Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

MS now craves good publicity, they organize things like Debian 8 release celebration (this cost them at least 50k), release first program that works straight away on linux ('code' for visual studio), sharp was open sourced, what a great time for maemo, because MS bought maemo from nokia. Open sourcing it costs them 0, and we can bring tons of good publicity just by cheering. Slashdot, reddit, you name it, will write about MS doing what nokia never could, so much more open they would be. Next announcement maemo programs run natively on windows 10 :D

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

it costs them lawyer fees?

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

MS unlike nokia have 1k lawyers hired around the clock, checking maemo is a little nuisance, still covered by running costs (edit: and they just bought it, you believe it wasn't lawyer reviewed before buying?)

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Did they buy it or was it just baggage that came with the bits of Nokia that they bought? ;)

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

not if they see this post
goddammit
:p

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

It's not like the right thing to do, becomes wrong when someone is discussing it. Shhh... lets not give them any ideas or they might open source whole windows

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Good point, it might be like the ark of the covenant in indiana jones disappearing in a warehouse. But worth a try? They really appreciate good PR in the open source community since a while, dusting off that crate might stil be possible?

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

To be honest, I think we should really get in touch with MS, if not for opensourcing maemo (I don't believe it will happen), but for allowing the community to host the stuff that was on OVI and Nokia repos.

Do we still have council (seriously, I got lost in all this 3 letter abbreviations)? Or it is some other entity that should initiate that contact.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

just call this guy...

http://www.livemint.com/rf/Image-621...p--621x414.jpg



GL with that :D

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

They are in 'we LOOOVE open source here in Microsoft, soon we will adopt motto do no evil' phase, might as well ask them for the source, can we get anyone with high following to tweet at them?

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

I don't think they even have that source code. But sure, ask them, why not.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Microsoft opening things up?
Hahahaha.
I hazard it will more likely be akin to the scene where the nazis opened the ark and got all face-melty and screamy with lightning bolts and wrath and such.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Iam pretty sure they are very well informed on this forum, as well as anything related.
They see, think, makes a decision. Done.
They most likely already made a decision on how, when, if, on the survival of our platforms.
The silence is probably not a good sign.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

:D:D:D
On the 3 meetings (two postponed) there was exactly 1 person who could explain what open source is, and they talked about costs.
Sure, TMO is not big in itself, but in mobile linux online world it can be huge. First 'kickstarted' reverse engineering effort to 'open source' wlan chip on n900? Here, we did crowdfunding before it was cool. If we get someone with big enough following just reaching to MS they can (and should) reach this conclusion: uber geeks, free PR, lets do it.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

They believed in the same, until it turned out google survived the ordeal

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

if ms has maemo codes then what is hildon foundation?

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Btw, I stole the title: https://youtu.be/kz9JaQP8bPQ?t=3m1s

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

yah, for sure Microsoft would do this. The first thing they did when buying Nokia was to close all n900 resources and tools.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Not true:
http://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/mobil.../product/n900/

http://blogs.windows.com/devices/201...e-release-1-2/

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/mobil...oftwareupdate/

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/m...4-4b6714a3af59

In fact MS is now the only company that has any FAQ/help files for n900

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Ok, most resources anyways.. and not only for Nokia N900.

I am just basing it on all te dead links about Nokia N900 in search engines and so which leads to horrible Lumia pages and the fact that all firmware and such was removed, followed by making maps unusable (Nokia) which was a devestating blow at the time.

Luckily we are blessed to have a community area like this where most resources are available

Was it Nokia or Microsoft who closed the community to force the now indepeence of this place?

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Do not mistake contractual obligations for the 'will of a company'. Neither Nokia, nor MS wants to keep us around, MS just has to. On the other hand they are trying to be more like Google from the old days, open source happy and community building happy (until they can F that all and concentrate on closed source gapps once everybody believed they are kewl). Which doesn't exactly stop anyone from taking advantage of their open source PR happiness. Hey company X, you state you are for FOSS and even throw a party for debian, why not give us sources. Get a journalist or two on that and maybe we can see results (but apathy and disbelief trumps everything anyway, nevermind)

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

The problem is that one common reason for keeping software closed is because you don't even own the copyright. Obvious example is the flashplayer for Maemo. Nokia was allowed to distribute it, but could not single-handedly decide to open source it.

If Microsoft were to release the source code of whatever closed bits Maemo has, they would need to ask every single one of the copyright holders for permission (and this is assuming the source code is even available, either to Microsoft or to the original developers).

In short: it ain't gonna happen. Full stop.

For all I care the future, even for the N[eo]900, is either Mer/Nemo or some debian adaptation. We're lucky that the N900 sort-of-works with upstream kernel (though still a lot needs to be done). This puts us in a very very special situation compared to basically every other handset being sold.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

In the aforesaid example, Adobe Flash isn't really a necessary/essential part of the OS and since it's no longer in production for any mobile device it just doesn't hit with a priority.

Why not use the Nokia N900 BME as an example instead? Nokia, thus Microsoft owns the code, it was never released; just reversed-engineered.

I think that's piss poor for a so-called "open" phone that was touted to be more open than Android. And it wasn't released because of supposedly being written so badly.... if it were open, then it could have been "righted". If Microsoft releases it, they might inherit a potential time waster for something that they'd rather just hopefully disappear.

Or they could release it, as-is, without condition or guarantee and I think that would perhaps be best.

But as it stands, and do not get me wrong... I'm a Maemo fan; this has dented my faith in whatever comes out as "open" in the near future due to lack of support once it gets out of the spotlight. I do not consider reverse-engineering a great option whenever this kind of situation arises.

So with that said... I agree. Microsoft... release the damn files. We don't even want a guarantee. Just access.

Realistically, we know it will not happen.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

I don't think Maemo was ever touted to be more free/open source than Android, at least not by Nokia. Sure, there are plenty of fan boys on this forum that have said that. For me comparing the openness of the two is apples and oranges.

Right now, Android is ahead in this area, thanks in no small part to the Replicant project. Replicant can however only run on a small number of devices. Android has always had AOSP but it's not possible to build the complete Android environment from that.

With Maemo, we're still waiting on the excellent work from the Fremantle Porting Task Force. Progress is slow but I think they will get there eventually, probably without all of the features and services that Maemo 5 originally shipped with.

Maemo for me, has never been completely about being open source, otherwise I'd probably be using a Replicant device. The draw towards Maemo is more about interoperability with existing Linux OSs: glibc, X11, the ease of porting existing software, etc. In this sense of the word, it's way more open than Android.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Search back... it was touted here as being more open than Android or some other ********.

I thought so too at the time. Now, I wonder where all of that fanboyism has gone where the support has dried up. A lot of it, looking backwards, was just a knee-jerk reaction from this forum to support what they thought was the proper way forward.

Microsoft, via Stephen Elop, ended that quickly. But I'd rather state that the Nokia board, the folks that hired Elop, that allowed each and every Maemo device to inherit only one iteration of the Maemo OS for the most part (I know that's not 100% true including Hacker Editions and the N800/N810, but **** semantics for the moment) and in the end I just don't think the claims were justified then nor are they echoed as much now.

Simply put, it was ******** then, it's ******** now.

Kudos to those guys.

Glad this has been said...

We disagree here, but that's from an experience standpoint - which I have limited use nor experience in this to state otherwise. But this is an interesting point, one totally worth pondering.

Thanks for posting and giving me an alternate take. It's appreciated.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

@gerbick: as for 'completely unsupported phone' development (cssu and apps) and users (forums) are quite active. as for 'release the files': citing doc/joerg: it's better to stay under m$ radar

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Does maemo program runs in windows 10 now? Seems have issues :(

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Who does not have issues with Windows 10?

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

I have no issues with any windoze version whatsoever..

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Because you are not using Windoze! ;)

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Microsoft has little choice BUT to show the linux love...
looking at the landscape currently...
wp is on it's way out imo...
windows 10 is mentioned as being the "last" in the line...(whatever that means...) which really throws the mind into wondering exactly where Microsoft is going to go into the future...
My guess is...
(and so it appears and is currently evolving...towards..)
a more integrated marriage with linux...
at best...
All the "love" aside....
They do not do anything without a long term purpose in mind...

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Correct, give the man a cigar! ;)

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Define issues.

As another tool, another OS, I have had no issues with it and I'm running the Fast Track Insider Ring builds; so I deal with updates pretty no issues. In fact, compared to my last install (VM) of Mint and Ubuntu, less issues than those and far less issues than macOS 10.12 beta (read: Google Chrome does not like this version yet).

Now... if we're bringing in the privacy concerns; hell yes I have issues. But just getting things to run that support my toolset and livelihood; no issues yet.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

lol, I can just hear you rapping that, “I've got 99 issues, but windoze ain't one”

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Things that used to run fine not running any more.

EDIT: Including things that are designed specifically for and bundled with Windows 10. Such as Edge.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

I run both Linux and Windows. Laptop is only Linux and has had multiple versions, Fedora, Debian and now Arch. PCs are always Windows with Linux available in some form.

Windows has definately improved for me over the years. Sure you get a few app compatibility issues (Bioshock 1+2 are one that come to mind) but the actual OS has become pretty rock solid for me. I feel it still gets some unfair treatment. The privacy issues can be solved via 3rd party tools or manually if you're comfortable doing that.

1st PC: Windows 98 (1st edition), not greatest. Windows crashed on 1st ever boot/setup out of the box and had to run a full scandisk check. Had a hardware/driver issue appear after several years. Wouldn't say it was a driver issue as nothing really changed in updates. Also had Mandrake 9.2 installed, after bricking a previously unknown brand cd drive during installation. Found a small label afterwards, Goldstar = LG, which interpreted flush cache as update firmware. Could never work out hardware issue because every option ended with why does Linux work.

2nd PC (using good bits of 1st): 98 1st again with install transfered from old machine. Nothing but the odd blue screen. Upgraded to XP 1a adding another 256MB RAM. Only issue was installing Office 97 (for other family members, I had OO.org) which had to be done prior to SP3 install. Occasional blue screen. Linux running via CoLinux.

3rd (1st self built): Vista. Hand on heart don't remember having 1 blue screen from 2007/8 up to summer 2014. Gets a lot of criticism but I never had an issue with it. In some ways more secure than 7 as they relaxed permissions (less pop up are you sure messages) on some componenets. Virtualbox used from now on.

4th (current): 7 Home Premium, won't touch 8 with a barge pole. Can't say, never actually installed as I ordered wrong version by mistake (too much RAM). Sent back and replaced with Pro. No issues what so ever, no blue screens.
Upgraded to 10 Pro end of July. One issue with settings manager cured by a reboot. Can't say about Anniversary update as it hasn't appeared in update yet but not too fussed as they have to sort issue with game controller.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

May I make the suggestion to not use Edge? Even Microsoft Business Support claims that Edge is "not ready for primetime" and has issued a tool to switch one organization I consult for back to using IE11 (yikes) for internal application (read: internally developed AngularJS web apps) and Edge just basically chews those up.

A 1.0 browser which acts a whole lot better than some of these other browsers that we use on our devices, performance-wise when it works, is a decent start. But I agree; Edge does totally suck.

But there are other options. I suggest using something else that has proven itself to work more regularly.

But other than Edge - which is iffy at best - I cannot come up with any particular issues. I could nitpick all day though. There are some serious inconsistencies in their UI and some legacy items, such as Device Manager, does not properly render on HiDPI enabled devices including their own Microsoft Surface.

To note, we define issues differently though. The fact that I've had a wi-fi driver work flawlessly for the last 4 years and this last update basically rendered it incompatible and the fix is some convoluted manner that would make the layman cringe (personally I can't wait to fix this damn thing) is what I'd label an issue.

It's not like Microsoft would release an update that causes device freezing, locking up and hindering performance...

For the record, that last one is what I'd call an issue, luckily I am not affected.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

You better rewite maemo before that code will be released if it still exists.

Re: Get Microsoft to release the goddamn files
 

Why can't someone just leak the sources!? :(