SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

SailfishOS Update11 discussions

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Please add arrows to keyboard so you can navigate in forms like this on TMO. Put 50 developers on this task right now. I want the best Navigation in form that the earth has ever seen! Also Fix the cursor!!!! Its invisible :D
http://www.pilotfamily.com/android/k...d%20arrows.png

Add them below or above. Thanks in advance!

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

For once - I agree with you Dave!

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Yes and add a nice status bar

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Why a status bar? what kind of status bar do you want?

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

you fall very easy for my clever jokes and roothless sarcasm

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Ok, if you think it was a Fun joke :D IT wasent the best ive have read ;)

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

funky joke, was the best ive have

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

You know, there's something they should've included in the Monday update. It's a simple fix that would work wonders for Jolla. A bugfix, if you will. I'm not sure why they didn't take note of it yet, but it's pretty obvious.




Ship to North America.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

improve usage for one hand.

1. running app view... latest apps in bottom instead of top. or rotation by swipe from left or right.
2. app view...place apps at the bottom or let user place them anywhere on screen by drag and drop.
3. settlings list- airmode,wifi,mobile net, bluetooth. - move to buttom or middle or add movment of shortcuts on page(drag and drop)

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

^

"let user ..."

That could be "unlike"?

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

A simple fix for sure. If you pay for the inevitable FCC certification, you'd have the chance to get a phone shipped to the states that will only be able to utilize 2G there, because the highspeed networks are all incompatible. ;)

I think the better option for the US would be to support the porting to Android devices.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

exactly my thoughts, please vote for this
https://together.jolla.com/question/...bottom-to-top/

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

+1 for "let the user place them". I don't like it how my apps wander around my multitasking view.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Maybe you will be able to pick it up in Cuba soon, without bothering about FCC. ;)

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Since browser is getting better and better, it needs more integration. I desperately ask for scrolling bar like other Silica components, I cannot live without them anymore!

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

How about opening a feature request here for it: https://github.com/sailfishos/sailfish-browser

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

I hope U11 having having some focus on usabilty improvments in GUI. Its seriously in need of that.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Usability improvements such as?

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Stated some of them in this thread some of them in the usability thread. But basacally, sony xperia ultra 6,4 inch is far faster to use onehanded. Now, its a new month so can we expect a new update this month. 30 days to go.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Hmm, let me think. Starting with general OS/global UI improvements...

1. Fix the random forced app shutdown introduced in U10.
2. Add cursor keys or some other navigation method to the default keyboards. In all language variants.
3. Implement proper cut-and-paste that would work consistently the same way in all apps.
4. Bring back the status bar or at least put on a single screen all the info the status bar would have normally shown. Having to swipe all over the place to see the clock, connection status, signal level, battery level etc. is quite annoying.
5. Merge the lock screen with the notification screen to turn two pointless screens into a single sensible one.
6. Stop app covers moving randomly around the home screen. Ideally let the user place them or at least keep them in one place.
7. Fix the pulley menus for apps with long scroll contents. I have to give Jolla some credit there as they cleverly avoided pulley menus in the stock browser. Something similar is desperately needed in all apps with a lot of contents: email clients, text editors...
8. Allow the use of some sensible icons for the Launcher folders.
9. Allow the use of gaps (empty space in place of an icon) in Laucher.
10. Implement a proper file picker for the use in any app, with a particular focus on making the access to the SD card easier.
11. Skip the pointless <SD card ID> in the path to the SD card contents.
12. Add a "new voicemail" notification.
13. Have a proper dbus or similar mechanism so that tapping on a file in any file manager opens the file in an associated application.

...continuing with specific apps:

1. Display the number of characters/messages when typing an SMS.
2. Implement an option for faster email deletion. Ideally to delete them right away instead of moving to Deleted or have a tickbox to purge Deleted on exit.
3. Delete emails properly, including all folders with downloaded attachments.
4. Fix/implement proper email folder handling:
   a) Let the user order them or at least make the order consistent across accounts
   b) Allow the email client create, delete and freely move contents between folders, including across accounts
   c) Implement folder subscription
5. Do not show the emails preview when you have multiple accounts. Show just the list of accounts on starting the email app and either do not show the previews at all or leave it for until after the user enters one of the accounts. At least make it optional.
6. Add a "make link" to File Browser options.
7. Add bookmarks to File Browser.
8. In the absence of #13 in the above list, have an "open with..." option in File Browser.

I could think of dozens more. These are just a very brief shortlist I bashed out in a few minutes.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

And that is only tip of the iceberg?

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

@pichlo has really thouhght this hard! :D

For me the biggest inconvenience was the browser-hit-link-inaccuracy which was corrected in update 10.

For everything else I need there are corrections&tweaks :)

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

I was asking Dave999 specifically pichlo as in the past he's just not understood many sailfish UI gestures such as navigating a page stack using gestures instead of pressing the top buttons but I'd have to disagree with the majority of those changes.

File Browser is not Jolla's btw, it's third party and the source is up on github.

https://github.com/karip/harbour-file-browser

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Not a huge priority, because 9 times out of 10 you can see those anyway with a single swipe or a triple tap.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Not that hard ;)

Really? So the OS willy-nilly closing apps behind your back does not bother you? (Yes, I know there is a workaround that you no doubt have applied. I will come to that.)

Besides, ITYM "mostly corrected". It still happens sometimes, even in Vaarainjärvi, albeit about 100x less than before. When it does happen, however, the misclick is not a few mm off, but half the screen.

Even one click is too many when a solution exists that provides the same thing without a single click.

Sure there are tweaks/workarounds/ways to deal with OS/UI/usability defficiencies. The point is that there do not have to be. You (plural) ask for suggestions for usability improvements. I have offered a few. That's something called constructive criticism, you know ;)

Quite right, my deepest apologies.
In that case,

14. Provide an official file manager.

:p

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

There actually was one (jolla-fileman or something, you could install it through pkcon) but it was just a proof of concept and stopped working after Qt 5.2.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

@pichlo i cannot agree with the most of your "general OS/global UI improvements". Seems you just don't understand most of essential things. You might need to buy Android phone and be happy with it.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Please skip these kind of lines. But rather explain to us if you are the only one that knows how the worlds spins?

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Every file manager in the store is official.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

okay, let's do it

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

I'm with coderus on this one... I don't want things like e.g., a status bar as I don't need to be checking e.g., the time of the day _all the time_.

Having said this, I'm sure there is room for improvement and that people's opinions vary; thankfully, we have TJC where you can vote and gauge how many of us are for or against an idea.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Agreed with some points mentioned before.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

In addition to what Dave999 said, here is a rundown of the phones I used in the past 15 years:

• Motorola V3690
• Motorola T191
• PalmTreo 600
• A bunch or Bada and Android phones that I don't care to remember because I never beared with any of them for more than a week
• Nokia N900
• Nokia N9
• Jolla Jolla ***

Apart from real Android, guess which of the above list is the most Android-like? Hint: it's the (tripple) star of the show ;)

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

But android-like is just iphone-wannabe-like

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

That's not information you need on the screen 100% of the time. Sailfish solution is almost as it should be, one thing I would change is put it on the lock screen without the need for that extra tap. When you're inside an app the peek gesture is perfect.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Not sure what's the relevance here, but since Coderus was talking about the UI, I think that from the list you offered, N900 is closest to Android (status bar, widgets, on-screen back button) and Jolla is as far as one can get :)

That being said, there's nothing wrong with it - it's all about preference. But what you're suggesting is changing the features that define SailfishOS.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

Yes, let's ;)

1. ...
2. ...
3. ...
4. Bring back the status bar or at least put on a single screen all the info the status bar would have normally shown. Having to swipe all over the place to see the clock, connection status, signal level, battery level etc. is quite annoying.
   - Seems you need to buy Android phone. SailfishOS doesn't fit your requirements.
   - See my above post regarding my tolerance of Android.
5. Merge the lock screen with the notification screen to turn two pointless screens into a single sensible one.
   - Lockscreen already showing notifications.
   - So you can tap on an email notification icon in the lock screen to open the email, right? Sorry, I clearly do not understand the basics as it somehow never worked for me.
   Toothless notifications are no notifications. Which makes them pointless.
6. ...
7. Fix the pulley menus for apps with long scroll contents. I have to give Jolla some credit there as they cleverly avoided pulley menus in the stock browser. Something similar is desperately needed in all apps with a lot of contents: email clients, text editors...
   - You don't like main SailfishOS features again.
   - Then neither does Jolla itself. Pullies are great but Jolla itself realized their weakness and implemented a way to avoid them in certain cases. Browser is one example, Gallery another. Can you suggest a way to save a long text file in the middle of editing by using pulley menus without losing your current position in the file?
8. ...
9. Allow the use of gaps (empty space in place of an icon) in Laucher.
   - No, Please don't! No sh*t in SailfishOS please.
   - Agreed. I would also prefer the possibility to place the icons exactly where I like. You know, like on a real desktop. But, well, gaps are a second best thing. (There is a Harmattan precedence, BTW. A 3rd party solution, not stock Nokia.)
10. ...
11. Skip the pointless <SD card ID> in the path to the SD card contents.
    - It's not pointless.
    - OK, so please enlighten me.
12. ...
13. Have a proper dbus or similar mechanism so that tapping on a file in any file manager opens the file in an associated application.
    - It's already here and working exactly same way as you described.
    - I know it's there. Only not used. I don't know if it an apps' fault of the OS's but I find it strange that the mechanism works in every file manager on the N900 but none of them on the Jolla.

Hmm. You found objections to 6 out of my 13 points. That's less than 50%, hardly "most" ;) And I might just as easily accuse you of basing "most" of your 6 on uncritical fanboyism rather than objective consideration.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

The relevance here is the irony of sending me to buy one.

Obviously when we look at the same thing, we notice different details. My first impression when I started using N9 after a couple of years on the N900 was, "hey, that looks just like Android!" No desktop, forced vertical layout in system screens, flowing app list instead of a menu, line-oriented Settings, a pointless lock screen... In short, no longer a proper desktop experience in your pocket.

When I got my first Jolla, my reaction was, "hey, just like Harmattan!" Only with the points I listed above they are even further away from a real desktop (and therefore closer to Android) than the N9.

In terms of the UI... To use an analogy with colours, I would call a real desktop such as Gnome 2, LXDE, Windows XP or Windows 7 various shades of green. Maemo is turqoise. Harmattan, Sailfish, Android, iOS, they are all different shades of red. That's how much they resemble each other and how far they are from the green side of the spectrum.

I am not saying that it is a bad thing either. Both N9 and Jolla are phones (even though I prefer calling the Jolla "phone" a tablet, due to the size), not pocket computers like the N900. But the irony of sending me to buy an Android phone is just too baffling.

Re: SailfishOS Update11 discussions
 

I have to give some credit to pichlo here. We may not agree on all solutions, but most of the points really show some weakness.

For example, one point where we agree is on the lockscreen.

I like the sailfish way of hiding everything unnecessary, but don't understand why on the lockscreen which is basically an empty screen, they have volontarily hidden usefull things that you would expect when unlocking the phone: battery and network levels.

As I see it, if you take out the phone of the pocket and you first unlock it, then you should see that you have no reception or no more battery, so there is no need to go further.

On the current solution you have to tap the lockscreen to make it jump a second to try to see the levels, or slide it a bit to have time to read them. And 90% of the lock screen is unused.... it's not like thoses have been removed to use the space for more important stuff (like when you are in an app).

Another example on the lockscreen is that the date and network name are shown one at a time... ? Why ? 90% of the screen is unused, and when you want to check on which network you are when roaming or near the boundary, you have to wait 3 seconds on the lock screen for the network name to appear. At least, it looks like the date is always the first one shown when unlocking which is probably the one we want to see most of the time.

So even as a proud supporter of the UI principles of sailfish, I can see a lot of things can be improved, not by throwing the principles away, but moving small things and adding some missing functions or interactions. Shooting "Android" to anyone that sees some weakness in the current sailfish implementation is not gonna help.

And thanks to all those who made patches to improve those things already !