If the entire Motorola series source tree were to be opened tomorrow it would be a miracle, and if only the bootloader was left closed it would be RE'd in a weekend. And the codebase would quickly be used in other phones as well.

But still, you'd be there to say that it does not matter. It's no better good as 100% closed platform because there's still a single component that is closed, a bootloader.

Well, sorry. I still think it's stupid to see it your way.

No. I at least would call it "more open".

Oh, I thought I used the world "insulting". Sorry you confused it with "offensive". You know, there's a reason lawyers tend to use the quote "hateful, offensive, and insulting" -- and it's exactly because of nitpickers like the above webcomic author.

You have literally said:
and I have said:
And that quote of yours is the only reason I came to this thread.

Oh no, oh no, that's an even worse thing to say. _Marginally?_ Sigh

Do I really need to start? Do you even know what the closed components are in Meego for the N900? And in Maemo?

I have always called Maemo closed. I would never call Meego closed. I could argue whether Meego for the N900 is closed or not. You can make a bootable Meego for the N900 that charges and even makes phone calls. Note however that it might be illegal in many countries because AIUI without the closed PA blobs it lacks several features that are required in every GSM handset.

Fedora also does not take a hard line of 100% open, no exceptions. It allows closed source firmware. On Meego, this is considered a "closed" package and marked as such -- and the N900 requires a few such firmware packages. By gNewSense logic Fedora is a closed source distro. By my logic, as seen above, I could argue whether it is.

The particular case doesn't exist. The point is thus not moot. That's my main point.

Since you're now talking about Meego as a "base", I guess you're not talking about the N900 CE any more. For your information, Meego has always had several UIs to choose from release 1 and virtually since day 1. Meego CE for the N900, on the other side, hasn't.
I hope you will understand that has nothing to do with openness and closeness and is just because of concepts like software testing.

A "frame buffer driver" makes no sense. Virtually all devices use a "frame buffer driver", not to mention all mobile ones. I will guess you meant "without 3D acceleration".

It can boot. To a UI. Not the handset UX as that would be quite slow with a software 3D rasterizer, but you can if you want. I would personally call that "something useful". It can also connect to Wi-Fi. It can also browse the Web.

I failed to understand your point here. You're now trying to tell me that different GNU/Linux distributions all tend to share all of the opened enhancements and functionality and thus they all end alike? I'd say that's a good thing!

You've not really looked at the Meego mailing lists a lot lately, have you?

Either way, I'm here to publicly rebate your point that Meego being more open than Maemo is moot, not talking about Meego being useless. I wholeheartedly agree that Meego is less useful than Maemo on the N900 -- even with the closed blobs. But I fail to see how that means that it being more open is a "moot point" for its future-proof-ness.

*Sigh*. As said, you do not even know what components are closed.

Oh, FUD! Let's surprise you:
- Wi-Fi and BT only require closed firmware.
- The GSM stack is fully open.
- What is sensors? If you mean the accelerometer, no, it doesn't require anything closed.
- Battery control is mostly RE'd and alternatives to bme exist. No one has been truly interested in merging them in Meego yet.
- GPS is also mostly RE'd. Except for AGPS.
- 3D acceleration is not open and will never be opened. However, there's one provider that is keen on providing updated versions of these drivers PLUS the fact that we could potentially reuse Android drivers if the need ever came.

See how having LESS closed components is better? People CAN find alternatives or reimplement if you're talking about less than a dozen. They CANNOT if you're talking about hundreds.

Some unrelated yaddayadda I don't even disagree with. Btw the Meego on the N9 is not even Meego. But I do not see what this has to do with the point that MORE OPEN is not a moot point.

Yes, the exact same set. Go figure. As said, insulting.

Your list in the paragraph above was wrong. There's not a list in that URL you linked.
Please do a bit of googling and search for the actual list of packages. You can even download those and look inside. I am not even going to do it for you. When you do, will you please correct your posts?

You are here arguing, and you have for the past 15 threads too. So we are not that different.

You do not know what you're talking about. The 40% estimate is completely bogus. If you want a more realistic one, grab Stskeeps', which says that 57% of Fremantle is closed. But I guess you didn't know that.