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-   -   N900 TV Out as secondary display? (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=69489)

qole 2011-02-08 04:38
N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Hi All,

I just purchased a little adapter that converts composite out to VGA, and I began to wonder what exactly the TV Out of the N900 is displaying.

Is it simply a hardware thing, it shows whatever is on the internal display, no matter what? Or is it display :1 or some other user-modifiable output?

The fact that Maemo can display something different on the TV when you're watching video suggests that you can use the TV Out as a secondary display.

If you can throw something else up there, I of course want to be able to throw a secondary X display onto it.

Any ideas?

woody14619 2011-02-08 05:00
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
I'm betting it is. Try this: Do a video playback, then send a text message (or something that activates a yellow "swoop in" message). You'll see the message on the device screen, but NOT on the video output. That implies to me they're two separate things. (Or one doesn't support a layer the other does?)

qole 2011-02-08 05:02
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Yes, if it is just some kind of raw video overlay, it isn't very interesting (unless there's some hackish way to put a second display on that overlay ;))

Joseph.skb 2011-02-08 05:06
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
I think it's only suitable for what the sales pack says "Video sharing and playback".
TV out (PAL and NTSC) with Nokia Video Connectivity Cable (CA-75U)

Can't imagine working on the N900 and a secondary display like I do on laptops. Also, a mouse/pointer would be necessary. And the hassle to work and manage calls with a wire to the monitor would be troublesome.

sulu 2011-02-08 09:54
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
In my early N900-days when I played with the TV cable and my TV I got a call just when I had my N900 screen on the TV. Usually the screen should turn off during a call but the TV screen didn't turn black.
Additionally the output can be switched between PAL and NTSC and both produce slightly different images on the TV screen (my TV can handle both).

So I'm pretty sure that the TV out is handled seperately. But the question remains if the GPU can handle more than one display. I can't check right now, do you see any useful output in Easy Debian when you connect your N900 to the TV and issue the following in a Debian terminal:
Code:
xrandr -q --verbose

WhiteWolf 2011-02-08 10:07
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
I have one of these devices to use the N900 on monitors.

Using it as a 2 nd monitor should be possible, since mplayer used "xinerama" and you can see a video output to the TV and see the emails in the N900 screen.

I hope you get to make it possible for any application.

One idea is to use the media player controls on the screen of the N900 and the movie on the TV output.

sulu 2011-02-08 22:07
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
i just checked xrandr and this is what i got from maemo using xrandr from easy debian:
Code:
Screen 0: minimum 480 x 480, current 800 x 480, maximum 800 x 800
LCD connected 800x480+0+0 (0x3e) normal (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 0mm x 0mm
        Identifier: 0x3d
        Timestamp:  10839
        Subpixel:  unknown
        Clones:   
        CRTC:      0
        CRTCs:      0
        Transform:  1.000000 0.000000 0.000000
                    0.000000 1.000000 0.000000
                    0.000000 0.000000 1.000000
                  filter:
        SignalFormat:        LVDS
        ConnectorType:        Panel
  800x480 (0x3e)  24.0MHz -HSync -VSync -CSync *current +preferred
        h: width  800 start  824 end  828 total  856 skew    0 clock  28.0KHz
        v: height  480 start  484 end  487 total  490          clock  57.2Hz
so it seems like there is only one screen detected which has a maximum resolution of 800x800.
i have no explanation for the xinerama/mplayer thing.

Edit:
Just for clarification, this was the output when my TV was connected, but it's the same when the TV is not connected.

qole 2011-02-08 23:10
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
As far as I understand, xinerama is used to stretch a single work area across two X displays; why is that used to display the video overlay on a second display?

I had an nVidia graphics card that had this same feature. You could have it display just the video on the second display. But it also could be configured to use the two displays as one big work area (xinerama).

anidel 2011-02-09 20:56
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
As this old HowTo says:

Quote:
"TV-out is an area that is neglected by the XFree86 developers, mostly leaving it up to third parties to provide extra drivers etc."
BUT MythTV has a bit more info:

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/XorgConfMonitorSectionForTV

qole 2011-02-09 21:02
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Oooh, you think it could be that easy?
EDIT: I don't think it is that easy (just adding a Monitor section to an xorg.conf file)

sjgadsby 2011-02-09 21:42
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by qole (Post 938646)
The fact that Maemo can display something different on the TV when you're watching video suggests that you can use the TV Out as a secondary display.
I think pushing video to the composite out while keeping playback controls on the LCD works because only the control screen is RGB. I'm fairly certain I've read the OMAP3 is limited to mirroring for RGB and independent displays for RGB + YUV. Digging into docs and discussion on the BeagleBoard would probably be the quickest way of confirming or denying that.

I remember Lcuk attempting dual, independent displays with his code since liqbase is all YUV. You might try pinging him. I don't know what success he had.

anidel 2011-02-09 22:03
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Me neither, but it could be a starting point...

qole 2011-02-09 22:05
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Yeah I have a feeling that the independent TV Out display is an XV overlay. I'm getting the distinct impression that a second desktop isn't possible.

qole 2011-02-10 05:08
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Confirmation that we're talking about an XV overlay here:

Code:
[user@deb-m5v3b: /]xvinfo
X-Video Extension version 2.2
screen #0
  Adaptor #0: "OMAP Video Overlay"
    number of ports: 2
    port base: 56
    operations supported: PutImage
    supported visuals:
      depth 16, visualID 0x21
    number of attributes: 10
      "XV_OMAP_VSYNC" (range 0 to 2)
(snip)
Code:
      "XV_OMAP_CLONE_TO_TVOUT" (range 0 to 1)
              client settable attribute
              client gettable attribute (current value is 0)
      "XV_OMAP_TVOUT_STANDARD" (range 0 to 1)
              client settable attribute
              client gettable attribute (current value is 1)
      "XV_OMAP_TVOUT_WIDESCREEN" (range 0 to 1)
              client settable attribute
              client gettable attribute (current value is 0)
      "XV_OMAP_TVOUT_SCALE" (range 1 to 100)
              client settable attribute
              client gettable attribute (current value is 90)
      "XV_OMAP_OVERLAY_ACTIVE" (range 0 to 1)
              client gettable attribute (current value is 0)
    maximum XvImage size: 864 x 648
    Number of image formats: 6
      id: 0x32595559 (YUY2)
        guid: 59555932-0000-0010-8000-00aa00389b71
        bits per pixel: 16
        number of planes: 1
        type: YUV (packed)
(snip)

qole 2011-02-10 05:16
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Hmm, are there any window managers that will run on a specific XV plane?

Tensuke 2011-02-10 07:02
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Afaik, the Pandora has composite TV-Out and can display something different on the second screen than on the built-in LCD. Of course I don't know how it's tv-out hardware differs from the N900's.

Temporal 2011-02-10 07:04
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Hi qole, sorry if I'm bothering.

First of all, I don't know if I understood your question. I just know that I bought about 3 months ago the SAME thing for the EXACT same reason (except that i got mine from ebay for $23). Since then, I've been experimenting the TV out, and one of the big "pointers" I got from this thread:
http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=461660&postcount=9

And then by tinkering with it, I discovered that this works only with the "tv-out" display, not with the "main" display or anything, so I, for instance, have to do something like this (while PAL is selected in the settings - and will owrk only once for that reason - I have to change back to pal to try another resolution that will work):
"echo ntsc > /sys/devices/platform/omapdss/display1/timings & echo 59,30 > /sys/devices/platform/omapdss/overlay2/position & echo 640,500 > /sys/devices/platform/omapdss/overlay2/output_size"
While the film is running (like in Kmplayer and SiB or Mplayer or Any player that plays while in the background) to make the screen resize.
I was also trying to work on how to crop and resize at the same time, but no luck till now (actually I didn't try until now).

And then I've seen this thread:
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=68294

AND this tip (that I didn't even try yet):
http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=68294

And that's all my "knowledge" about the TV out. I hope I could have helped someone.

Bye!

Carlito 2011-03-07 14:57
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Is it possible to turn the tv screen into black when connected? When I lock the phone the tv is not turning black. Want to use it as musicplayer at home, but I don't want to display anything on the tv.

Keneraali 2011-03-07 15:04
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Unplug the yellow cable from the TV.

sulu 2011-03-07 15:06
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Or start some application that shows a black screen (e.g. black image in full screen).

fraaaaanka 2011-03-07 15:13
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keneraali (Post 962524)
Unplug the yellow cable from the TV.
lol, pmsl & roflmao

Carlito 2011-03-07 15:26
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keneraali (Post 962524)
Unplug the yellow cable from the TV.
Thought this was a forum with some smart people. Don't need dumbass answers.

Just have to lock the phone and the screen has to turn black.

Show a black image seems to be a solution but not what I'm looking for. It's not possible to just show a black screen without touching cables etc.?

siersciaty 2011-08-07 14:09
Re: N900 TV Out as secondary display?
 
1. Carlito, if I understand well, you just want to stream sound to your TV. So unplugging the yellow cable is not the bad idea.
Do you want to use the TV as the display or not? You need the TV, when you change the song? Then that idea becomes worse ;]

2. So, can anyone tell exactly: is there any possibility to use the N900 and TV as two displays, or not?
I would love to stream GPS (Sygic for instance) to the TV (7" display with Video socket on the dashboard, under the windscreen), and show the music player[or e.g. some games for the passenger] on N900's display (to control the music easily).


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