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-   -   [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=79707)

neal 2011-11-05 15:03
[Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Woodchuck is a scheduler for the transmission of delay-tolerant data, such as RSS feeds, email and software updates. Woodchuck improves battery use, reduces cellular network use and hides spotty network coverage by scheduling data transfers when conditions are good, e.g., when attached to power and WiFi is available.

There are currently a few Woodchuck-enabled applications:

- FeedingIt: An RSS reader.
- Khweeteur: A Twitter / identi.ca client.
- APT Woodchuck: Manages software updates

Packages for gPodder will be available soon.

rcolistete 2011-11-05 15:08
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Neal, post here the links to extras-testing voting.

Nokia 5700 2011-11-05 15:15
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Wait, so it downloads content automatically?
I've never understood what Woodchuck is. :confused:

neal 2011-11-05 15:16
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
If you install the above software, you will use my personal software repositories.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcolistete (Post 1118748)
Neal, post here the links to extras-testing voting.
The Woodchuck software is currently in extras-testing. I'd appreciate it if people would test it so that it can migrate to extras:

raverpol 2011-11-05 15:17
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
how can I personalize APT Woodchuck?

neal 2011-11-05 15:22
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nokia 5700 (Post 1118750)
Wait, so it downloads content automatically?
I've never understood what Woodchuck is. :confused:
Woodchuck-enabled applications register feeds and objects with Woodchuck (a daemon). When conditions are good, e.g., you are not interacting with the device, there is WiFi and you have battery power (the ideal case), Woodchuck checks what needs to be transferred, starts the corresponding applications and tells them what streams to update and what objects to download.

FeedingIt, an RSS reader, registers each of your RSS subscriptions with Woodchuck and tells Woodchuck that the streams should be updated approximately every 6 hours. Woodchuck starts FeedingIt and tells it to update its feeds when they are not sufficiently up to date and there is good connectivity.

(Currently, Woodchuck never uses your cellular connectivity. Future versions will, after obtaining the user's consent.)

Does that help clarify things?

neal 2011-11-05 15:23
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by raverpol (Post 1118752)
how can I personalize APT Woodchuck?
How would you like to personalize it? Currently, it aims to run the equivalent of apt-get update once a day and prefetch any packages for which updates are available.

raverpol 2011-11-05 15:32
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
well, I wuould like it to do the update for example between 23:00 and 6:00

neal 2011-11-05 15:46
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by raverpol (Post 1118759)
well, I wuould like it to do the update for example between 23:00 and 6:00
In that case, you'll want to use something like cron.

Woodchuck doesn't care about the particular time that something occurs; Woodchuck cares about the conditions in which it occurs. So, if you happen to plug in your phone and have WiFi at noon, it may trigger an update when the phone becomes idle. That's better, I think, than updating over cellular at 23:00, because you happen to be at the bar instead of at home, as you usually are.

raverpol 2011-11-05 15:50
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
ok, now I know more

neal 2011-11-16 14:52
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Thanks to everyone who tested the packages, murmeltier, the Woodchuck server is now in extras!

FeedingIt, a Woodchuck-enabled RSS reader, is currently in extras devel and will likely be the first Woodchuck-enabled application in extras!

neal 2011-12-12 15:30
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
The woodchuck-enabled version of Khweeteur is now in extras-devel!

neal 2011-12-13 17:46
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
A few days ago I promoted a new version of Woodchuck and APT Woodchuck to extras testing. It would be great if people could try them and vote for their promotion to extras!

Woodchuck: http://maemo.org/packages/package_in...r/0.4~20111208

APT Woodchuck: http://maemo.org/packages/package_in...k/0.4~20111203

Note: I've also recently created two mailing lists for Woodchuck:

woodchuck-bugs@nongnu.org is for bug reports. See http://hssl.cs.jhu.edu/~neal/woodchu...o_report_a_bug for more information.

woodchuck-devel@nongnu.org is for development, but support questions are also welcome. Of course, I also watch this thread.

ivgalvez 2011-12-13 19:27
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
If installing APT Woodchuck, will it update from /etc/apt/sources.list?

I usually have only enabled Nokia, OVI, CSSU and Extras repositories to avoid so long updates when using HAM, while for FAPMAN I have also enabled testing and devel as it's much more faster and friendly.

If APT Woodchuck use regular sources.list, is there a way to avoid apt worker to also update regularly? (even changing the gconf key I have found it updating from time to time).

neal 2011-12-13 21:35
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Thanks for the good questions!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivgalvez (Post 1137162)
If installing APT Woodchuck, will it update from /etc/apt/sources.list?
APT Woodchuck doesn't change /etc/apt/sources.list. It calls apt-wroker about once a day when connectivity is good (unlike HAM).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivgalvez (Post 1137162)
I usually have only enabled Nokia, OVI, CSSU and Extras repositories to avoid so long updates when using HAM, while for FAPMAN I have also enabled testing and devel as it's much more faster and friendly.
I don't know where fapman stores its catalogs or how it updates them. It would be good to have APT Woodchuck also schedule fapman's updates if it is installed or to modify fapman to directly use Woodchuck.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivgalvez (Post 1137162)
If APT Woodchuck use regular sources.list, is there a way to avoid apt worker to also update regularly? (even changing the gconf key I have found it updating from time to time).
APT Woodchuck disables HAM's normal update mechanism using the gconf trick. Unfortunately, I wasn't aware that this doesn't always work. If there is a better way, I'd like to hear about it.

nicolai 2011-12-17 10:26
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Hey neal,

is it possible to configure woodchuck or do you
plan to make a settings ui for this.

At the moment I have khweeteur installed, for
testing purpose (testing khweeteur and your woodchuck).

I disabled khweeteurs daemon, but it (or
woodchuck) still runs in the background and
reminds me about new available tweets.

Nicolai

neal 2011-12-17 10:42
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Hi Nicolai,

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1138672)
is it possible to configure woodchuck or do you
plan to make a settings ui for this.
There is not yet a graphical settings ui. From the command line, you can use woodchuck-cli to examine and modify the state.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1138672)
I disabled khweeteurs daemon, but it (or
woodchuck) still runs in the background and
reminds me about new available tweets.
It sounds, however, like you want to configure Khweeteur, not Woodchuck. If you want to disable Khweeteur's notifications, you can do that in its settings dialog. Click on the menu, preferences, and then uncheck: "Show errors notifications", "DM Notifications", "Mention Notifications" and "Timeline Notifications".

Currently, Khweeteur does not have an option to disable the use of Woodchuck. You can still accomplish this using the aforementioned tool:

Code:
user@Nokia-N900-42-11:~$ woodchuck-cli
1: FeedingIt (org.marcoz.feedingit)
2: Application Update Manager (org.woodchuck.apt-woodchuck)
3: Khweeteur (net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon)
4: gPodder (org.gpodder)
> print 3
cookie: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
dbus_object:
dbus_service_name: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
enabled: 1
human_readable_name: Khweeteur
parent_UUID:
priority: 0
registration_time: Fri Oct  7 13:07:33 2011 (1317989253)
UUID: 03a9a6377b4af0d05f9be0e30f34d553
> set 3 enabled 0
Changing enabled: 1 => 0
> print 3
cookie: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
dbus_object:
dbus_service_name: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
enabled: 0
human_readable_name: Khweeteur
parent_UUID:
priority: 0
registration_time: Fri Oct  7 13:07:33 2011 (1317989253)
UUID: 03a9a6377b4af0d05f9be0e30f34d553
If you tell me more precisely what you want to accomplish, I might have an idea on how to improve Woodchuck / Khweeteur.

Thanks for the feedback!

Neal

nicolai 2011-12-17 11:08
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by neal (Post 1138675)
It sounds, however, like you want to configure Khweeteur, not Woodchuck.
No, I don't want to configure khweeteur, because at the moment,
khweeteur isn't running, but I still get notifications about
new tweets, so someone starts khweeteur from the
background.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neal (Post 1138675)
If you want to disable Khweeteur's notifications, you can do that in its settings dialog. Click on the menu, preferences, and then uncheck: "Show errors notifications", "DM Notifications", "Mention Notifications" and "Timeline Notifications".
In khweeteurs preferences dialog, I disabled the "use daemon"
option. I thought this would be enough to disable khweeteur
fetching new tweets in the background.
But they still show up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neal (Post 1138675)
Currently, Khweeteur does not have an option to disable the use of Woodchuck. You can still accomplish this using the aforementioned tool:

Code:
user@Nokia-N900-42-11:~$ woodchuck-cli
1: FeedingIt (org.marcoz.feedingit)
2: Application Update Manager (org.woodchuck.apt-woodchuck)
3: Khweeteur (net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon)
4: gPodder (org.gpodder)
> print 3
cookie: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
dbus_object:
dbus_service_name: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
enabled: 1
human_readable_name: Khweeteur
parent_UUID:
priority: 0
registration_time: Fri Oct  7 13:07:33 2011 (1317989253)
UUID: 03a9a6377b4af0d05f9be0e30f34d553
> set 3 enabled 0
Changing enabled: 1 => 0
> print 3
cookie: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
dbus_object:
dbus_service_name: net.khertan.khweeteur.daemon
enabled: 0
human_readable_name: Khweeteur
parent_UUID:
priority: 0
registration_time: Fri Oct  7 13:07:33 2011 (1317989253)
UUID: 03a9a6377b4af0d05f9be0e30f34d553
Ok , this may help, but I still don't understand who
fetches the new tweets while khweeteur and the khweeteur
daemon isn't running.

Quote:
Originally Posted by neal (Post 1138675)
If you tell me more precisely what you want to accomplish, I might have an idea on how to improve Woodchuck / Khweeteur.
The main concern is:
imagine a user installing khweeteur and he want to disable
it from running in the background. He opens the preference
dialog, disables "use daemon" option, but he still
gets notifications. Even after he closed the kwheeteur applcation.

nicolai

ammyt 2011-12-17 11:12
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
If it were me, I would've run top and look for khweeteur's pid and woodchuck's pid then kill both of them.

neal 2011-12-17 12:22
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1138682)
No, I don't want to configure khweeteur, because at the moment,
khweeteur isn't running, but I still get notifications about
new tweets, so someone starts khweeteur from the
background.
Woodchuck starts the Khweeteur daemon periodically. That's the point of Woodchuck--it schedules network transmissions periodically. Because Khweeteur registered network transmissions with Woodchuck, Woodchuck starts it when an update should be performed.

Note that the notifications are not displayed by a running instance of Khweeteur (i.e., if you click on a notification, Hildon may need to start Khweeteur): they are standard freedesktop notifications that can be shown even if the application is not (or no longer) running.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1138682)
In khweeteurs preferences dialog, I disabled the "use daemon"
option. I thought this would be enough to disable khweeteur
fetching new tweets in the background.
But they still show up.
The "use daemon" option means: the Khweeteur daemon always runs in the background and periodically checks for updates (whether you are using WiFi, cellular or even roaming).

When using Woodchuck, the Khweeteur daemon is only started when necessary and quits when there is nothing left to do thereby freeing memory. Further, Woodchuck is aware of the connectivity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1138682)
Ok , this may help, but I still don't understand who
fetches the new tweets while khweeteur and the khweeteur
daemon isn't running.
Woodchuck starts the Khweeteur daemon periodically and tells it to fetch updates, which is what Khweeteur requested. You can think of Woodchuck as cron++.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolai (Post 1138682)
The main concern is:
imagine a user installing khweeteur and he want to disable
it from running in the background. He opens the preference
dialog, disables "use daemon" option, but he still
gets notifications. Even after he closed the kwheeteur applcation.
Ok. This is a good point. I'll come up with a patch to improve Khweeteur in this regard.

petur 2012-01-05 14:49
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
I'd also like a GUI with options to configure. Since I'm never on wifi, woodchuck is kinda useless right now although I like it's features of doing the transmissions when idle, could use minimal battery level and timeframes

neal 2012-01-05 16:40
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by petur (Post 1146152)
I'd also like a GUI with options to configure. Since I'm never on wifi, woodchuck is kinda useless right now although I like it's features of doing the transmissions when idle, could use minimal battery level and timeframes
This would indeed be good and would be relatively easy to implement. I've created a bug here: http://debbugs.gnu.org/cgi/bugreport.cgi?bug=10438

Unfortunately, I don't have time to create a GUI in the near future. It would be great if someone else volunteered to do this. I'd be more than willing to help.

Thanks,

Neal

llucax 2012-07-18 07:40
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Hi, I noticed that after installing the package the daemon wasn't running. running it manually gives me just a segfault message. Any ideas? I'm using the latest stable CSSU. Thanks.

neal 2012-07-18 08:03
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Can you try running it under gdb?

Also, can you please post the output of:

Code:
sqlite3 debug-output.db 'select * from log' | tail -n 20
(You might need to install the sqlite3 package).

Thanks!

llucax 2012-07-21 14:41
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by neal (Post 1239128)
Can you try running it under gdb?

Also, can you please post the output of:

Code:
sqlite3 debug-output.db 'select * from log' | tail -n 20
(You might need to install the sqlite3 package).

Thanks!
The file debug-output.db doesn't exist in the cwd where I'm running the program. I don't have gdb installed in the phone. The weird thing is earlier today, I've seen murmeltier running when taking a peek to top, but I forgot to try to run it manually then. Now I don't see it running and I still get the segfault when trying to run it manually.

Any other ideas about what could be going on? Is murmeltier supposed to be running all the time as a daemon?

llucax 2012-07-25 18:11
Re: [Annouce] Woodchuck: A Network Transmission Manager
 
btw, here's the gdb output:
Code:
$ gdb -q murmeltier
(no debugging symbols found)
(gdb) r
Starting program: /usr/bin/murmeltier
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)
(no debugging symbols found)

Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
0x00014914 in ?? ()
0x00014914 <dbus_message_append_args+35924>:        ldr        lr, [r4, #8]
(gdb) bt
#0  0x00014914 in ?? ()
#1  0x000148e8 in ?? ()
Backtrace stopped: previous frame identical to this frame (corrupt stack?)
(gdb)
Not very helpful I guess (and not very good either). I takes a couple of seconds to segfault. Don't know if that infotmation is relevant though.


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