Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Hello fellows,
I will not speak of burgers.. Of course the subject is N900.

In 2017 my N900 rocks and is almost my primary phone, camera, linux box, ssh device, music player, notes, etc.. Maybe the camera lacks a bit, but because some humidity/dust filtrations..

Coming to the thread: the main weak point for a suck intense usage is the battery. I am working on wireless and solar charging to do not wear much the USB connector and to increase the phone day availability.

BUT, I would explore the possibility to increase/double/triple the battery.

This thread is for hardware gurus such as Estel or dr_frost_dk..

I checkout their contribution and look also the entire forum, but at the moment seems there are no currently available options (like mugen cover, it is no longer sold).

The question for the community is, somebody know some option/suggestion/websites/vendors/3D printing schematic to achieve the "extended battery" purpose?

Thank you all.
Best.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Joined -- haveing the same issue, quite similiar the same usage pattern.

so let's join our efforts please!

peb

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

want better battery saving?



depending on a supplier of batteries and specific covers...
dwindling away...with every passing year...

Is not the way to go.

This is a better ..

DIY...

take an old n900 battery...
take it apart.
remove the battery guts...
attach requisite wires from battery shell interior to exterior of n900..
place battery back into the n900..with pre-drilled hole in back cover of n900 with rubber gasket in it...so dust and moisture do not get in...pull wires through...
connect ..
to the output of this...
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/LM317-Adjusta...item2104ab1388

adjust voltage...
connect a wire with usb end to the input...of the LM317

Use any battery storage device...utilizing usb....or any storage device that utilizes an adapter that fits a standard usb...
Or plug into any wall outlet using an adapter...
or plug straight into the usb of a computer to utilize it's power.

I suggest as well to make an enclosure for the LM317
and to fix and set the voltage dial so it doesn't get altered ...accidentally.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Hello to both,
I am happy to see here endsormeans, because I see (after I wrote this thread) that he was dealing on maemo parts (http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=93325).
I had my tries, some bad other something better, but I am generally unsatisfied.
I am pretty busy now, but I would like to share my experience here later.
About what is speaking endsormeans, I think it is not the best/recommended solution because is bulky, inefficient and a bit dangerous for the battery.
You can prefer this (I already mounted it on my phone, and I will show picture later):

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...arger&_sacat=0

They are safe, compact and micro USB.

Please be patient soon I will share details.

Best.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

heya Ilmanowar...
good to see you too :D

Well..
your mentioned board is an option...
possibly it is a little safer...
But when dealing with batteries inside the device (n900)
anything can happen...

concerning
"About what is speaking endsormeans, I think it is not the best/recommended solution because is bulky, inefficient and a bit dangerous for the battery."
Wellllll
I am not sure if you quite get it...
or perhaps you may be referring to something else...
But ...there is no battery inside the n900 with utilization of the LM317...(not in the traditional sense of the word "battery" anyway..)

the LM317 essentially removes that issue.
there is no battery inside the n900...just the shell of the battery..to provide proper normal Nokia BL5J battery connection to the contacts inside the n900...and inside the battery shell ...only leads that go to the LM317...
which from there one can fine tune the output to the n900 battery shell...and at the same time offers surge and power fluc protection...
the power input does not need to be a battery...it can be direct usb power from a wall outlet or computer or battery bank ...

No matter what ...a battery melting down inside the n900 won't happen.
since there isn't a battery in the n900..

what may happen in the form of some unforeseen risk to the external source of power ..is possible and cannot be ruled out.
But considering the protection and distance from the n900..the likelihood is that the n900 will not be physically affected unless the source of the power is in close proximity...
Even still...the step down does have protections to impede such possibility from occurring.

What may happen is the setting on the LM317 could be altered accidentally ..if it is not fixed and set so it must be "unlocked" to move the dial and alter the input to the n900...
well then...it is possible to damage the n900 ..
But this risk to the n900 is purely in the hands of the individual...as to whether or not they wish to put a "safety" on the dial...so it cannot be accidentally moved and hence increase or decrease power accidentally if the dial is jarred, hit or moved.

I dislike messing with batteries...
I do like taking the risk of tampering with batteries out of the equation completely...by simply removing the battery guts...and utilizing the shell.

And I certainly like not having to rely on either fake bl5j's ...old bl5j's....refurbished bl5j's...
but have free choice to pick a method of power source.

the LM317 may not be the most compact and pocket portable ideal...
but it sure helps solve some issues.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

OK, now I understood, my blame I do not catch it before.

Then what you propose is safe enough after you set a voltage near 4V.

I like a lot more what you done in the mentioned thread because I do not want to compromise to much portability.

What kind of material you used to add that white (black painted) layer to double the battery space?

I reproduced it with modelling foam, later I hardened with cyanoacrylate but the results is not as desired (pictures later).

I would like to 3D print it, but first how to model it? Somebody has a 3D file of that?

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

ah...the double decker n900 sandwich eh?
hahaha
yeah it was fun to make...
I used elk antler...for the original.
(I have been a period -piece carver since a child...and the spacer was easy...)
then I used the original to make casts ...
and then made resin casts of the the original.
in plastics...
and hybrid combinations of resins and plastics and powdered metals...and antler powder...stone powders ...
fun...
but it went nowhere...interest wise .
So I moved on and abandoned any further work on it..
Like many other such projects..
I did them...
worked on them...
completed them..
moved on.


And I cannot take credit for the LM317 step down
Another member suggested it to me...
and I wired up a n800 with one...

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Sometimes seems lacking of interest, but other times it is a visibility problem.

Our community activity is going to reduce with time, just few people interested must be considered as a big hit.

By the way, it was a nice experiment and it is good that remains documented on that page: people can see it randomly, as I done.

My sandwich do not close tide and sometimes fall apart (I do not use anything sticky to get everything closed, I do not glue it to maintain the possibility to access to the inner of the phone). As we know the camera is affected by a reduction of the vision field. While the mmc can work with a small magnet.

After a trial period, I decided to abandon this solution. But I can consider it again if it can fit better. With a 3D printed layer it could be OK.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

yup...
totally agree on the numbers issue.

that is one of the biggest hurts to the n900 subcommunity..
since maintaining function and programs is such a huge thing..for the n900..
whereas the n8x0's still seem to be going strong despite having no maintainers at all anymore ...(of course there are the few things needing maintaining for the n8x0 too...but they are trivial in compare to all the n900 stuff that needs to kept up...)

I enjoy my n8x0's more than my n900's frankly...
and use them more...

In the end...hopefully ...some open maemo os ...
or even a shell of a maemo de and wm ...
a "cosmetic look" of maemo ...
will survive that will run on any linux device.
Even that...I would be quite content with.

In the end I see the future of my interest in handhelds moving to the pi and slowly or quickly leaving the nxx0...

more and more I see advancements with the pi...
towards goals which we all ..pretty much have been wishing for ...
portable linux handheld computers ...
(that can ...if so desired have telephony ...though that isn't a deal breaker for me..since a cheap flip is durable and does a good job...)...

I just hope that maemo (in some kind of form) can make a transition to an alternate device...
Because everyone else either has...can...or will inevitably have no choice but to make the transition...

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

I love my N810 sound quality and loud.

Raspberry Pi is a nice device, I use it a lot, but my main phone device is a N900. It will remains for a while yet, even if I already have other phones (mainly a cheap Samsung).

I write/program a lot, then I must have a good qwerty physical keyboard on my phone.

Frankly I do not see reason to have maemo on other devices, to me it is perfect just on phones.
E.g. Pi has a pure debian OS that works great, maemo will not be a real plus on Pi.

Off topic, I share some Pi uses: I use Pi as rsync server between my phones, FTP sync and remote storage, house alarm, presence control, remote switch, remote camera. It provides a VPN wifi too.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

yup yup...
n810 got it nice with sound ...
I tend to use my n800's though ...instead ...for audio and film..
since the quality I find is better..louder...with the l/r speakers on the front of the device facing the viewer who is watching or listening...than my n810's l/r speakers on the sides...

Just a pity that in designing the n810 ...
Nokia didn't take ALL the n800's best qualities and dump them in the n810 accordingly...

woulda-shoulda-coulda....

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Interestingly...
have to wait and see what chen is up to with his revisionist work ...

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Hello,
sorry for my delay, but pictures must be resized to upload here.

This is my sandwich try with modelling/prototype foam.
After it cured I cut off the exceeding part.
Unfortunately drying it shrink and fall apart.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

This is how it appear after the first trimming.
Later I try to add some super-glue (cyanoacrylate) to increase rigidity, but the super-glue curing process release heat that shrunk more the foam.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

This was the piece separated.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Later I cut it to obtain the most possible space in it.
Since it shrunk I cut it in several parts to fill it with some pieces of paper to expand it.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

I tried also hot-glue, it was unsatisfactory too..

This picture was with hot-glue, and it shows the components: a large Samsung battery in parallel to one N900 compatible battery.
I keep just one battery circuit.

I add a charging module together a contact less charger.
This last worked not as I expect, since the original cover is too much thick.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Here a detail of the contact less charging coil.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

All this tries came out from my worn micro USB connector (it was charging some times, and other not).

Therefore I use this external coil setup on an old cover adapted for the use.
It works well, better that the sandwich setup (the sandwich/spacer solution has some problems with the camera open/close activation, tunnel view to the camera, and I was obligated to add a magnet to enable MMC recognition).

Of course the coil is visible because I extracted it for demonstration purposes.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Since, the wireless charging I used was slow, inefficient and tricky in the positioning of the phone, I switched to another solution (see my last picture. This solution uses magnetic micro-USB plugs (WSKEN brand, you can found it on ebay). I like how they works and I have them in my car, at home and work. This is my definitive solution to USB wearing and short battery duration.

On request I can add more details or pictures.
I hope it is useful to somebody.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

I like what you are trying and doing and
of course im interessted in the usb mod (if it isnt too much trouble).
How sturdy is the usb magnet connection?

Did your camera gain dark corner spots, because of the "spacer" or did it fit?
Did the sd card still work, after lifting the magnet?

Do you know if your samsung battery has build in protection? Did you solder it? The size seems nice. Is it 1500 mah 4.5 mm thick?

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Hello pythoneye2,
the USB magnet solution are really nice and strong.
The circle connector attach very well with force and it does not have orientation. For cons I can say that it is just for powering and just a bit bulkier than the other.
The connector oval/rectangular is with all the pins (allow data transmission), it is just a bit smaller, but it is a bit less strong and to attack correctly you need to respect orientation (cannot attach upside down).

Yes, it is, the spacer makes dark angles (what I stated as tunnel vision). Not nice.. It is reduced a lot if you limit dimensions (the spacer thickness). You can test yourself, if the battery is not to much bulky and the electronic is slim too, the effect is barely visible.

The magnet acts on the magnetic switch (that normally is on the battery cover. It is the same magnet that keeps the table-holder closed in side. If you install a magnet the MMC is powered on, if you remove it, the MMC is unmounted and powered off.
In that moment, I leaved the magnet fixed with bi-adhesive tape.
Therefore each time I open the cover, or it fell apart the MMC remained powered on and working. This is dangerous if you want to hot-remove the MMC (I mean when the phone is on): it can potentially corrupt/destroy the MMC.

Almost al phone battery must have the protection. I think there are no unprotected Samsung battery: I remove it (pretty simple but keep eyes open to do not short circuit the battery). And remember to have a B-plan in case the battery break, during these kind of operation. Stay far from inflammables elements, no water (reacts with lithium), fire-extinguisher is a good add-on, but I admit I do not have. :rolleyes:
I must say that some battery gone crazy, heating for an internal shot circuit, but they were low cost Chinese batteries. When happen keep dissipating the heat and after discharged they became safe (just safe to trash unfortunately).

Correct! That battery was 1500mA and yes a good size, the phone last a couple of days of very intensive use to me.
The battery was soldered, there is no better way to use unprotected battery. Remember to execute fast soldering junctions. If you are slow you overheat the battery, and it can damage, apart that it is risky..
And, use brand new and similar quality battery when used in parallel to assure good and safe results.

When I will have a real home, I will buy a 3D printer to print the spacer.. but till then maybe all the N900 phones will be dead..

Otherwise much better the magnetic connector.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

I have done most of the hacks considered in this thread, double cell, inductive charging (Qi and Touchstone) I have rebuilt the USB port and I have installed a secondary charging board inside a Mugen bulged case. I have not tried any 3D printed solutions despite doing that as aprt of my work as I have found that 3D printed thin shell objects are very fragile and I dont feel like getting into the effort of making a injection mold for a one-off and I have zero desire to do production.

-double cells in a Mugen cover tend to flex the board and I have lost 2 N900s to the no-SIM, I might try to reball them but my current N900 works fine

-Magnet cables are a cool solution but I end up with metal dust on me, it accumulates and I have had it attract to the magnetic attach cable and put on a small pyrotechnical show resulting in a melted cable end

-Qi(see my thread) add on kits can be cool if you are up to making the data short pins, also precludes OTG which I use. Of any except for the fragility of an unprotected ribbon cable it is not a bad solution, I might revisit it now that I have a Otter case but USB into a little Sharp Zaurus style drop-in USB charging base works for now. That and without the alignment magnets of the Touchstone system Qi is hit or miss for getting an overnight charge, I don't ever even use it on the devices I own which have it factory installed.

-Touchstone, this with a charge controller inside a Mugen double cell case worked pretty good for a N900 with a ripped free USB pad, the SM soldering is a PITA and airport security gets freaked out by the bomb phone.

-FDM 3D print of a Mugen cover clone, would be fragile and all the Acetone in the world is not enough, these parts need to be injection molded or formed sheet thermoplastic.

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

Hello biketool,
the acetone was to remove cracks or to reduce fragility?

I am not an expert of 3D printing, but I think that choosing the right material, and increasing the thickness it could work.. Is it?

Do you know where is possible to find a Mugen cover in 2018?

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

by the way.. really funny the phone bomb situation.. I could had to happen to me too, but fortunately never..

Re: Oversize me! (battery thread)
 

the acetone 'melts' the ABS plastic by partially dissolving it into a goo, but a single or even several layer print even at high temp is still only as strong as the contact points of the squirted plastic. It just requires being realistic and often printing a multi-piece part which is glued or fastened together. Even then a printed part is (using current FDM or UV cured resin tech) not going to be as strong as a nice hot 100% fused injection molded part.
There are hacks which require several steps starting with a CAD design and FDM printing resulting in an Aluminum mold and then doing injection mold but not terribly practical for a cover which will probably require several iterations to get it right.

As for Mugen covers, they had a $5 sale on ebay areoud 2011-12 when I got mine, I am keeping it for experimental builds. I have not seen since and their website last checked a few years said not in stock.