770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Hello all!! If I missed it somehow in my searching, I apologize, but is the 770 able to use cards based on the SD standard (i.e. miniSD and microSD cards)? I've had devices in the past running Linux that could only use MMC, but that was due to the lack of SD drivers, not because of the hardware. So, is there such a hardware limitation for the 770 for it to use only RS-MMC (& not miniSD), or was it a software limitation that has now been resolved due to an updated kernel (allowing for use of miniSD)?

After having the N800 for less than three weeks, I just couldn't pass on woot's deal today. :)

EDIT: & I wasn't sure if I should put this in the Newbie or 770 forum, but I'm still a newb on ITT & to the ITs, so...

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

The key point is 'rs' [reduced size]. They are the only ones that fit and allow the door to close [which turns on the slot].

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

I was going to clarify that, but I thought maybe I wouldn't need to. I realize the size difference between RS-MMC and SD. I'm asking about miniSD and microSD in the 770. When I referred to the SD standard, I meant it in the sense that miniSD and microSD are essentially smaller SD cards.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

How would you fit either into a 770? Could you clarify that?

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Oh, my mistake...I had thought that RS-MMCs were the "MMC equivalent" of miniSDs, like MMC is the same size as SD. I have now seen the light. RS-MMCs are a completely different form factor. It's disappointing, though; I thought it would be more interchangeable...oh well. Thanks for your responses and for pointing out that I didn't realize what I was asking. :p

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

They aren't completely different -- when the [included] dummy extender is attached to the back end of the rs card, it becomes the same size as an sd card, allowing it to be inserted and removed in a standard sd reader -- but only in its short form will it fit inside the 770 and allow the door to close. And while I suppose at least a micro sd is small enough to fit inside a half-length 'rs adapter', I don't know of anyone making such an adapter [but I'd be happy to learn otherwise].

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Yes, I knew that much before...I just thought that RS-MMC and miniSD were the same form factor, like MMC and SD are.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

While I know that the pins on rs mmc and mini/microSD are completly different - what about it working with the rest of the SD card sticking out? Does the door *have* to be closed?

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Yes, the door has to be closed -- unless you want to figure out and monkey with whatever hardware [magnetic, optical, mechanical] is used to detect that the little plastic lever/door is swung into the closed position.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

yes with default kernel, no with custom one and mounting by hand. But it will not work with SD card as it is thicker then MMC and won't fit. Works with 4GB MMCplus card though. could work with SD one in theory if you could made the card thinner somehow

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Gentlemen, whip your Dremels out. :D (Hey! who messed up all the smileys!?)

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

what is a 4GB MMCplus card is it the same size as a RS-MMC, if so why am i messing with a 2gb card then

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

RS-MMC and MMCmobile are both roughly half the size of MMC and MMCplus. The extra metal parts you see are just mechanical adapters.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Although I can't seem to find a microSD to RS-MMC adapter readily available, after lots of searching, I've learned the following things:

1. All SD cards (including microSD and miniSD) are required to be backwards compatible to the original MMC protocol.

2. The dimensions (Width x Height x Thickness) of an RS-MMC/MMCMobile card are 24mm x 18mm x 1.4mm.

3. The dimensions of a microSD card are 11mm x 15mm x 1mm.

4. Noting #1-3 above, it is feasible that a microSD to RS-MMC adapter device could be made. MiniSD is too long and thick to be used. (20mm x 21.5mm x 1.4mm)

5. Any card above 2gb would require kernel modifications to accommodate the increase in size. Similar modifications have been performed on other embedded platforms that were limited to using MMC mode with SD cards (OpenWRT-compatible devices for example).

Anyhow, heres hoping my findings can be the start of getting a 4+gb flash card for the 770.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

No. SD cards do not support MMC mode. Both MMC and SD has common ancestor which is SPI. And Wikipedia says "All memory cards must support all three modes, except for microSD where SPI is optional." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital_card

But anyway this does not matter since SD mode has 1 bit mode too so it can in theory run in MMC slot in N770 (6 wires) in SD mode so SPI mode support is not needed.

N770 kernel has even optional support for 4 bit mode (if bootloader tells it that the device can do it) so maybe there are newer N770 devices in the wild which do support 4 bit mode i.e. have all pins in the connector which are needed for faster 4bit SD (and MMC) mode. My N770 (november 2005) has only 6 metal pads in the slot so it definitely can't do 4 bit mode.

Can anyone with really new N770 device say if you have more metal pads in the slot (8 or 9)? It may be that such device did not ship at all, there are other things in kernel targeted for devices that never shipped so this wouldn't be surprising.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

6 pads on my new one from woot deal.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

fanoush-

I count 8 pins in mine (from the woot sale) There are two pairs that are very close to one another and the rest are evenly spaced- i'll try and draw a little diagram.

From the end of the unit to the middle this is their layout (screen facing down)

|_|_|_||_||_| headphones USB pwr

Hope this helps.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Thanks robbh66, are you sure there are metal plates in all 8 or 9 positions? Can you post /proc/component_version (hw-build)? Also photo would be nice :-) And then (if you really have more pins) speed test with some fast mmcmobile card (kingston 2GB) would be interesting
both with default kernel and with mmcplus enhanced one.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

a micro SD adaptor would be so cool :) since my 8525 and my Slvr L7 both use them and I got like 3 laying around, imaging if there was an adaptor to plug in two micro sd cards into a rs mmc adaptor. :D that way you could have one card for just booting and one to hold movies or music

Dreaming is nice

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

I'm a newbie 770'er.
Looks like ELPH was about right.

RS-MMC and MMC Mobile are compatible. MMC Mobile appears to be faster.
Any 770 user should check this out.......

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820134119

Check user reviews.

Mine's coming Friday! ;-)

Newbie question.......
What's the easiest way to access the finger keyboard?

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Yes, MMC Mobile is faster than RS MMC - MMC Mobile allows the 770 to transfer more bits of data at a time (I think up to 4 bits per transfer whereas RS-MMC is only 1-bit at a time).

If the finger keyboard doesn't appear automatically, try pressing the center of the d-pad when you are in the virtual keyboard. There are some settings you can tweak in Control Panel which can adjust sensitivity and behaviour of the centre d-pad button.

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

Dunno what you guys are talking about Full size SD card worked fine in my n770 first time I plugged it in ;):

http://linuxjunk.blogspot.com/2007/0...d-sd-card.html

Re: 770 and miniSD or microSD?
 

hehehehe..that's awesome!! I finally have a reason to be glad I started this thread :D