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-   -   Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=78070)

momcilo 2011-09-29 10:14
Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
zehjotkah is currently in Seattle at the Intel Elements.
http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p...&postcount=639

I suggest we ask the relavent questions since the event time is short (28. - 29.) September.

Excellent question by Erendorn, so I will copy it (source):

Quote:
Originally Posted by erendorn (Post 1098820)
Can we expect open graphic/wireless drivers whenever/if the intel SoC comes out? is 2012 still expected release for these chips? In such case wouldn't that be an easier (but farther and more imaginary) hardware base for a community device?

momcilo 2011-09-29 10:55
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
What are the main differences compared to Meego?

ysss 2011-09-29 11:03
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
What are the lessons learned from MeeGo and Nokia?

onethreealpha 2011-09-29 11:03
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Will intel transfer existing N900CE resources over to Tizen and will there be a complete move away from all development on Arm?

MartinK 2011-09-29 11:19
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
  • What about Python support ?
  • What graphical toolkits will be available ?
  • Also do they plan some Aegis equivalent (hope not!) ?

Helmuth 2011-09-29 11:50
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
  • What about the possibility for the community to support GTK+ and Qt based applications? Will this be allowed?
  • Are we able to promote them to the store?
  • What kind of packaging system will be used?
    RPM, DEB, no packaging or is it up to the vendor?

zehjotkah 2011-09-29 18:42
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Awesome questions! Thanks a lot.
Here are the answers:

Quote:
Can we expect open graphic/wireless drivers whenever/if the intel SoC comes out?
The entire stack will be open.

Quote:
is 2012 still expected release for these chips? In such case wouldn't that be an easier (but farther and more imaginary) hardware base for a community device?
sure, devices will be announced in the beginning of 2012 and come out in mid 2012.

Quote:
What are the main differences compared to Meego?
Underlying platform is mostly the same, application APIs are different, there is still some discussion going around.

Quote:
What are the lessons learned from MeeGo and Nokia?
With the LiMo Foundation and WAC they have a number of industry players, not only just one partner.

Quote:
Will intel transfer existing N900CE resources over to Tizen and will there be a complete move away from all development on ARM?
Tizen will fully support ARM!
Even the AppUp Store will support ARM.
(my comment: since it's fully open souce, count 1 + 1 to know if there will be a N900 version, the most work is already done with the MeeGo CE, platform is very, very similar)

Quote:
What about Python support?
No idea
(my comment: take a look into MeeGo)

Quote:
What graphical toolkits will be available?
Known ones, no names-telling allowed yet but a hint: It is already very well known and heavily used

Quote:
Also do they plan some Aegis equivalent (hope not!)?
The same one used already in MeeGo (not Aegis from Harmattan) SMACK based.

Quote:
What about the possibility for the community to support GTK+ and Qt based applications? Will this be allowed?
There is nothing stopping the community to do anything they want.

Quote:
Are we able to promote them to the store?
There will be a compliance document – everything that goes into the store has to meet that. But yes, nothing against GTK+ and Qt based Apps in the AppUp Store. But HTML5 is encouraged.

Quote:
What kind of packaging system will be used - RPM, DEB, no packaging or is it up to the vendor?
RPM


Hope that answers many of your questions and removes a bit of uncertainty. If you have more questions please just ask! :)

Dave999 2011-09-29 20:22
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Meettizen?

erendorn 2011-09-29 20:39
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
These are very promising promises!
If they are kept, I'll be happy to be part of it.

zehjotkah 2011-09-29 20:45
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Norris (Post 1099202)
Meettizen?
just a new domain I registered...
meetmeego.org <-> meettizen.org
;)

Dave999 2011-09-29 21:12
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Tizen devices announced early 2012? I doubt that. If that was the answer. Can you please ask the same question again.

AlMehdi 2011-09-30 00:38
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Without knowing but pretty sure when looking at circumstances...

What graphical toolkits will be available?

EFL or better known as Enlightenment

What about Python support?

Yes, as it is supported by Enlightenment


The only strange thing i am wondering is that Enlightenment depends on X11 right now but am pretty sure they will use Wayland as we are talking about something that will come mid 2012 or as i think close to 2013. It will be interesting to find out. Same goes for boot loader and stuff..

theonelaw 2011-09-30 03:29
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Thanks for these very enlightening answers.
Your replies make a big difference to some of us,
and you certainly deserve recognition for your efforts:

Quote:
Originally Posted by zehjotkah (Post 1099145)
Awesome questions! Thanks a lot.
Here are the answers:

Can we expect open graphic/wireless drivers whenever/if the intel SoC comes out?

The entire stack will be open.
The best news we could hope for, but:

Quote:
-------------x-snip-x----------------

What are the lessons learned from MeeGo and Nokia?

With the LiMo Foundation and WAC they have a number of industry players, not only just one partner.

-------------x-snip-x----------------
An industrialist Plutocracy is a committee of sociopathic entities,
by definition. They default to implementing draconian measures
to keep hobbyist/developers away from tinkering with
their money-making machines, which is why:

Quote:
-------------x-snip-x----------------

Also do they plan some Aegis equivalent (hope not!)?

The same one used already in MeeGo (not Aegis from Harmattan) SMACK based.
is such a telling answer...

quoting an observation from
What is aegis [MSSF] and how does it affect Free Software development? :
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajack (Post 1087304)
Thanks for this discussion, am skipping the N9 then... I saw how such a mechanism killed UIQ3 on Symbian...
My sentiments exactly:
If you (corpusculars) are selling a device that is locked into
applications only you (corpusculars) can approve of
and provide the enabling certifications for,
then I don't want to buy into your (corpusclar) garden..


And from a discussion on LWN:
The MeeGo security framework
Quote:
...is the complete system lockdown that MSSF could enable. Device makers can use the facilities to require that only their signed kernels run on the devices, and that only approved applications get installed. .... Device makers may well have chosen to do that regardless of whether MSSF supported it, but its presence there certainly makes it easier to create freedom-hostile devices. One hopes that at least some device makers choose otherwise.
And this is almost exactly what micro$oft just got outed on
over the direction of implementation for UEFI.

This is devolving to corporate warfare.
The victims will be, as usual, the consumers.

Caveat Emptor :cool:

fw190 2011-09-30 06:09
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Will it be possible to have Ubuntu or debian on such device or a fully working LibreOffice?

Daneel 2011-09-30 06:52
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Thanks zehjotkah, those answers really do look positive!

jalyst 2011-09-30 06:59
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by erendorn (Post 1099219)
These are very promising promises!
If they are kept, I'll be happy to be part of it.
Almost too good to be true...
I'm getting a feeling of deja-vu, jk :D
But srsly....
I will murder kittens if these promises aren't held to :mad: :D

jalyst 2011-09-30 07:07
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Norris (Post 1099234)
Tizen devices announced early 2012? I doubt that.
If that was the answer. Can you please ask the same question again.
Why do you doubt that, did you not follow the coverage at IDF recently?
Anandtech in particular did some truly excellent write-ups...
Announced early 2012, available mid 2012, (wouldn't be surprised if it extended to Q4) isn't impossible.

zehjotkah 2011-09-30 08:17
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
don't mix aegis and smack. totally different things. afaik we've smack already in the current MeeGo (not Harmattan!) version.
announcement: to be more specific: at mobile world congress in barcelona.

edit: the SDK and first images will be available already in November.

Dave999 2011-09-30 10:50
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalyst (Post 1099417)
Why do you doubt that, did you not follow the coverage at IDF recently?
Anandtech in particular did some truly excellent write-ups...
Announced early 2012, available mid 2012, (wouldn't be surprised if it extended to Q4) isn't impossible.
No i missed that. That would be truly amazing! I don't have the total scope for the work. But even so I'm skeptical about having the device in my hands before 2013. Just look at the meego project...

Let's hope I'm wrong!

onethreealpha 2011-09-30 11:13
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
@zehjotkah
Will the telmap api's comply with tizen for use in app development or will they at least be made available to devs who choose to branch tizen core?

zehjotkah 2011-09-30 22:54
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by onethreealpha (Post 1099530)
@zehjotkah
Will the telmap api's comply with tizen for use in app development or will they at least be made available to devs who choose to branch tizen core?
no idea.
the telmap deal was announced during the closing keynote but as far as I remember they said that they want to make it available for everyone. whatever that means...

jalyst 2011-10-01 07:04
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Norris (Post 1099528)
No i missed that. That would be truly amazing! I don't have the total scope for the work. But even so I'm skeptical about having the device in my hands before 2013. Just look at the meego project...
So as to avoid taking this thread OT...
My thoughts about assumptions that MeeGo ph was late because of Intel silicon:
http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum...m?t=1785096#r9
Feel free to respond there if you want.

niklas87 2011-10-02 17:39
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
Thanks for the answers.

My question:
Will Tizen hit the Nokia N9? Of course, there will be no possibility of getting an official update from Nokia, but it should be possible to get it on the N9, shouldn't it?
Yes, there will be a few updates for the N9, but I'm afraid there won't be that much apps because MeeGo is already dead. And yes: There are repositories but you'll never get apps like "What's App" by it...
So, before I get an N9, let me hear your opinion about it!

zehjotkah 2011-10-02 19:23
Re: Questions for Intel Elements - Seattle
 
I think that yes we will see Tizen for the N9 and N950 because there is already the MeeGo Community Edition in the works. Tizen and MeeGo are very similar so it shouldn't be a lot of additional work.


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