maemo.org - Talk - Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Page 1 of 2

Next >

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

maemo.org - Talk (https://talk.maemo.org/index.php)

- Competitors (https://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=4)

- - Jolla VS Tizen Poll (https://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=85362)

Dave999

2012-07-09 13:55

Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Two interesting new Linux system with devices will be announced later this year and what is you most interested in with the information you have and why?

marmistrz

2012-07-09 14:44

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Tizen seems to combine the things I like from many systems, but as it's some-sung's I think it'll be capable of only some activities of N900 (too closed, too hard ingerention into the system). But maybe Samsung will surprise me. Jolla seems interesting, but there's no UI preview it, these are only pledges, this may be the same as with LiMo or something... I'd go for Tizen now, but Jolla may be much better in the long run. I'd need to wait for more info

benny1967

2012-07-09 14:50

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

If Jolla keeps the stack I'm comfortable with and the Qt framework on top, then it's my choice. Tizen lacks hope and spirit - don't know how else to put it. The name alone makes me yawn. Based on web technology, maybe EFL (who else still uses that?),.... nothing exciting at all in that mix.

Dave999

2012-07-09 15:03

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

I think the two system will target two different areas at first. Tizen in Asia and jolla in northern Europe. I will buy the one i can get my hands on first.

www.rzr.online.fr

2012-07-09 16:05

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

i am wondering what are other alternatives ? android, GTA04 ? what about other obscure mobile gnu/linux platforms ?

ajalkane

2012-07-09 16:09

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Tizen is boring to me. Everything HTML5 + javascript, no Qt, no native access. The hackability of the device and low level access seems dubious.

We don't know much about Jolla yet, but it seems much more promising. In fact I'm quite excited about it, whereas Tizen has not sparked any kind of feeling as of yet.

Ariadeno

2012-07-09 16:11

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by www.rzr.online.fr (Post 1234558)

i am wondering what are other alternatives ? android, GTA04 ? what about other obscure mobile gnu/linux platforms ?

Hey.. What about Firefox OS, it will be full open-source. I wonder why people don't mention that? It could be a serious competitor to Tizen.

patlak

2012-07-09 16:29

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

I just hate the look of TouchWIZ in Tizen. It annoys the hell out of me.

Fuzzillogic

2012-07-09 16:39

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ariadeno (Post 1234567)

Hey.. What about Firefox OS, it will be full open-source. I wonder why people don't mention that? It could be a serious competitor to Tizen.

With the same HTML5-dreck. Sorry, I can't describe it nicer than that. HTML is for text documents. Whoever thought it would be "good enough for apps" should have his/her's voting rights revoked.

MINKIN2

2012-07-09 16:45

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

From what we've seen so far, it's hard to say.

Tizen looks to be a more promising OS due to the the amount of work that has already gone into it and by having some huge players producing it, but still the OS is still a little lacking in many ways. (More to the point, it looks fugly)

Jolla appears to be doing something awesome, it is taking an existing OS that we already know and seems to be working towards having a close community relationship from the ground up. Unfortunately it is still too early to tell how things will go, they are still hiring so news of a Device Road Map may still be some time away?

If the future of mobile was to be another 2 horse race with Tizen and Jolla, I would be a very happy bunny.

Zoxir

2012-07-09 16:58

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Screw Tizen, Intel and Samsung, HTML and javascript. Lets hope the Jolla guys manage do something with this

don_falcone

2012-07-09 17:02

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by MINKIN2 (Post 1234599)

From what we've seen so far, it's hard to say.

This. We and others know soo little about them, but especially about Jolla's OS, that i question if this poll even makes sense. Seriously. It's in the same league like those kinda idiotic speculations, whines, and pseudo-wishlists in the Jolla thread.

Estel

2012-07-09 17:06

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Question is quite stupid - it's like "Android VS Google". You're comparing grapples and oranges here - Tizen is misty, unknown operating system, and Jolla is company.

More proper question would be "Tizen vs Mer" - but of course, results would be quite predictable ;)

marmistrz

2012-07-09 17:14

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1234590)

With the same HTML5-dreck. Sorry, I can't describe it nicer than that. HTML is for text documents. Whoever thought it would be "good enough for apps" should have his/her's voting rights revoked.

But look at webos: it's main language is html/css/js, but extended. Palm's written a js framework. But you still can use Qt, C++ and so on.

But if there's no js framework, no qt, then the whole platform is a shame

Dave999

2012-07-09 17:26

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Estel (Post 1234631)

I doubt they will call it mer at release. So sure it might be slightly better but same kind of inconsistency in the end.

Dave999

2012-07-09 17:49

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by don_falcone (Post 1234621)

So why do you think people using polls? They are always speculation to see something. It's never facts.. It's up to anyone to read what they want of it. Let's say we have the same poll again in 4 month and tizen gets more than 50 percent, i say that would give an indication the wind has changed and Jolla have not keep this interest and momentum they have now.

switch-hitter

2012-07-09 18:34

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by benny1967 (Post 1234507)

..//..
maybe EFL (who else still uses that?),....

Doesn't Enlightenment have elev8 which is similar to QtQuick?

switch-hitter

2012-07-09 18:39

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1234590)

With the same HTML5-dreck. Sorry, I can't describe it nicer than that. HTML is for text documents. Whoever thought it would be "good enough for apps" should have his/her's voting rights revoked.

I'm not keen on HTML/CSS but I'd be really happy to be able to use QooxDoo to write apps.

Dave999

2012-07-09 18:41

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by switch-hitter (Post 1234729)

Doesn't Enlightenment have elev8 which is similar to QtQuick?

Not really... First line slide 7.however things could change :)

https://www.tizen.org/sites/default/...012_raster.pdf

GrimyHR

2012-07-09 18:46

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

lol, what a question, html5 or native code...no normal person would choose anything over native code when there is choice

Fuzzillogic

2012-07-09 18:50

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by marmistrz (Post 1234642)

But look at webos: it's main language is html/css/js, but extended.

But still ugly. Stuff like

Code:

{kind: "Control", layoutKind: "HFlexLayout",

      style: "width: 500px; height: 100px;",

      pack: "center", align: "start", components: [

          {kind: "Button", caption: "Open", onclick: "openPopup"},

          {kind: "Button", caption: "Close", onclick: "closePopup"}

      ]

  }

is exactly what I don't want to see on a platform: magic strings and other stuff patched up using nothing more than sticky tape en velcro. Yuch. Make a typo and nothing will complain about it until it breaks later on, possibly even unnoticed during testing.

Quote:

But you still can use Qt, C++ and so on.

But if there's no js framework, no qt, then the whole platform is a shame

I can hardly argue that Jolla's platform should not support other platforms, but I think it would be better to pick a primary platform. Qt / Qt Quick would be the logical choice.

Btw, QML is based on Javascript as well. But the actual language is extended, and (partially) strongly typed. It makes development more robust and easier, as the IDE can provide much more support and tooling. Try simple name refactoring of the function name "openPopup" in the above example... You'd need to do a text search&replace... Sorry, but even in 1998 we had better methods for that.

Ok I stop ranting now. But I hate it when those webtech-based frameworks and platforms get their very undue rave. It simply isn't good technology.

switch-hitter

2012-07-09 18:55

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1234733)

Not really... First line slide 7.however things could change :)

https://www.tizen.org/sites/default/...012_raster.pdf

Thanks for the link Dave999.

Slide 7 does say elev8 is on it's way and it's similar to Node.js - that works for me. I like the look of the code snippet on slide 25 too.

I'd say things are looking up - Tizen, Firefox OS and now Jolla. I hope at least one of them can get some real traction.

switch-hitter

2012-07-09 19:07

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1234742)

But still ugly. Stuff like

Code:

{kind: "Control", layoutKind: "HFlexLayout",

      style: "width: 500px; height: 100px;",

      pack: "center", align: "start", components: [

          {kind: "Button", caption: "Open", onclick: "openPopup"},

          {kind: "Button", caption: "Close", onclick: "closePopup"}

      ]

  }

I like the look of that :D

Bundyo

2012-07-09 19:22

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1234590)

With the same HTML5-dreck. Sorry, I can't describe it nicer than that. HTML is for text documents. Whoever thought it would be "good enough for apps" should have his/her's voting rights revoked.

My voting rights are still intact while I work on a mobile HTML5 based native-like application framework. As you can guess, I do believe making app-le cider with it is possible, but not from every tree (Android's browser apples are rotten to the core, I won't comment on Harmattan's ones as it wasn't finished, but iOS and BlackBerry PlayBook 2.1 are more than capable).

lma	2012-07-09 19:49

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1234467)

Two interesting new Linux system with devices will be announced later this year

"Interesting" is in the eye of the beholder.

They are both vapourware at this point, but that's where the similarity ends. One of these is a "Linux" system that does little more than bootstrap a sandboxed web runtime and one isn't. One of these comes from the people who ruined the last mobile Linux and one doesn't. One of these has a future ;-)

Fuzzillogic

2012-07-09 20:04

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by switch-hitter (Post 1234748)

I like the look of that :D

Then you will reach nirvana when you try QML :P Example:

Code:

Label {

  text:  myImage.status != Image.Error ? "Loading..." : "Error :("

  visible: myImage.status != Image.Ready

}



Image {

  id: myImage // See? No quotes! A new language construct!

  source: "http://example.com/image.png"

}

And now image the label is automatically updated according to the status of the image. There's absolute nothing more than this you need to do for that to work, thanks to the data binding. If you can do that on a normal JS-based framework let me know as I might be interested.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bundyo (Post 1234759)

My voting rights are still intact while I work on a mobile HTML5 based native-like application framework.

You try very hard to merely mimic the native platform, but you'll never going to achieve the same performance nor flexibility..

It would be great if there's a single, shared platform for mobile development, with open development and a community or non-profit in charge. HTML doesn't cut it for apps and/or is still very fragmented in Tizen/WebOS/FirefoxOS and the plethora of other frameworks like ExtJS/Qooxdoo/jQuery Mobile/Kendoui.

Dave999

2012-07-09 20:11

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Anyone reached Uncanny Valley yet? ;)

geneven

2012-07-09 20:11

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1234688)

Some polls are absurd. I expect to see a poll any day that says: Did the scientists find the Higgs Boson or some other kind of Boson? Like anyone knows. This poll is like that--the right answer is not to take the poll, or just "I don't know."

Dave999

2012-07-09 20:17

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by geneven (Post 1234792)

True, but at the same time. If the poll would been used amoung scientist. It could still be interesting even if they can't say for sure since they only have some basic understanding. But they atleast have something. Most of us can't even comprehend the data/information so a poll among us would only be fun :)

A poll can be used to see if all the thousands of scientists concur with the calculations and evidence presented.

Plus a poll is always fun ;) its hard not to look at it even How absurd the questions are.

switch-hitter

2012-07-09 20:26

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1234784)

Then you will reach nirvana when you try QML :P Example:

Code:

Label {

  text:  myImage.status != Image.Error ? "Loading..." : "Error :("

  visible: myImage.status != Image.Ready

}



Image {

  id: myImage // See? No quotes! A new language construct!

  source: "http://example.com/image.png"

}

You're preaching to the converted ;)

Ken-Young

2012-07-09 21:05

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic (Post 1234590)

With the same HTML5-dreck. Sorry, I can't describe it nicer than that. HTML is for text documents. Whoever thought it would be "good enough for apps" should have his/her's voting rights revoked.

It seems like every smartphone OS team goes through a one or two year phase when they think they don't need to supply decent native development tools and web apps can (really, this time for sure!!!) do everything. They'll eventually learn.

milanjakob

2012-07-09 21:14

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

I dont think that i will buy any Tizen based product. It will probable be just a second Bada, nothing innovative and to get excited about. And i dont like Samsung too much, dont ask me why.

Firefox OS could have also been added to the poll. Its open source linux with devices to be announced next year.

Dave999

2012-07-09 21:27

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by milanjakob (Post 1234838)

...

Firefox OS could have also been added to the poll. Its open source linux with devices to be announced next year.

Agreed. It could have but was removed.

Win7Mac

2012-07-09 21:28

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

It should have.
But he's not serious at all.
So just don't feed the troll.

Dave999

2012-07-09 21:33

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Win7Mac (Post 1234853)

It should have.
But he's not serious at all.
So just don't feed the troll.

It should?

This thread was created about Jolla vs tizen. Why should that been included in that discussion? Please read the thread. This is nt a thread about all available OSes out there. Why don't you create a poll for that?

Win7Mac

2012-07-09 22:03

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1234857)

It should?
This is nt a thread about all available OSes out there.

No. It's about possible future alternatives (to maemo/meego) with open source OS's. Aside from WP, iOS, Android.
You just ignored Firefox OS.
And sadly, you try to seperate. Instead of seeing conjunctions.

Dave999

2012-07-09 22:11

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Win7Mac (Post 1234877)

No its not its about TWO possible options. Please read the first post or the thread title.

I could have included lots of OSes if that was what the thread was about. But it's not. Sorry.

Win7Mac

2012-07-09 22:34

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Win7Mac (Post 1234877)

It's about possible future alternatives (to maemo/meego) with open source OS's. Aside from WP, iOS, Android.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1234881)

No its not its about TWO possible options. I could have included lots of OSes if that was what the thread was about. But it's not. Sorry.

Exactly.
If it's NOT about possible future alternatives (to maemo/meego) with open source OS's, then what's your point anyway?
And what about your major mobile vendor-announcement?
You bother, please hurry up.

Dave999

2012-07-09 22:55

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Win7Mac (Post 1234889)

What's the point? Take a look att Jolla's announcement. Take a look the poll. Read the poll. They have a momentum and stronger support than tizen. Tizen which is led by Samsung the biggest player at the moment. That is really strong support for Jolla it surprised me a little that so many was more interested in that over tizen with so little information available. But they have really strong support here. Good to know.
What about out it? If you have several maemo/meego devices this is the place to be, waiting for updates and stuff. You can leave but it nice to come back. Now, we are far off topic(thanks to you this time ;) ) , if you like to discuss it more you are welcome to pm me or post in the threads you are linking to or my countdown thread.

Win7Mac

2012-07-09 23:20

Re: Jolla VS Tizen Poll

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1234897)

If you have several maemo/meego devices this is the place to be, waiting for updates and stuff.

Yeah... surprised? Even thought about it before your TWO announcements?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave999 (Post 1234897)

Now, we are far off topic(thanks to you this time ;) ) , if you like to discuss it more you are welcome to pm me or post in the threads you are linking to or my countdown thread.

Yes, the countdown thread is almost as usefull as this one...
For the moment, I prefer to troll your thread this time. ;)

All times are GMT. The time now is 15:07.

Page 1 of 2

Next >

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

vBulletin® Version 3.8.8