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2015-12-01
, 14:11
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Posts: 337 |
Thanked: 891 times |
Joined on Jul 2012
@ Royaume Uni.
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#2372
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Originally Posted by Copernicus
Because I have been able to flash a Nexus 5 with Sailfish (most things worked), but not at all with Mer (although it's been a long time since I've tried).
And I have already said this several times: why the heck do you think that? We've already got Mer / Nemo. It has the same base OS as Sailfish. It is 100% open source. It is also almost 100% ignored by everybody on this board.
Why do you think Sailfish would saved by being open-sourced? From what I can see here, I would expect it'd be dropped like a hot rock, and folks here would move on to the next mobile OS. In just a few weeks all the posts here will switch to "Open-source Tizen! It's the only way to save the OS..."
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2015-12-01
, 14:20
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Posts: 387 |
Thanked: 1,700 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
@ Cambridge, MA, USA
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#2373
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Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic
But how does Jolla, the company with real employees who like being paid, survive in this scenario? If Sailfish is open sourced, and users just download it onto an ex-Android phone, where does Jolla get its money? If I were working at Jolla, I would not be attracted to schemes for saving Sailfish that did not include a clear revenue stream for Jolla.
Because I have been able to flash a Nexus 5 with Sailfish (most things worked), but not at all with Mer (although it's been a long time since I've tried).
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2015-12-01
, 14:30
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Posts: n/a |
Thanked: 0 times |
Joined on
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#2374
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Originally Posted by ZogG
Yep. Please make me aware of what time you'd be available for me to toss stones in your direction.
While he was discussing on topic about the problems and his opinion — all you can do is to answer "you are...", "you...".
Next thing would be probably pointing fingers and throwing stones, right?
If you're being serious, he's still spreading his agenda. It has been the same since he's been here and it will continue. I can say very easily that I'm tired of his oft repeated stuff all based on his personal take of the company that he thinks has spurned him somehow.
You want to feed that fire; so be it. I will challenge it each and every time I see it. This is not the place for puerile antics as such. We already have Dave999
I'll save finger pointing for the next post. No need to use both of my tactics as you've stated.
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2015-12-01
, 14:32
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Posts: 337 |
Thanked: 891 times |
Joined on Jul 2012
@ Royaume Uni.
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#2375
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Originally Posted by Ken-Young
As I've stated before, I'd be happy to pay a yearly subscription charge for an image that was certified on a mainstream device like a Nexus 5.
But how does Jolla, the company with real employees who like being paid, survive in this scenario? If Sailfish is open sourced, and users just download it onto an ex-Android phone, where does Jolla get its money? If I were working at Jolla, I would not be attracted to schemes for saving Sailfish that did not include a clear revenue stream for Jolla.
I certainly agree that Sailfish would need experts who are getting paid - whether there are enough people out there willing to stump up the cash - I don't know.
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2015-12-01
, 14:50
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Posts: 1,986 |
Thanked: 7,698 times |
Joined on Dec 2010
@ Dayton, Ohio
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#2376
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Originally Posted by NokiaFanatic
So? Mer / Nemo is open-source. That means you can fix it. So do so.
Because I have been able to flash a Nexus 5 with Sailfish (most things worked), but not at all with Mer (although it's been a long time since I've tried).
What, you don't want to do the work? Then why would you want to do the work with Sailfish? Just because something is open-source doesn't mean folks will work on it.
This is what drives me bonkers. Jolla has put real effort into Sailfish. That's why you can flash it onto a Nexus 5 so easily. Nobody seems to want to put any effort into Nemo. The only difference between Sailfish and Nemo? Nemo is 100% open-source. Make Sailfish 100% open source as well, and you'll see it'll immediately receive just as much support as Nemo gets...
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2015-12-01
, 15:23
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Posts: 1,389 |
Thanked: 1,857 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
@ Israel
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#2377
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Originally Posted by gerbick
Aside all the personal fights and problems that he was involved with. he had a lot of constructive points and ideas in most of his posts. But yeah, once person slips once in certain situation you already put a huge X on him doesn't matter what. Like we all are holy and have not done any mistakes.
Yep. Please make me aware of what time you'd be available for me to toss stones in your direction.
If you're being serious, he's still spreading his agenda. It has been the same since he's been here and it will continue. I can say very easily that I'm tired of his oft repeated stuff all based on his personal take of the company that he thinks has spurned him somehow.
You want to feed that fire; so be it. I will challenge it each and every time I see it. This is not the place for puerile antics as such. We already have Dave999
I'll save finger pointing for the next post. No need to use both of my tactics as you've stated.
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2015-12-01
, 15:29
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Posts: 1,548 |
Thanked: 7,510 times |
Joined on Apr 2010
@ Czech Republic
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#2378
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Originally Posted by Copernicus
Yes, as long as the thing to fix is in the open source component, which often is not the case. Also there is a serious overall lack of documentation in the Mer/Nemo/Sailfish land and random parts being closed does not really help with tracking down issues as you basically stumble on black boxes left and right.
So? Mer / Nemo is open-source. That means you can fix it. So do so.
Originally Posted by Copernicus
The other difference is that Sailfish OS is a quite complete and overall working system while Nemo is basically a bunch of middleware (the same Sailfish OS makes use off) but without most of the actual user facing bits (all system level GUI elements, core apps) + some minor stuff salvaged from the MeeGo era.
This is what drives me bonkers. Jolla has put real effort into Sailfish. That's why you can flash it onto a Nexus 5 so easily. Nobody seems to want to put any effort into Nemo. The only difference between Sailfish and Nemo? Nemo is 100% open-source.
So one is unusable until you spend huge resources to basically rewrite all the closed bits (this might sound familiar to some people...) while the other is kinda useable but fundamental pieces are closed and can't be fixed and improved by the community.
Originally Posted by Copernicus
Actually I think we would get significant amount of contributions as there would finally be something that is both in usable shape and fully open source.
Make Sailfish 100% open source as well, and you'll see it'll immediately receive just as much support as Nemo gets...
It is much easier & much more motivating to fix & improve something you and others can actually use day-to-day rather than hacking on something for years without visible results.
I think the N900 and its community are good example of this - even though still hindered by closed parts, it is a device & platform that is quite open & day-to-day usable, which is IMHO why it has spawned such a considerable & durable community that is still writing apps, improving & supporting the platform to this day, long after the N900 has been officially discontinue and all official support dropped.
__________________
modRana: a flexible GPS navigation system
Mieru: a flexible manga and comic book reader
Universal Components - a solution for native looking yet component set independent QML appliactions (QtQuick Controls 2 & Silica supported as backends)
modRana: a flexible GPS navigation system
Mieru: a flexible manga and comic book reader
Universal Components - a solution for native looking yet component set independent QML appliactions (QtQuick Controls 2 & Silica supported as backends)
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2015-12-01
, 15:32
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Posts: 702 |
Thanked: 2,059 times |
Joined on Feb 2011
@ UK
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#2379
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Originally Posted by Ken-Young
IME most Android devices, with enough RAM in them, are fine at that and certainly way, way better than Sailfish running on a Jolla.
make a device that is squarely aimed at system manager type individuals
And they're better at all the other stuff too.
And that's the problem. You need to be great at both the techie stuff AND the consumer or business oriented stuff.
You need massive resources to do that yourself OR a motivated community and developer community. Jolla have none of those and their efforts to foster a fan community and developer community have been awful. "People Powered" - come on! Utter tripe.
Much as I think together.jolla.com is pretty terrible as a project/bugtracking environment*, it does provide a 'list' of things that need fixing but neither Jolla or the Community are in a position to fix them when one has no resources and the other is locked out.
* It's more like somewhere to light your torches and gather your pitch forks while Jolla sit behind the castle walls.
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2015-12-01
, 15:40
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Posts: 337 |
Thanked: 891 times |
Joined on Jul 2012
@ Royaume Uni.
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#2380
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Originally Posted by Copernicus
Because I just wouldn't have the skilzz..
So? Mer / Nemo is open-source. That means you can fix it. So do so.
What, you don't want to do the work? Then why would you want to do the work with Sailfish? Just because something is open-source doesn't mean folks will work on it.
This is what drives me bonkers. Jolla has put real effort into Sailfish. That's why you can flash it onto a Nexus 5 so easily. Nobody seems to want to put any effort into Nemo. The only difference between Sailfish and Nemo? Nemo is 100% open-source. Make Sailfish 100% open source as well, and you'll see it'll immediately receive just as much support as Nemo gets...
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Why do you think Sailfish would saved by being open-sourced? From what I can see here, I would expect it'd be dropped like a hot rock, and folks here would move on to the next mobile OS. In just a few weeks all the posts here will switch to "Open-source Tizen! It's the only way to save the OS..."