or Ovi maps for Maemo got updates, fixes and new features? It's just a far better customer experience on Android.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Man it's simple as hell:

First, in maemo if you wish to install an application, then there are no "fart" application in every recomendation/suggestion list like here:

http://mobilarena.hu/dl/cnt/2010-12/...tab-update.jpg



Second: N900 is the only and ONE device available for the mass-market. So if you want to buy a maemo device, you can choose from one, witch is also a high-end device (and therefore expensive too), one design, one etc., one etc...

While if you want to buy an android device, you can choose from various devices starting from 10€ up to 1.000.000€, mid-range, high-range, lot of design, lot of available colour, and so on and so on.

90% of the customers do not gives a s..t about the hardware or the software, they just goes for the design (like: OMGF that phone is pink i wanna it! or: OMG this phone is full-metal i wanna it!) and merges how much money they can waste to the phone, and that's all.

And it's not because "android". 85% of the customers don't give a s..t if android runs on the device or or maemo or hubaluka OS.

So shortly: 1 device vs. hundred of devices. That's why N900 and maemo not popular.


I tried to be damn simple. :cool:

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Also pub marketting was inexistant for N900, if it was the same case as what they are doing now for the N8, things would be differents, but it was apparently not what they were looking for...

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Price is the single most important factor when Mr Joe Average chooses a mobile phone. Android and Symbian are available on devices throughout the price spectrum. Maemo is not.

Simples. ;)

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

I'm loving the n900.
And I'm loving maemo.

Now I've seen dbus-scripts even more!

With little scripts in Python, Perl, Shell or Dbus you can do nearly everything practical task with very low efford.

With apt-get you are open to the debian world of professional tools (not like android tools, who are like toys).

I use my n900 tablet phone daily
- as my phone
- for emails
- for sms (not daily)
- as browser
- as remote for the TV
- to control vlc on another computer
- to test little programmimg tasks
- for my bible lecture, my prayer and the holy mass
- as contact list
- as list for daily task

I sometimes use it
- for painting
- as music player
- as webradio
- to look webTV
- as ebook reader or for pdf files
- to take photos (Christmas-light photos get very beautiful with "lowlight")

It is perfect for youtube (except flash 10.1)

I like the design and the main applications, which are kept simple but inside they are very powerful.


There are some closed applications. But they can easily be extended by open ones.

The problems are not the applications but the missing will of Nokia to bring them up to date by their programmers.

Nokia is giving away a jewel with maemo.
Maemo is a little, round and beautiful system.
Very practical and efficient.

That's why Nokia will never have success:
They don't take care what they have.
Instead of new things they should support what they have.




(PS.: Now my mother has given to me an iPod nano 6th generation. When my bracelet will be arrived I will use it as my watch. The n900 sends information about sms, email and phone to the iPod display by rds. I've tested it already and it works, Through the radio the iPod can play webradio sent by the n900.

It would be up to nokia to produce such bracelet devices specialised for their own phones. Are they sleeping?)

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

There were a couple of chinese devices that used maemo. But I believe some of the maemo 5 UI is a closed source module, so i don't know if it can be used by others.

Nokia's biggest problem is that it is moving way to slowly in the high-end smartphone segment. The N900 is a lovely hackable geek toy, that is really innovative in a lot of ways. But is is also very much "out of date" to be a high-end smartphone.
High-end smartphone users currently expect a capacitive touch screen with a fully touch based UI, a slim design, and a fast an vibrant application store. The n900 doesn't have these things or they are very much in beta.

Android is evolving at a really fast pace. the latest 2.3 now also supports SIP calling as a integrated service if I'm not mistaking (something that was unique to Maemo 5 up to this point).

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

hmmm my old symbian phone has settings for SIP (Nokia e51). I´m not sure if we are talking about same thing here.

.edit
Yep. Integrated SIP
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_E51
Probably not even first Nokia Phone with that :) With Nokia it´s bit same as Opera user. You see "new" stuff re-invented on other browsers and you just keep on thinking...WTF I have been using that feature for years...hmmmm.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

True, I also had a E60 with integrated SIP. I had a very bad experience with that. It was unstable and didn't work that well for me. So I mostly used the client on the N800. Also the N900 integrates other VoIP services like skype. But it is true that S60 may have been earlier (don't know if Maemo on N800 or S60 was first). Later nokia removed the SIP integration in the S60 phones, don't know if they enabled it again in phones like n8

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

What about iphone, this the only phone with iOS and is popular.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

This is the only correct answer. There was 0, none, nada, nothing, marketing for the N900. Not in a movie, not in a ad, NOTHING.

Therfore it failed.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Heh. I've just ordered an n900, to replace my aging first-generation iPhone. While four years old now, and starting to show signs that the (non-replaceable) battery can no longer hold a full charge, my iPhone does have a capacitive touch screen with a fully touch based UI, a slim design, and a fast and vibrant application store.

It sounds to me like you're describing not what "High-end smartphone users" currently expect, but rather what "High-end iPhone users" currently expect. Steve Jobs pretty much created his own concept of what a phone should be, and so now most of the industry falls over itself trying to create iPhone clones. Which, hey, I'm not going to argue with, as it has been kinda like a license for Apple to print money, but I'd really like to see some fresh new ideas out there.

Android is an iPhone clone -- it does just what the iPhone does in just the same way that the iPhone does it. People who like the iPhone will like Android, and since so many people like the iPhone, there are many people who like Android. That's all there is to it.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

That is why I like the N900 so much, it isn't an iPhone clone. Not that I dislike iPhone, i don't (that is the phone I usually recommend people buy). But that was the first i noticed when i played with the N900 at the maemo summit: it does things differently.
But it must be said that Apple was the first to get a touch interface right. Also Apple was to first to get an application download store to the masses.
Just like the mouse/window revolution in desktop PC, so also is the touch interface design of the iPhone a new standard.
It doesn't make more traditional stylus or keyboard interfaces useless, but for most people the touch interface is the way to interact with a smartphone.

I haven't used Android (or webOS) much but i don't agree that they are "just iPhone clones" they do innovate, just like Maemo and Symbian. Homescreen widgets for example are useful and I think you will also see a similar idea on iOS in the future, same goes for uPnP AV, but both were also on maemo for the N800 (and Symbian?) before Android.

I also like the appearance and the xbox arcade integration of Windows Phone 7. Even microsoft is trying new things!
All players are innovating, and the best ideas will be copied and eventually found on all platforms in some way or another.
That is the beauty of the smartphone market. A lot of innovation

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

No I think he is describing what most high end users want. Not all (as you prove but most - as the sales of iphone and android have shown - and Nokia have recognised with the N8). Have you seen how slim the high end android devices are? Even the Desire Z and Samsung Epic which have keyboards are still model skinny next to the N900. Barely any female would give the N900 a second glance with how thick it is and many males would dismiss it on looks alone.

As for the resistive screen issue, sorry but no device is going to have mass market sales with that type of screen. Most people want the ease of use of capacitive and stylus is something for geeks, again not the mass market. Again Nokia has recognised this (with the N8, N9, etc).

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

You may find this interesting to read:
Google’s Andy Rubin Gives a Flash of Tablet Future

Andy Rubin has been in contact with Stpehen Elop "about something":
IMO, advantages in both:

Android: Dalvik is good as a higher intelligent interpreted statically typed language platform, which Meego and Maemo lags. The future likely is with these kind of platforms when there is multiple cores and lots of RAM memory available.

Meego: Oppenes and more Linux-like. You can do more or much about anything with the hardware.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Dalvik is a huge case of NIH that doesn't add a whole lot except break compatibility with everything that exists in the open source world and sticks you with what Google provides.

Dodges the entire Google dependency and provides no less capability than a VM. You also expand the developer base and effort that feeds into your OS by not consolidating all development in one location.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Guys, the real reason is for the DRM

No company is going to develop anything if the OS don't allow DRM. Google is not reason, all the devices have android because the companys trust to develop their games and apps with DRM in that OS.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

I am 101% sure that it is because of naming:

Who the FREAK! wants to buy a device called Nokia N900 powered by Maemo 5 (Step 4of5)??

I much prefer HTC Desire HD with Android Froyo.
<sarcasm/>

Its like Nokia loves to list the protocols the phone has but not what you can do with it (to be fair they have this new "its not technology its what you do with it" theme)

But seriously now, who the heck is the one responsible for naming conventions at Nokia?! They had the opportunity to start everything from scratch with a clean cool name and what do they do? Name it MeeGo. Why Nokia? Why do you hate your operating systems so much?

Oh my bejesus...

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

While N900 Maemo fits a whole lot of people that know exactly what they want (and also where they can't get it right now),

Android fits all users that don't know yet what they want..

They can go app zapping..a download every 15 minutes..Look :Skype, look: SIP, Look: 100K games..

The users can change hardware edition every few months and think a new world will open.

Google is now cashing based on the boredom of the new generation of smart phone users .

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Not sure where you got that Nokia are not developing Symbian anymore, becuase the have stated that Symbian is there main OS, what they are not doing anymore is to have different verions of it.

From now on its just Symbian in Qt all the way, which is good news for Maemo.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

The N900 was never intended to be a mainstream device, that's why there was no marketing for it. Sales for the N900 far exceeded Nokia's expectations, so from Nokia's point of view the N900 was a success.

And more on topic, a point no-one else has brought up is, Maemo was a Nokia project, even if it is open source (and some key parts aren't e.g. the Phone app and the Messaging app), that Maemo was developed and controlled by Nokia was a deterrent to other phone manufacturers making use of it. This is why the merger of Maemo and Moblin to create Meego and more importantly handing Meego to the Linux Foundation to develop was necessary, so other manufacturers don't have to worry about being dependent on something made by one of their competitors. With Android, there was never an issue of phone manufacturer's using a product made by one of their competitors.

Also read this for some insight to why Maemo hasn't been given enough attention by Nokia.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

One interesting Android 3 video, don't know if it is posted, so I'm not opening a new thread:
http://www.crunchgear.com/2010/12/07...h-android-3-0/

Ah, I see now its already posted in the Samsung Galaxy Tab thread. Anyway :)

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

I thought Android was developed and controlled by Google, a potential competitor? On the other hand, you could argue that it was the Android handset alliance that helped Android really take off. MeeGo may be trying to replicate that same alliance effort, but it might be too late to the game.

Nokia could have been a contender! Instead, it got sloppy and confused. Better late than never, I suppose? Any bets that Nokia might take a good open-source MeeGo move and pervert it up with baked-in lockware (the way they made you depend on closed-source to run a usable OS with Maemo so far) and lots of proprietary crapware and shortcuts (ala RealPlayer/Gizmo/etc install shortcuts you can't easily remove without using root access) like they did with Maemo? So much for pounding your chest about how you don't have to 'root' your device to make it look or work the way you want it to. At that point, what's the difference between MeeGo and Android, if Nokia does that to their device image? More importantly, what's the advantage to the average customer?

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Honestly, I just don't see the difference. Apple did the thing Jobs has always been good at doing: integrating a handful of different technologies into a single device, and wrapping them up within a shiny, pretty unified container for the consumer to use. In short, he's turned the smartphone into a toaster.

And since then, everybody wants to make toasters. Smartphones are getting no smarter! Simpler, prettier, yes -- cute little widgets on the homescreen are our new innovations. But the whole point behind Android was to do _exactly_ what Apple did; hide all the technology of a smart phone behind a gaudy interface, and entice the user to buy lots of tiny colorful apps to perform lots of tiny colorful functions for him.

I just don't see any real difference between my four-year-old iPhone and the latest offerings from Apple or Google or whoever. The n900 is the closest thing I've found to a phone manufacturer willing to try something different.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

I see. Is this what the smartphone market has come to? By the above criteria, my four year old first-gen iPhone is superior to the n900. Heck, a dumb phone would be superior to the n900. Who cares what the phone actually does, so long as it looks good doing it... :)

Yeah, I understand what you're saying, I'm just saying that the whole concept of a "smartphone" seems to have morphed ever since Jobs jumped into the market. It is no longer a "phone + pda", but more of a "phone + tv". You don't use a smartphone to get work done any more, you use a smartphone to become a couch potato. I just find this whole shift kind of irritating. I must be getting old...

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Yeah, but there is a difference between potential competitor and an actual competitor (and especially a competitor that makes more mobiles than any other company), and Google aren't really in the business of making phones. Well, at least they weren't, I see Google has just announced a new phone, I don't know how this will change the way phone manufacturers see Google, but Google have established the Android brand now, and it will be hard for phone manufacturers not to carry on selling Android phones.

Meego is definitely late to the game, and that will make it hard to gain traction, but if Nokia does really get behind it and pushes a good implementation of it (i.e. not full of bugs) on a number of their mainstream phones, that could help Meego break into the market as a viable phone OS. I think it is too early to say whether Meego really is too late or not.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

Maybe someone already said this, but whatever, I am too lazy to read everything.
Maybe all, and if not all, a great deal of android phones has capacitive ( froyo capable devices ) screens, and are designed for gaming or so.
If not, why a multi touch screen? only for a zoom in images.
Anyway, that's not the point.
Maemo was not for that originally, although we have a great video chip.
Many people expects a psp with phone capabilities, not a N900.
You can see this for example when you look for a phone on youtube,
apart from comercials, reviews and unboxing videos, you will find 70% of gaming examples...
The great problem of all manufacturers is that they don't see what makes iphone a sucess for example.
We have ( for nowadays more or less ) N8, N900 and soon N9.
Why so much if we could have all in one, open source, multitouch, hell to go device?
Developers would be able to spend tim in one device, instead of changing them from month to month, even though I don't love Steve Jobs, he actually wins at this point.

Re: Why maemo is not as popular as Android?
 

It is not user friendly, and doesn't have much apps backing it up.