Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

I heard Sailfish OS had several closed bits in it like Maemo. I heard that the user interface and the Jolla components were closed source. If Jolla is yet another Quasi-open source os like Maemo was then I will look elsewhere. Can anyone confirm that this is true or false?

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

http://www.legaljuice.com/closed%20sign.png

I'm pretty sure some things are closed, but that doesn't necessarily make it a bad OS. I'm sure Sailfish is just as closed or as open as other OSes.

http://itsopen.co.uk/site/wp-content...cial-media.png

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

yes it has closed components. Not that it matters. Every distro has some closed parts.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Yeah go look somewhere else and realise that there is NO fully opensource on embedded. Not even a hobbyproject like raspberrypi is fully opensource.

Silica will probadly be open. What will not is the apps and GFX stack etc...

There is already a thread about this here

Now please merge this thread.

The user interface and some components are closed as it has been stated by themselves several times BUT they also stated that this will/may change in the future. I think they are trying to protect the os components, ui, etc. from others untill & after the release since they don't have the power to patent everything.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Not really. Mobile ones do. I don't like the N9 vis'a'vis the N900 as the N9 is far more restricted. (besides I dont like the OS or hardware compared to N900.)

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

sailfish ui/ux is excellent, it does not matyer to me if the ui is open or closed.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Whether a UI is excellent or not is irrelevant. Openness is important.
edit: I realize drivers and what not will be closed but a platform should be open enough to port it to other hardware. The user interface is a pretty important component and should be open.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

For information on this you'll have to wait until the release. Too early to say what will be closed or open yet.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

That already implies "development behind closed doors". Which is already _at least_ as bad as Android. Fortunately though, there is Mer, so for at least the parts that are open, one can know they are "more open" than the other platforms.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Not just MER, also Nemomobile.

SailfishOS = Sailfish UI (closed for now), Nemomobile Middleware (open source and developed in the open), MER as core (open source and developed in the open) and Hardware Adaption (most stuff closed).

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Well atleast they use core unix/linux librarys different from that damn Android who is not even using glibc. Now people will cry about not using X11 but its dead beast anyway so time to move on.

So even if some is closed I prefer SailfishOS. And again if you think Tizen or Ubuntu edge is more open I just LOL.... Actually Ubuntu depends on Jolla...

And you have to realise that if they want to success on the masses they have to work with it "closed" or else it would be full playground of user input how UI should work.

After release I am sure it will be opened. Silica is already open like nokia qt-componets as BSD license. Only thing is we not yet has access to the repository but almost of the code is QML so its fully readable in the SDK.

Different with apps and drivers for several reason. Its time for people to understand that PC is NOT the same as embedded ARM platforms. Not even Raspberry pi/Beagle black drivers is fully open. Some modem is not fully open and so on. Especially not those highend GFX/cameras etc... Higend stuff that people want on the device...

As it seems now the phone will use libhybris means android GFX drivers, Reason the damn GFX drivers only exists for Android and is closed cause the GFX manufactors only has Android drivers. And there is no way Jolla could writing drivers from scratch in time not even if they did it open.

And if its so important that stuff is open pople could start contribute here:

http://www.github.com/nemomobile or http://www.github.com/mer-tools

Btw. just look in the logs most of the libs are used and contributed by Jolla employers.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

A better discussion can be: Why is jolla team so closed source. I haven't seen anything from them in months. They should defiantly be more open.

The only thing I've seen is this little t-shirt competition which is great. But seriously. Even the ubuntu campaign is 1000 times better than what jolla is doing, even if they don't have a phone ready they kick the jolla back to rookieland. Seriously, what is jolla thinking? are they embarrassed or what? Do they expecting that customers will through money at them when no one knows them? Come on...create some cool campaign or something so we can drum up some serious support...fu ****ing booooooooring to support jolla!

Ubuntu got Bloomberg to invest $80,000. That is serious ****. What is jolla doing? looking for $800 sponsorship from a seven-eleven copycat around the corner?

Just created a short list for jolla. Can add 1000 more things they can do if they want to be more successful and fun. I'm sure you also have some great suggestions. Let's hear them!

• Why not release some cool inside story including images/video of the progress or what ever?
• Create some chat/forum/Q&A where users can ask questions and show some openness and interest in their users?
• Create some suspect campaign to target the tech media?
• release their own beer or what ever?
• select a fan in every country that can be ambassador for jolla in that country/area(on in every continent) with also get the device a few days before they rest and can drum up support and demo videos.
• Just talk to some tech media to get anything out there?

I think the jolla device have a great chance to be a better overall smartphone than ubuntu edge that's why I don't understand how Jolla team can be so ignorant to the world and to it's potential users.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

I agree. But Jolla didn't really make it a secret, that they follow closed development before the first release. The hope was that they'll switch to open development after the release. So we'll have to wait and see if that will come to reality.

Firefox OS, Plasma Active and Nemo Mobile really have open development. Unfortunately Sailfish didn't follow that idea, yet.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

To me Jolla is starting to look DOA - I so much wished it to succeed but it seems to be they are having a bit of difficulty to part with some old ways that lead to the demise of a company we all know and used to love...

They started to cry wolf too soon and now, the momentum is gone and next time they probably won't be able to gather as large crowd when they come back and say "hey! Look what we have done!"

Time will tell... But as stated elsewhere on this thread, whoever is handling their marketing and PR needs to wake up and do something. Just anything, but do it YESTERDAY.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

You know you can't win yust with marketing - you kinda have to write the software and build the hardware as well. :-)

So if we don't hear that much from them because they are hard at work - I don't have an issue with that.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

You know, marketing guys usually not writing code and if they do Jolla has an even worse problem than I thought. You don't see a problem with a company containing only coders?

As important as the code is, they need a few more ingredients in a company to make to product successful.

"You know you can't win yust with marketing" - you are right about that, and noone is talking about JUST MARKETING, but just a little marketing...

Why not hijack some of the payback money from the successful ubuntu campaign if they don't reach 32 millions? Launch a 36 h campaign with paypal and they will get a few extra devices sold, got some media attention for free. just one example of what they can do easily with almost no manpower and almost no cost.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

different is jolla is actually developing and moving forward now thats a different from canonical who just marketing a phone who still dont exists...

and btw about nemo since when is nemo working without closed drivers!?

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

I actually hate to say this but: I'll take an excellent, closed, program *any day* before some opern source crap.

It's only by mere luck that most of the software I use is open source.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

There are open source application that are excellent too.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Sure. What I meant is that if there's a good, closed-source, alternative to a crappy, open-source, program, I'll take the former, unless I can fix the latter myself.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

So you take iOS over Sailfish?

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Lol. Hell no. I wouldn't touch iOS with a stick. Not because it's not open, but because it's not good (in *my* book).

As for Sailfish, I can't say for now. Will have to see it.

I guess I could now go and delete my comment. It was meant very very generally, i.e. without a particular program/OS in mind.

Jolla only has 80 employees who are doing their best to deliver a great phone+UI. Maybe they simply don't have the resources to market like or the compwtiotion, we are the fanboys we need to do it! Also if they are going to make te people wild 6 months before launch like Nokia always did they make the same mistake. Let them make advertisement a month before launch, December! Its a good month, people are spendig then so it wouldnt be a bad time to advertise and release!

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

So, can we start enumerating closed components now? It's good to make some table of what's closed and what's Android based and requires libhybris.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Every phone, maybe,

Every distro, no. Debian exists.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Jolla have stated over and over again that they have no problem with people porting it to other devices. They just won't allow other companies to port it to devices they plan to sell without paying. Myriad's Dalvik alone needs to be paid for in some way.

Android is not any better or more 'Open' in this regard. Every Android manufacturer pays Google to ship devices with their official closed source apps on it. The AOSP maintainer famously quit his job recently because of the closed nature of Google's flagship Nexus devices.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

If someone can post a package list, I'm happy to run through it and update with what I know.

I don't have a device with retail software to hand, so I'm not able to do that part.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

already posted http://people.debian.org/~timo/Jolla/jolla_packages.txt
source : http://losca.blogspot.com/2013/11/jo...party.html?m=1

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

And don't forget Fedora.[1][2] :)

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

Starting work on http://piratepad.net/JollaSoftwareState then.

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

w00t: So, most Sailfish specific packages remain closed now (browser, e-mail client and so on). Did Jolla already decide to keep them closed in the long term plans, or it's something not yet finalized?

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

I don't have any knowledge to comment about that, so let's say that as far as I know, it isn't finalized (on the basis that "no news means no decision")

Re: Sailfish OS Closed Source Components
 

I remember reading somewhere that they don't want someone else to steal their code prior to release and release a device before theirs. I think in a few months' time we may see a lot more open movement.

Right now they're still polishing their initial product (and even building new features), all of which have been designed already. Open source doesn't seem right at the moment.