bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 onwards (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

Dammit!
I used iplayer this morning (8 hrs ago) and it was fine. Anyone else have a problem? Might be flash 10 ?

Edit:
Symptom: main iplayer diverts to "mobile not supported"
Cause: iplayer site uses annoying browser-detect. BBC knows of our existance but not what we can do!
(a) To view iplayer site, User Agent must be set to Firefox for X11-armel, not default Maemo Browser.

Symptom: Content player is not visible on main iplayer site, even wiith flash tweaker set to 10.2. (Reason for initial post)
Cause: Problem caused by BBC forcing users to install flash 10.1+. Our flash version < 10.1 so we just see a black space.
Workarounds: Go to www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/bigscreen - it's designed for consoles using flash 7. Radio works (128kbps only). Video stream is 800kbps so too high for N900.

Symtom: 400kbps (400x224 flashlow) stream is not retrievable using get_iplayer
Cause: BBC stopped hosting this stream.
Workaround: Fixed (8th Dec 2011); 400kbps is back online. It cannot be viewed on the website, only via get_iplayer.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

Sorry my crystal ball is on the blink, maybe you could expand a little?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

There has been a recent update to BBC iPlayer. That might be causing the problem. Whatever your problem is.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

As long as I switch the browser user agent, it still works for me. Never works in stock MicroB anymore.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

Apologies for not being clearer.
Problem: The portion of a page on the iplayer site that contains the flash is not visible.
Steps leading to problem:
I wanted to use iplayer (e.g. http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode...ay_24_10_2011/) , as I had done just a few hours previously. However, the flash part of page didn't load. My assumption was that it was because the BBC are now actually using flash 10 features, thus tweaker wouldn't work.
Settings:
Tweak-flash version: AND 10 1 61 0
UA string: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux armv7l; rv:2.0.1) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/4.0.1
JS pausing: After 15 seconds

Question: can anyone else still use iplayer on his/her N900? (without using get_iplayer) - If so, what settings do I need to apply?

Screenshot below...

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

I just got this by going to www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer

http://media.share.ovi.com/m1/s/3180...1fd08a5534.jpg

I then redirects to www.bbc.co.uk/mobile/iplayer/tv, which I didn't want

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

In this case, your need to change the UA string with "Hide User Agent" to the one above. Although it's in -devel, it's stable but not that user friendly because you need to type/paste in the UA string instead of picking one from a list.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

Which is why I have always steered clear of it.

I have always used a get_iplayer script to download vids to view at a later time.
I always concidered the live site to be to much of a pain to use as it always over stretches the flash player so flattens the battery to quickly.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

All valid points. Generally, I use get_iplayer for tv/video and web for radio/audio. Why? The video playback is better even with --mode=flashlow (400kbps) because it's not an over-clocked device. But, for radio it seems a lot of content isn't 'seen' by get_iplayer, even when it's still on the website.

I would like to be able to watch and listen to streams without going through all the steps to download it. And, what upsets me most is that we're now prevented from accessing content that the N900 can actually play (probably politics!).

Edit:
Ahhh... this partially solves it - big screen (http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/bigscreen/) still works. Guess they've got to cater for flash 7 on the Wii? I find the video stream doesn't resize down to the 400kbps one needed for us, like the proper website/console version does.

Ideas anyone?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

Didn't know that get_iplayer didn't see all radio, I found it can see more TV than the web, but I don't listen to BBC radio.
Have you tried get_iplayer and podcasts to see if they moved what you wanted to a podcast, there can be many thousands of podcasts

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

Yup "--type=radio,podcast" does help but doesn't get everything e.g. misses some episodes in a series.

I also find sometimes, especially for longer items e.g. plays and stories, whatever is used to convert the flv to aac doesn't work properly so I get "flv conversion failed". The flv container is generally not readable by ffmpeg to do it from "--raw" either.

Back on topic
Anyone have any ideas how to either get the 400kbps stream in http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/bigscreen/ OR, preferably, view content on the main iplayer website?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

I've filed a complaint on the recent Open Thread on the Beeb's Internet blog.

Cannot for the life of me understand why they're doing this...

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011
 

It'll be interesting to hear what they say, if anything. Does seem very odd. v10.1 is not actually necessary for their content or controls, merely their politics.

Would be good if the big screen version (designed for Wii etc) had better speed detection - I find it sets itself to the 800kbps stream and no other.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

... and now they appear to have dropped the 400kbps stream altogether; even for programmes where the first few in a series were available at this bit rate, the stream has now been withdrawn! (this is the --mode=flashlow version). They are trying to thwart us!

So, the only way to watch unconverted content is by O/C-ing to at least 850 and using the 500kbps stream with mplayer. This stream won't play on the stock media player because it is "main" profile*.

Side note: ffmpeg

Downloading Main/High videos and converting is quite inefficient in terms of power, bandwidth and time but doing so overnight, while charging and connected to wifi, it's an option. However, Maemo's ffmpeg (v0.5) cannot convert from High/Main to Baseline - it seems to be limited to being a transcoder. A new version was released recently (v0.55), which might make its way to the repositories (with a bit of luck!) - maybe this will make conversion possible.

Maemo versions aside, I have seen reports of people using ffmpeg in EasyDebian to convert videos from Main or High to Baseline
Questions
- What version of ffmpeg can be used with EasyDebian?
- Is it necessary to upgrade to Squeeze (or will Lenny handle it?)?
- If you're an EasyDebian-ffmpeg user and have found a client, what is it and can you recommend it?
- If you just use CLI ffmpeg, what switches/values would be suitable to make the following mp4-h264 streams play on the N900 (a) 500kbps @640x360 and (b) 1500kbps @832x468; padding permitted but no cropping. (stream info can be found here - filter to show video only then click on an item)
- Also, Do the more recent versions of rtmpdump work OK in EasyDebian?

*Not accounting the new DSP driver and DSP-overclocking.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

What a heap of turds... so that's why it's no longer working. :(

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

What is they want? For viewers to have to constantly buy new kit?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

Apparently so!

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

There must be someone you can email about it. I have a friend who's a broadcast engineer at the beeb...I can try and find out if he has a point of contact if you like?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

The BBC are taking the piss. All licence fee payers should be equal. I support any N900 owner in the UK that refuses to pay the licence fee. Fvck the BBC.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

Thanks. That would be useful. I did contact them via the website. I'm trying to track down the original message. Dammit. Seems I didn't save a copy - thought I did!

The actual message went something like this but had to be very carefully engineered to fit into the nChars < 351 ! Not sure what order I put the points in but here's roughly what I wrote:

(1) Has the 400kbps stream been withdrawn altogether?
(2) If so, please would the BBC set the h.264 profile of the 500kbps stream from "Main" to "Baseline" because it currently restricts access.
(3) iPlayer content does not require flash v10+ (e.g. Wii can use BigScreen version). However, by demanding users have it you are further restricting access. So called Improvements do not make things better if they cannot be used.
(4) How can the BigScreen iplayer be forced to play low-bandwidth for both tv and radio streams.
(5) Please don't use the word "support" in the response.

Re: 1 & 2: The meaning of the first two points are pretty obvious.

Re: 3: It is possible to access iplayer content via the BigScreen version. But, unlike the old web version, it can't determine speed as well. Although, it's a bit of a null point if the N900 can't properly play the even the slowest streams broadcast.

Re: 4:
The low bandwidth option has been removed so (a) if you want to listen to radio on 3G via the BigScreen iPlayer (flash 7 version) one is forced to gobble data at 128kbps, rather than the 64 or 96 streams that sound acceptable and used to be accessed from the normal version (non-BigScreen) but are more difficult to track down (still available via rtmp at the moment). And, (b) if the connection supports the 800kbps stream, the device you're using will try to use it; obviously there's a problem with the N900 which can't even handle the 500kbps stream (and when downloaded this one needs MPlayer*).

*Can anyone stream better h.264 than 400kbps/Baseline with these new graphics drivers? If 500/Main is possible then with some artificial throttling of the connection, viewing the BigScreen version might be possible. Thinking aloud here.

Re: 5:
I put in the last comment because I can support myself perfectly well. I just want access! Also, I was especially on edge because, I had had an email from my building society which said, amongst other things, that they "don't support the linux operating system [...] because of the number of versions". Wrong in so many ways. I was somewhere between fits of laughter, hysterical tears and deafening rage. Anyway... calm now.

The response is somewhat risible; proper buck-passing management speak:

Dear [-me-]

Reference [-ref-]

Thank you for contacting the BBC iPlayer Support Team.

We aim to make information available on the BBC iPlayer Help website wherever possible because we know that information about accessing content through BBC iPlayer is important to all of our audience. We make the most requested information available, and in most cases can advise where it can be found, but in practice it's impossible to provide answers to everything that people ask us about.

The BBC is committed to ensuring that the Licence Fee is used to provide the best value to our audiences, and as such so we cannot always undertake to research individual user issues to their resolution. We receive many unique enquiries each week. I hope that you understand the reasons for this.

We do however capture the details of all enquiries we receive so that we can provide reports to programmes about the nature and type of information people are requesting. This is to encourage better provision of information online on programme websites.

You may wish to know that technical questions are discussed on external messageboards. Details can be found on []http://iplayerhelp.external.bbc.co.uk/help/using_bbc_iplayer/_messageboards[/]

Please note that the BBC is not responsible for the content of external internet sites.

Once again thank you for contacting BBC iPlayer.

Kind Regards
[-sender-]

BBC Audience Services

[]www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer[/]

NB This is sent from an outgoing account only which is not monitored. You cannot reply to this email address but if necessary please contact us via our webform quoting any case number we provided.

Quite frankly: WTF! I'm sure the main aim of this chap's reply was to insight rage because not only did it not make any reference to the content of my message, it makes very little sense. Aaarrggghhh!

Side note: @Marxian
The notion of a media group that's state funded (or as good as) is worthwhile because it is able to pursue activities that have no or only a long term financial return yet inform/entertain/etc. where as officially commercial stations need to get a shorter return to pay their way. However, it seems that short-termism and corporate selling-out is pervading. And, it appears many of the concerns of Phil Lewis (get_iplayer founder) are being realised/we justified [1] [2]. The irony is that the BBC use a lot of OSS products and are funding OSS projects - it's just access to their services must be with proprietary products; weird.
... anyway, the merits of the BBC and how it's being (mis-)managed would take up a 300,000 word PhD thesis so not really appropriate for TMO!

Possibly I should have put this post in a [RantNRage][/RantNRage] tag?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

I agree with this, but it's only valid if all members of the public can access the content, otherwise it cannot justifiably be called a public service. The BBC want to have their cake and eat it. They can choke on that cake for all I care. 99% of what they broadcast is trash, anyway. I gave up on TV a few years ago.

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

Have just noticed that the "--mode=flashlow" stream is now working again, looks like emailing them worked!

Sadly the site still tells you that the N900 is not supported. (I've not tried HUA)

...perhaps more emails are required?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

Re: flashlow: I noticed this a few mins ago. Good news - dl'd bbc views play in stock player! W-Hoooo! Just tried flicking around with KMPlayer - for the flashstd stream, the sound goes out of sync with video; if anyone knows how to resolve this without O/C'ing - please post here.

Re: using the N900 to visit the iplayer site - you need to change the User Agent string; even then, the player prevents users with flash < 10.1 to view content, all the same, it's useful for searching and viewing the programme info.
Even Android users can't use iplayer on 3G and the absence of a Maemo5 client that takes into account our h/w and s/w capabilities is pretty much out of the question. So, we must use a web interface and some crafty hacks!
The workaround to view the iplayer site, without changing your UA, is to use the BigScreen version, which is designed for consoles (Wii etc.), which have flash 7(!!). The BigScreen version is fine for radio playback but because it's not very good at detecting speed, you have to use the 128kbps stream, thus chewing through the data if you're using 3G. BigScreen video streams are 800kbps so, unfortunately, too high for our little devices :(.

Very joyful that the 400kbps stream is back!

Edit: Does anyone have a work around or well-worked rtmpdump flags for other channels' OD services?

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

I have always watched the flashlow stream with out any problem in the stock player, watching flashstd in KMPlayer even OCing to 1150Mhz KMPlayer occasionally alows the sound to go out of sync, a pause/play re-syncs it. I'm guessing it's caused by KMP hitting max CPU speed decoding the video and as a result cannot keep up with the sound. Running BatteryGraph shows the CPU is far from over stretched, but all it takes is one frame every now a then to hit the limit and it slowly goes out of sync. Loving the flashstd picture quality though.

Not sure what you mean here - do you mean BBC channels playing as you download or ITV etc...

Re: bbc iplayer - Oct 2011 (seeking Flash 10+ work-around)
 

I have similar experience with flashlow & flashstd (though found 850MHz sufficient for KMPlayer). And currenly running stock kernel so very annoyed when flashlow was off-air. If someone knows how to convert "Main" to "Baseline" on-device, please enlighten me/us.
This does not work:
ffmpeg -i video01.mp4 -acodec copy -vcodec copy -vpre "/usr/share/ffmpeg/h264-baseline" video02.mp4
Result: video02 is a copy of video01 and profile stays the same. Even using EasyDebian would be an option.

Interesting info about the increased power demand when frames "stick". I wonder if there's a tweak or work around one could use in KMPlayer so it skipped frames when the demand (power or cpu) spiked? I find the Ctrl+D frame drop has poor playback.

With flash 10.1 being an impossibility, I was trying to work out how to stream directly (no downloading), using get_iplayer. general instructions are in the get_iplayer documentation. I can stream radio fine using ffplay. I don't know how to send streams to the stock player via the command line and streaming to mplayer doesn't work (maybe it's get_iplayer, RTMPdump or ffmpeg); ffplay is poor too. All the same, now that flashlow is back we should be able to stream but it needs a little ironing out. Ideas welcome.

Re: other channels: I wondered whether any TMO users had grabbed OD content with RTMPdump and whether it was possible to play downloaded streams on the device, mainly with reference to UK TV OD streams. And, if anyone had, to give an example of the command line instruction.
BTW, re: RTMPdump, someone (self included) really needs to look at how to build a more recent version. I think v1.9 misses some headers off, which makes extraction from flv impossible - so it might download a 300Mb flv that's actually inaccessible; mainly this happens with long audio only streams, not mixed av streams.