Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I've been a close follower of this community for sometime now and it's really a great one. One thing that bugs me though, is the amount of trash sometimes posted here. Take this thread for instance.

If you've had enough of this "brick" of a phone, sell it or dispose it off and get what suits your needs. No need to bash it on TMO and then ask users of that phone to recommend a new one for you. Doesn't make sense from where I come from.

This is an appeal people. If you have a problem or suggestion, ask here. If not, go to the right forum. Let's please stop dirtying TMO.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

i think people who read this thread and agree with you, aren't the ones who trash tmo so good luck with that.

btw: i totally agree with you!

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

It's ironic, that restricting discussion of competition or different viewpoints is considered 'keeping the forum clean' considering the following: if you look closely, what you are requesting is not the nature of openness, rather something a little closer to a walled-garden. It seems that openness is a obvious characteristic for Maemo devices, but not Maemo users.

This discussion-descent of Maemo, is general feedback to the performance of the OS in the public market. It should not be looked on with scorn, but as powerful analysis of things that need repair if there is hope to grow this product beyond a niche. Clearly it has not been seen as such and ignorant rejection of said feedback has been instrumental in the demise of Maemo and the uncertain future of Meego.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

"...and they make my N900 look obsolete...."

That's an empty statement IMHO without any elaboration as to what he means by looking obsolete. As per my understanding, the phone is not obsolete because of his judgement and knowledge but because his friends have Androids and thus the N900 is obsolete.

How is that a [useful] feedback?

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

To the newer users:

Once upon a time, this forum was called ITT. InternetTabletTalk.

Don't believe me? Try it out.
Go to http://www.internettablettalk.com/forums/ and see where that leads you to.

Funny how things seem to get more and more closed and exclusive (in a negative sense) the further we go down this rabbit hole and as we get new users with no understanding of the true context of what the community is about.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

*Scratches head* Why was it renamed? :confused:

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Yeah, we know you're old enough here. Please enlighten new users as you used to be.

(just kidding man, chill) :D

Reference: http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2006-03-05/

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I like tmo. I just hate the fact, that people don't use search. Instead, they just go and post a new thread about something and we'll have to wait if/when the moderators merge the threads. This applies especially to NITDroid. Makes me kind of a hate the product that has been continuously reposted without searching. :rolleyes:

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

what makes me laugh with this place is when you ask for advice and you title your thread appropriately you get either a little or no response to it, but if you title it anti maemo or 'goodbye maemo, hello android' for instance you get every response imaginable. i like this forum i think it's brilliant but do i have to resort to making crappy thread titles to get the response that is actually needed??

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Bitter & spiteful, aren't we? ;)

My post provided context to this topic.

Do you need me spoon feed the concept to you (to expand and elaborate upon what I said, so you could understand what I meant in this context)?

Well alright:

It means that to quite a few users here, they were part of this community not just because of N900. Nokia had a few other maemo based devices before the N900. (N770, N800 and N810, all maemo based devices).

Not even solely due to maemo, because this community represented something more (less excluseive to Nokia's maemo) when it was called ITT.

I think some of this can be overwhelming to you, so feel free to pm me if you have more questions on this! :)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

HELP HELP! I'm being repressed!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GS_1bzaj2fw

I never asked for a phone when I bought into Maemo. My N800 isn't a phone and neither is my Samsung Galaxy Tab. Why does everything about Maemo have to be about a phone and why can't we talk about competing products and operating systems?

Perhaps the reason why threads like those thrive is because people are impatiently awaiting something worthwhile and they either are trying to shake up some USEFUL responses that might scratch their itch (even if it's from another vendor beside Nokia or even another operating system like MeeGo or, dare I say the name of the dreaded ANDROID)?

Just a few guesses I could come up with in short order, mind you.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Thanks, though I've already learned that bit of information from http://maemo.org/intro/ and thereafter, but I appreciate your effort as this is by far the first informative post by you, for all these months I've been seeing.

If you keep doing it and keep helping people here rather than bragging about being old and knowing all I think you'd gain more respect than being praised as one of the top ten comedian in t.m.o. You wouldn't be proud of that would you?

Hope no damage is done.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Internet tradition has always encouraged straight talk. honest criticism, and frank disagreement. I suppose there have always been individuals who would have preferred a more PR-sensitive level of discourse. Web sites maintain longevity and popularity by allowing a wide variety of opinion. If this site manages to drive away dissenters, it will die or become comatose.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

@danramos

In order to retain their pride, the person has to justify their purchase.

People also fail to realise that humans make mistakes. When someone impulsively buys an N900 based on an incredibly short venture with it, they expect it to just work. Some people on this forum refuse to accept that this type of person exists.

There are different phones for different people. There is no ultimate phone (except the iPhone) and one product cannot satisfy everyone. Unfortunately, people cannot accept that when somebody gives a review of their experience with the device, it's an opinion.

I think we should implement a method of adding a prefix to posts. Some good ones could be "In my experience" or "My opinion is".

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Man, I wish I could disagree so that I could prove your point! Damn! :)

Wait, hold the presses... so if someone opens a thread titled, "N900 SUCKS DONKEY ****", you mean to tell me that it doesn't actually perform as advertised by that thread??

I think it goes without saying that personal experiences are opinionated. :)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Unfortunately, people get as insulted as the devices. People can't accept that opinions can be different.

Maybe I should start that thread?

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

HOLD UP!!
Was that donkey's A***, B**** or C****?

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I have to agree with the OP why start a thread on TMO asking what Android pohne to buy, would you go on say a Ford forum and ask what GM car to but and expect to get a sensible response?

There's already threads on here discussing these phone and so why anybody who reads the forum needs to start a thread saying "I hate my N900.." is beyond me, unless it is their intention just to start a flame war in the first place!

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I think it is ok to discuss other options here, but there is a certain type of user that isn't being represented in the defense. If you've been here long enough to say you have seniority, the guy who started this thread probably wasn't talking about you.

I think he meant the annoying "what should I buy so my friends will think I am cool?" poster.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Because Nokia's astute judgment was that there was no future in tablet devices.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

The seach facility is not the easiest thing to use. Type in a simple thing brings up pages and pages of threads, some of which you have to wade through 50 pages of a thread to find the phrase that you searched for.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

in simple words... it sucks.:D i think they should change ver. of vBulletin (like xda but meamo.org style)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

definitley needs something doing to it, i've given up on it and turn to google everytime.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Same here. Anything to do with search, I use big G, easier and hassle free than the search boxes on most sites.:cool:

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I've never seen a forum with 'good' search system, especially technical oriented ones like TMO where short acronyms and numeric references are abound. They're just too short (thus omitted) and unindexed by the search system.

If you absolutely have to search, then it's way easier going to google and using the site:talk.maemo.org parameter. (just start all your searches with that line, followed by the query).

As for the increasing 'separatist' messages in the forum lately... I see this forum as an open and readable consciousness of the maemo(?) community. You could hear what we're thinking loud and clear...

During the lead up to the n900's release, the excitement was quite palpable.. everyone was close to ecstasy...

...the impatience (with a hint of annoyance) was also crystal clear during the launch delays and spotty product availability...

...then the love and joy as we consummate our honeymoon period with the n900 (some still continue to enjoy that)...

...but then came the shock and confusion of transition to MeeGo...

...and the disgust when Elop and MS came into the picture...

...so it's only natural to see more of 'us' jumping ship at this point in time...

...but it's also natural for some of us to question that judgement and have a loud internal conflict.

So relax :)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I don't see that point. I'd say it's more incompatibility than anything else. This is a forum for users of Maemo. Of course you could argue that the topic former-users is connected to the forum as such, but one or two threads should be enough.

Stating that is not more a restriction of freedom and openness as the fact that you can't run Windows executables on an open platform as Linux.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

This is a problem with people in west especially northeuropean I would say. Also many Americans who always now's what is best because the rest of the world is just idiots if they dont agree Android is the "only way".

Possibility is this is because:

* We have no real war
* We have no problems with tsunamis, Earth quakes atleast not in northeuropean)
* We are not hungry 24 hours a day.

Thats why we have to whine how bad Maemo/Nokia and Meego is.

But as an northeuropean I have too agree: TMO is so damn full of stupid threads with same discussions over and over again. And yes I am also those who may have started those stupid flamewars...

But it really is time to rethink. I mean sometimes I wonder why I really is on this forum when 95% is just whine.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I say...wait for a new nokia maemo 6 device. That will clean the forum and more on topic issues.

Just call me if you want a new countdown! ;)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Are you from Nokia? You REALLY know how to deflect faults really well. :)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

There is a section for competitors. There should be a way of merging whines and wannabe (Android) threads within that section into a handful of threads:

Maemo sucks
i900 sucks
Android is better
iPhone is better
WebOS is better
WM7 is better
MeeGo might be better if we ever get to see it
Ubuntu on a netbook is better apart from not being a phone or a tablet
Symbian still does it for me
MS-Nokia merge is a good/bad move

By focussing dissent into a few threads on Competitors, the influence on the wider forum would be limited.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

You will find my posts in threads about how much people LOVE their N900s, but that doesn't mean that I think the N900 is PERMANENTLY the best phone to ever buy. For one thing, did you notice Nokia saying that it was partnering with Microsoft and that Meego (officially the descendent of Maemo) is a mere test option? If I LOVE LOVE LOVE my N900, how will I keep loving it after Nokia abandons it? I will have to choose another phone, right?

The fact is that this community is BEYOND loyalty and always has been. It is for QUALITY no matter what company offers it. While Nokia goes chasing the will-o'-the wisp, we are still here, still supporting the idea of the Internet Tablet while Nokia has abandoned it. Post about Nokia and ask why it has abandoned us, not why we have abandoned Nokia.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

As a "newer user", most of the threads ive read have ended up with people complaining about the N900 and how they want to sell it, they seem to stay around for the sole reason of posting it everywhere.

I agree with the first post.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Do they at least point out why? I mean--if I shelled out several hundred clams, tried to stick with it past warranty but the company screwed me for support, refuses to offer decent repair options (parts, service centers, ANYTHING), and furthermore doesn't even communicate with the community built around the platform (in fact, seemingly shunning it)... maybe they're slightly more than bitter and want to communicate that for other people who might follow in their footsteps before they get told that (as was repeated so damned often ever since it came out) they "should have researched it more before [they] bought it".

I'm just saying that there might be a reason, is all, and maybe people need to pay attention to it.

Is this problem as rampant on boards built for other devices/products? Just curious to see how the communities built around competitive products deal with this problem.

the funny thing is i did research on it (keep in mind i was and xda head).
went from windows to andriod and back again (between 1 year i spent over a stack jumping from device to device).

but as soon as i saw the n900(maemo os) it ended my fascination with the others... and my has it blossomed (we got basically what the hackers of there community want..we even scared away a few bright ones... it wasn't as open as they thought).

since release date (rush delivery)it the longest i've keep a device. it's like it depends on what kind of person you are (now im not talking morals)

for instace are you the type to get a rescued dog or a puppy?(nether who decides is wrong for there decision)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Your profile claims you're from the USA, but I can't understand your English. Maybe it's because I'm from New England and I just can't understand your lack of punctuation, typos and grammar. :D

In seriousness, can you rephrase that so it can be understood? I'm interested to know what you intended to mean.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I got my n900 cheap a year ago - nearly half price from Carphone Warehouse via eBay. It was a customer return. As far as I could tell, it was unused. A bit quirky to start with, but I reflashed and did the updates - not a problem since really. The only time I had advice on this forum was to return it unless I was prepared to mess about with it. Once I saw the potential, I decided to stick with it. Needless to say, I was a bit sickened that Nokia soon announced they were shifting from Maemo to MeeGo, and more recently W7, and now I hear so many different things, I don't know what to think any more.

I'm not sure all the rumours help - and Nokia ought to get a grip and state clearly what they will & won't support, and what the situation is for n900 is regarding official support into the future.

I think it is the uncertainty that p*sses people off as much as anything. As we have been told, that is not the community's problem. Yet, in a way it is. I have been very set on staying with official downloads and releases (comes from my former life as a system admin - if it ain't broke, don't fix it), not delved into extras, and kept any apps to those things I think I will use. If I thought that Nokia was not going to come up with anything that might enhance or extend the functionality in some way, then I would look at the CSSU, and extras. I'd probably get a stand-by device as well just-in-case.

So, the lack of any clear signals from Nokia does affect the community - in as much as there may be other people, less vociferous, who haven't p*ssed about with their n900, and who are hanging on to see what (if anything) might emerge for the n900 - but who, if they knew their wasn't anything, would get more involved with what the community has on offer.

I think this is where I need to apologise, because a few of my posts have been in that vein. But it is because I actually like the n900, and would like to keep it, and feel there is more potential as yet untapped - but find the uncertainty and the legacy of apparent broken commitment frustrating. I'd like to think that there will be another Maemo 5 update, or a Maemo 6 port, or even MeeGo (maybe... not sold on that one), that I could flash the n900 with. But the trust that there will be something is not there.

That is not something this forum can address - but I guess this is where a lot of people come who are trying to find out what is going to happen do come. It is odd, because while I tend to search debian and ubuntu and other linux forums for information, this is the first time I have ever been interested in doing so for a g*ddamned mobile phone/tablet. I could not imagine having that level of intrigue for my old 6300 running symbian (as long as it made calls and texts, what did it matter?).

It has changed the way I use this kind of device - I try and use my partner's e72, and despite having been virtually incapable of using anything other symbian on a phone before, I am now incapable of using it. It makes no sense to me. The n900 works like a computer - so makes more sense to me, until I want to use it as a phone. then it is a bit like trying to make phone calls with a computer. I don't think that would work for most people who want a mobile phone - and only works for me if I am not particularly mobile when I want to use it. The camera, on the other hand, is great, and I use it more than I have with any other mobile device.

It is good to let people vent, but I am not sure it is that productive. However, if it gives people the opportunity to explain why it is not productive here, that is not a bad thing. Also, if the criticism is constructive, and helps people to see what works and what doesn't, that is good thing. But just saying it sucks - no. That seems more like trolling, and I sometimes wonder if some of those posts are from competitors - just as I wonder if some of the posts extolling its virtues are from people with some kind of investment in Nokia. It is interesting that since the announcement about the tie-up with MS, apart from the whining about that, the n900 'fanboy' posts have decreased. That makes me wonder how far all of them were genuine, and how much was PR by Nokia folks.

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

I tend to go for the rescue dog myself - experience shows me they exhibit more character, more loyalty. So, I guess my n900 falls into that category - as it was a customer return originally.

Same with PC's. I can have a brand new PC/laptop with Windows, and hardly use it - tending to use a five year old PC/laptop running linux instead.

On posting about that here, somebody suggested I try linux on one of the newer ones. I got the opportunity, when W7 crashed on the SP1 update - and stuck 64 bit ubuntu 10.10 on it - very impressed with speed, graphics & performance; so much so I am even starting to get into KDE for the first time ever. (Just wish I could get LibreOffice to work with Bibus and get Bibus to import my EndNote bibliography - I'd never use Windows again)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

lol:D(im swerving on purpose)

what my my previous post boils down to is that the people that are whining are not wrong (and vice a versa) its personal taste and thats what usually influences our decisions (this dose not make them a bad person or a good one)

....,,,''(i hope i get a A+ this time:D)

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

A miiiiinuuuuuus!!!

Re: Keep TMO Clean!!!
 

Coming from the majority of Maemo devices side of things (my N800), I think the N900 had a LOT of potential but it's not at all what I was looking for and ended up ruining my Maemo 4 experience with the plethora of "WONTFIXES" and "FIXED IN FREMANTLE", plus it even had enough deficiencies (in my opinion) to dissuade me from purchasing it. I'm still waiting to see what Maemo/MeeGo does next but I'm feeling very cynical considering Nokia's history--and I'm probably more interested to see what someone other than Nokia does. I like to also incorporate thinking outside the box itself and I find that customer communications, support, repairs, parts, etc. are all of extremely poor quality. It's incredibly heartbreaking to see something touted as an open-source tablet platform get cheapened and ruined by a single vendor that has a tight hold over the whole process while still claiming to be open. I'm glad to that MeeGo exists to fix that issue--but I can't help the nagging sense that Nokia has been spending all this time lately finding ways to hobble the N900 (and any new device's) firmware image with proprietary open-core software and architecture (as if drivers weren't bad enough alone) the way they did with the 770, the N800, the N810, the N810 WiMax Edition and the N900.

Anyway, all that aside... Well said. I'm not sure that we're in any kind of disagreement, even though I personally and generally dislike the decisions made in designing and creating the N900.