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2009-05-05
, 05:28
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Posts: 3,105 |
Thanked: 11,088 times |
Joined on Jul 2007
@ Mountain View (CA, USA)
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#2
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A merge of all these subforums was decided few months ago, as part of the reorganization of ITt to simplify and renovate its structure. No alternative had enough traffic of new threads that justified an own subforum and following the whole Alternatives forum is not that hard either.
You can always use the search box on the top left to search for "[Android]" and you will get the threads using that flag. Or you can simply search e.g. "Android" and you will get all the threads where the term is mentioned, sorted by most recent just as a subforum would do. You can also search by tags, although this depends on people having submitted appropriate tags in the relevant threads.
These searches get a static URL, so you can bookmark and use them at your own will.
You can always use the search box on the top left to search for "[Android]" and you will get the threads using that flag. Or you can simply search e.g. "Android" and you will get all the threads where the term is mentioned, sorted by most recent just as a subforum would do. You can also search by tags, although this depends on people having submitted appropriate tags in the relevant threads.
These searches get a static URL, so you can bookmark and use them at your own will.
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2009-05-05
, 12:47
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Posts: 2,869 |
Thanked: 1,784 times |
Joined on Feb 2007
@ Po' Bo'. PA
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#3
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Originally Posted by qgil
A merge of all these subforums was decided few months ago, as part of the reorganization of ITt to simplify and renovate its structure....
...and there we have it. The 73 odd posts mostly made by 5 individuals decided the course and structure of todays forum?
Perhaps, but not in the way you are implying.
I responded in that thread on just this subject. The architect of the "blueprint" I talked about was you and that "sense of ownership or community" would not be gained if we did not let the forums grow (or change) organically.
Your reply to me on 03-12-2009 I took as defensive and missing the point.
Originally Posted by qgil
...But feel free coming up with a blueprint for creating new forums.
My point wasn't that changes needed to be made rather, before making changes, know where the hell you're going and steer organic movement in that direction.
However for me and perhaps others, our fate appeared sealed and that thread died (organically BTW
) less than a week later with Reggie's post...
Originally Posted by Reggie
Here are a few more changes as per Quim:
- merged Official and 3rd party apps to a single 'Applications' forum. Main category renamed to 'Software'
- renamed 'Canola' to 'Multimedia'. Canola threads prefixed with '[Canola]'.
- renamed 'Gaming' as 'Games'
Seemed like a done deal to me.
Now I know you are just another forum member and you wish to promote increased participation. I also know that a lot of us do as well. That's what any good forum is all about. However, it seems to me that if you want that participation to be productive and for the common good, at the very least members need to know which direction the barge they are toting is going.
Now that this forum is a component of maemo.org we all must look forward to a time when maemo.org as a whole is more useful to ALL its members.
As it was this forum could have been used to promote these changes in the other components, invite participation, and communicate the org's direction simply by adding to the existing sub-forums. Then perhaps once more members were aware and on-board, reducing and merging sub-forums and other forum changes would not be met with as much resistance.
I'm sorry for the off-topic post... but feel free to start a new thread.
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2009-05-05
, 13:04
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Posts: 1,436 |
Thanked: 3,144 times |
Joined on Jul 2005
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#4
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I think the merging of the forums is a good move. From my 8 years of experience running forums, the simpler the forum structure is what makes the forums better. The reason behind this is for members to not sort through 100 forum categories and sub-categories on where he/she should post. Memebrs would usually give up and start a thread on 'General' every time.
For those who are searching for information, they don;t usually go to the forum main page and check the forum categories. They go directly to the search form/page and find info from there.
For the merged forums, just some technical info, I prefixed all the thread titles with their forum categories for easy searching. Also, what's new on the forums (it has actually been there for quite some time) are tags. When used well, tags can actually replace sub-forums.
For those who are searching for information, they don;t usually go to the forum main page and check the forum categories. They go directly to the search form/page and find info from there.
For the merged forums, just some technical info, I prefixed all the thread titles with their forum categories for easy searching. Also, what's new on the forums (it has actually been there for quite some time) are tags. When used well, tags can actually replace sub-forums.
__________________
Reggie Suplido
Reggie Suplido
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2009-05-05
, 13:54
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Posts: 2,869 |
Thanked: 1,784 times |
Joined on Feb 2007
@ Po' Bo'. PA
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#5
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Originally Posted by Reggie
No doubt... and a compact more readable forum is more manageable. I have no problem with how it is done. I will participate in any final format... until a better one becomes available.
I think the merging of the forums is a good move. From my 8 years of experience running forums, the simpler the forum structure is what makes the forums better. The reason behind this is for members to not sort through 100 forum categories and sub-categories on where he/she should post. Memebrs would usually give up and start a thread on 'General' every time.
For those who are searching for information, they don;t usually go to the forum main page and check the forum categories. They go directly to the search form/page and find info from there.
For the merged forums, just some technical info, I prefixed all the thread titles with their forum categories for easy searching. Also, what's new on the forums (it has actually been there for quite some time) are tags. When used well, tags can actually replace sub-forums.
My problem is with the now almost standard response that if we don't like what it has become, as members of maemo.org we were given the chance to participate and we didn't...
or the equally unnerving response, "feel free to propose changes yourself".
Many of us are here because we were not active members of the old maemo.org.
I don't know for sure but I suspect that this forum's growth comes from new owners of devices and not referrals from a component of maemo.org.
I appreciate Nokia's desire to change that by making maemo.org a one stop alternative to traditional customer support. However it is MHO based on their results in the past*, they may not have thought out all the probable outcomes.
*Late delivery of Developer Devices may have delayed some maemo.org members involvement in this forum for the first 6 months after the release of the n800 when it was most needed (and the forum possibly grew the quickest).
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2009-05-05
, 18:58
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Posts: 3,105 |
Thanked: 11,088 times |
Joined on Jul 2007
@ Mountain View (CA, USA)
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#6
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Going back to the topic, the ramification of Alternatives was part of an organic growth... and so it was the reunification of those sub-forums under a same umbrella. Living bings get rid of plenty of stuff in order to grow.
Nobody could come up with a single alternative that would drive enough traffic to deserve an own subforum. There was a bit of discussion, a majority of opinions in favour of the merge and no showstoppers. After a while the change was made. This is how most decisions are made in online communities based on organic growth.
Again, Nokia has nothing to do with this as I'm doing this in my free time without being asked to do so. My (short) experience as Nokia employee is totally irrelevant in this task as I'm basically working in the same way I learned to work participating, moderating and administrating several communities, starting with BBS and Usenet newsgroups in 95.
Yes, you can always plan better and discuss more. One trade-off is that you might end up only discussing with no move forward until exhaustion. Another trade-off is that probably any change will have its discontents, specially in the short term.
Still, nobody has brought a convicing argument on why it is better to have all those sub-forums now. This might mean that the decision was actually not that bad.
Nobody could come up with a single alternative that would drive enough traffic to deserve an own subforum. There was a bit of discussion, a majority of opinions in favour of the merge and no showstoppers. After a while the change was made. This is how most decisions are made in online communities based on organic growth.
Again, Nokia has nothing to do with this as I'm doing this in my free time without being asked to do so. My (short) experience as Nokia employee is totally irrelevant in this task as I'm basically working in the same way I learned to work participating, moderating and administrating several communities, starting with BBS and Usenet newsgroups in 95.
Yes, you can always plan better and discuss more. One trade-off is that you might end up only discussing with no move forward until exhaustion. Another trade-off is that probably any change will have its discontents, specially in the short term.
Still, nobody has brought a convicing argument on why it is better to have all those sub-forums now. This might mean that the decision was actually not that bad.
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2009-05-05
, 20:34
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Posts: 3,096 |
Thanked: 1,525 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ Michigan, USA
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#7
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It becomes harder to find the posts related to a sub topic that used to exits.
I want to install KDE, I go to forum and search for KDE.
This is not useful at all.
I asked for KDE forum, was told no
The community then asked, and Reggie made it happen.
Its now gone, and those posts are scattered. If you come to this site and want to install KDE, you would be lost. Lots of old posts did not have tags in them.
http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...light=poll+kde
I am not clear why posts counts to sub-forums are an indication of their usage. Hopefully they were reading them and found they did not need to post, as all the answers were there.
So many decisions being made and so many people not knowing whats going on.
It is apparent that even though we have a Maemo Community Council, most people are not any more informed about what is happening around here.
I want to install KDE, I go to forum and search for KDE.
This is not useful at all.
I asked for KDE forum, was told no
The community then asked, and Reggie made it happen.
Its now gone, and those posts are scattered. If you come to this site and want to install KDE, you would be lost. Lots of old posts did not have tags in them.
http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...light=poll+kde
I am not clear why posts counts to sub-forums are an indication of their usage. Hopefully they were reading them and found they did not need to post, as all the answers were there.
So many decisions being made and so many people not knowing whats going on.
It is apparent that even though we have a Maemo Community Council, most people are not any more informed about what is happening around here.
__________________
To all my Maemo friends. I will no longer be monitoring any of my threads here on a regular basis. I am no longer supporting anything I did under maemo at maemo.org. If you need some help with something you can reach me at tablethacker.com or www.facebook.com/penguinbait. I have disabled my PM's here, and removed myself from Council email and Community mailing list. There has been some fun times, see you around.
To all my Maemo friends. I will no longer be monitoring any of my threads here on a regular basis. I am no longer supporting anything I did under maemo at maemo.org. If you need some help with something you can reach me at tablethacker.com or www.facebook.com/penguinbait. I have disabled my PM's here, and removed myself from Council email and Community mailing list. There has been some fun times, see you around.
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2009-05-05
, 21:20
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Posts: 1,436 |
Thanked: 3,144 times |
Joined on Jul 2005
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#8
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A good solution for this is a sticky. Someone can create a KDE sticky for example, pointing to the best KDE threads within the Alternatives forum. It will be a great guide as well as a good way to put focus on the discussion.
FYI, here are all the original KDE threads merged inside Alternatives: http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...DE&titleonly=1
FYI, here are all the original KDE threads merged inside Alternatives: http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...DE&titleonly=1
__________________
Reggie Suplido
Reggie Suplido
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2009-05-05
, 21:33
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Posts: 5,478 |
Thanked: 5,222 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ St. Petersburg, FL
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#9
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Originally Posted by Reggie
An even better one is to put documentation where documentation belongs, on the wiki.
A good solution for this is a sticky. Someone can create a KDE sticky for example, pointing to the best KDE threads within the Alternatives forum. It will be a great guide as well as a good way to put focus on the discussion.
__________________
Ryan Abel
Ryan Abel
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2009-05-05
, 21:52
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Posts: 3,096 |
Thanked: 1,525 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ Michigan, USA
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#10
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Originally Posted by Reggie
Thats an awesome link, and I will hold onto that.
A good solution for this is a sticky. Someone can create a KDE sticky for example, pointing to the best KDE threads within the Alternatives forum. It will be a great guide as well as a good way to put focus on the discussion.
FYI, here are all the original KDE threads merged inside Alternatives: http://www.internettablettalk.com/fo...DE&titleonly=1
However, Reggie, say you came to ITT because you wanted to run KDE, or Android, or Palm, Mer, Debian
Then go to the search and type in KDE and search. Now compare that list to the one you gave me.
I am just saying, I don't see why this is better for users? I also do not understand why this is a problem, there would have been no added administration.
This only makes all those posts LESS useful, because users cannot find them when they need them. Searching is great, especially if its your forum and know what your doing, but if you don't know how, its not very useful at all.
__________________
To all my Maemo friends. I will no longer be monitoring any of my threads here on a regular basis. I am no longer supporting anything I did under maemo at maemo.org. If you need some help with something you can reach me at tablethacker.com or www.facebook.com/penguinbait. I have disabled my PM's here, and removed myself from Council email and Community mailing list. There has been some fun times, see you around.
To all my Maemo friends. I will no longer be monitoring any of my threads here on a regular basis. I am no longer supporting anything I did under maemo at maemo.org. If you need some help with something you can reach me at tablethacker.com or www.facebook.com/penguinbait. I have disabled my PM's here, and removed myself from Council email and Community mailing list. There has been some fun times, see you around.
Last edited by pigling; 2009-05-05 at 02:28.