One of the comments summerizes the differences of mindset between the ITT and the Apple crowd: "can the ipod touch run KDE and Koffice?" . I think such a question would be met with a blank glaze by an Ipod Touch fan.

I understand why someone would choose an ipod touch or a iphone over the n8*0. Two different crowds.. Iphone/touch is for people who most likely run windows at home and don't mind having to pay for new features and upgrades on a monthly bases. The n8*0 is for people who really dig cutting edge technology and know the true meaning of open source and the power of it. Iphone/touch is for the consumer chain people who buy stuff just because the next door neighbor has one. Some kid around my way saw my n800 and decided to buy one without even knowing what it was and is now selling it because he couldn't install limewire on it... Go figure!

I used an itouch for the first time this weekend while at an Apple Store. And I've gotta say that I was really impressed. Of course, this comes as no surprise: that's what Apple does, it impresses on initial use. Of course, I am an n8x0 user for all the good reasons already canvassed above. And there's no danger of my switching. But man o man I would like to see as responsive a browser on the tablet. I was really blown away by that aspect.

But as I was playing around with it I realized that I couldn't figure out how to make the browser do what is for me one of the most important things I can do with tablet, and that's fit width to view. When I asked the attendant how this is done on the iTouch, he just looked at me and said, "Obviously we can't make the screen bigger, so when you zoom in to make the font bigger, you'll need to scroll horizontally to read the text." And when I said that he had misunderstood me, and that my nokia internet tablet can do what I was talking about, he responded, glibly, "Well, this is a full web browser." Um, ok. I just walked away, not bothering to disabuse him.

But this raises an issue that I know has been treated at length before. As I said, for me, the fit width to view feature is absolutely essential. I wouldn't have an IT/iTouch/whatever without it. If Diablo doesn't have it, I won't upgrade. I read most of my news on the tablet, and read blogs through bloglines mobile, and none of these would be remotely enjoyable to do without "fit width to view." I simply wouldn't be able to use a device with so small a screen unless I could easily set the font to an eye-friendly size (without making that the default font size). But, it seems, most users really detest "fit width to view." Indeed, the eminently knowledgeable and helpful neoncherry calls it an "abominable option on the tablet browser.", and others have echoed this. And of course I realize what this feature can do to the browsing experience when one isn't so much interested in reading things like news articles. But this is why it's so great to have it as an *option.*

Anyway, basically I am saying that I'd love to have a browswer on the n8x0 that is as pleasurable to use as the iTouch's. And of course I'm looking forward to diablo. But the lack of "fit width to view" in the touch is sufficient reason for me to say no thanks (even though there are plenty of reasons to say no thanks). And I sure hope that the maemo folks don't do away with the feature, even though so many seem to find little use for it.

Isn't choice a wonderful thing?

I really like the user interface on the iPod Touch - it's truly much better than Maemo on the Nokia.

But the iPod Touch fails to deliver what I need in all 3 of my main uses for the N800:
- Both work as internet devices (web browsing, email, chat), with different advantages and disadvantages to each, but the Nokia has Skype
- Both work as media players, but on the Nokia I get a music subscription service and more internet radio options
- The N800 works for me as an ebook reader because the screen is just big enough and has just enough resolution to make it feasible - the iPod falls just short.

I love my N800, and I get TONS of use out of it. On the other hand, I was blown away by the responsiveness and smoothness of the iTouch and iPhone browsing, scrolling, etc. (Anybody know if that responsiveness is due more to hardware or to software?) As far as I'm concerned, Nokia just has to get to that level of responsiveness and, for godsakes, have right-out-of-the-box PIM functionality (i.e., Calendar, To Do, Address Book, and Memos, with synch). That would make it a real competitor. (And if they competed better, the Tablets would have more market share, and we would get stuff like a DRM-capable Adobe Reader, websites that optimized for us, just like there are iPhone-optimized sites, etc.)

I can't see the iTouch as big enough for a book reader, whereas FBReader on my N800 is awesome, just perfect.

And my experience of a youtube video on the iPhone was underwhelming.

What I wonder about, also, is: What is it like to watch a feature film ripped for the iTouch/iPhone? I find it surprisingly watchable and enjoyable on my N800. (I just flew cross-country and back and watched, in all, three feature-length films, and I didn't get fatigued.) Has anybody watched a ripped feature film on the iTouch or iPhone? How was it?

One more thing: I think Nokia needs a better name than N-Series. For one thing, that seems to apply to the N95, etc., as well as the N770, N800, and N810. And saying "N800" is just awkward. For example, talking to my girlfriend, saying, "Do you want to take my N800 with you?" -- that's just clunky. (Hence, this is embarrassing, but we've nicknamed it Nubbins. So I can say, "Do you want to take Nubbins with you?")

It's also bad marketing since there is no good catch-all name that includes the three tablets they've already sold plus those in the future. "Nokia Internet Tablet" is too long a name and lacks cachet.

I thought "Blackberry" was a stupid name when I first saw one in 1999, but at least people can say, "I use a Blackberry," and you know what they're talking about. It wouldn't have caught on so fast if one person was saying, "I use a RIM B450" and someone else was saying, "I use a RIM B7000." But that's the kind of language we NIT users are stuck with.

I dont know about you, but I regularly use my N810 (of not the N800 maybe, but still same software) as

1) Call my home using Skype and Gizmo (I use Gizmo where Video is required and for Desktop to dektop), Skype for all other international calls

2) Use it as a excellent Podcast player and Audio player

3) Use it to connect wirelessly to the internet and read my blogs on the train - with a fast 3G connection over bluetooth

4) Wirelessly update and install apps on my N810 when ta home over Wifi or over Bluetooth at office

5) Use it as my contact manager and Calendar app - which also shows me my shared calendars on Google Calendar

6) I use it to jot down notes regularly while I am out and about.

7) Lastly also use it to watch my encoded movies while on plane trips (instead of watching the crappy fare).

8) Keep a tab on 5 day weather forecast while I am commuting from place to place or each regions weather conditions (OMweather).

9) Check emails and write and reply to my personal emails from the device - from anywhere using Wifi where available and BT PAN over my 3G connection thru phone.

10) sometimes as a last resort solution when I am mobile, I SSH into my servers and run or start/stop jobs which I am looking after.

Now that is all just usages which I do every day.

We can talk about the less often used features ... later when you stop smoking the crap that you are smoking when you talk about "dubious usefulness".

Yeah, I completely agree. I think this is easily one of the key issues that Nokia must address as soon as possible. I can't tell you how many reviews I've read from people how ended up not liking the tablet overall because it doesn't include PIM tools. Good grief guys, hadn't you noticed that it isn't even advertised as having PIM? Critics can be idiots.

Anyway, I agree, I think the tablets would gain significant market share just from having these features well implemented.

Yeah, definitely. Again, another area Nokia needs to work on. Just look at "iPod", personally I do think it's a little bit cutsy sounding, but it's easy to remember, short, and unique to their product. I think Nokia should do the same for our tablets. Yeah, Nokia Internet Tablet is the generic name, but it's too long, like you say. And just Tablet is too generic. People would get it confused with Tablet PCs and UMPCs.

- i know what you mean... i usually just say, "Would you hand me the tablet, please?"

(but my n800's 'secret name' [derived via wifi IP assignment] is "Pokey" as my PSP's name is "Peppy")

:-)

Loooong time Mac user here. But when I saw the N800, I knew immediately that it was a better value for me - for all the reasons mentioned above and particularly the cost savings.

Now that I've had it a while, the downsides for me are the small screen that makes reading a chore after a short time (not that this would improve on an iPhone/iTouch) and the lack of ability to sync my Mac's Address Book. But since I invariably have my iPod in the same bag as my N800, that point is much less a sharp disappointment and much more of a dull desire.

In the end, I find I really am leaving the N800 at my bedside mostly. There, I:

- hook it up to an RCA-plugged speaker system and I get fantastic access to international radio stations that play for hours at a time,

- I have a great alarm system (when I set it correctly. Yesterday I managed to remember to 'spring forward' one hour but not set the alarm at all... whoops),

- thanks to another thread, I found the app that allows dimming of the screen for looooooong periods rather than it turning off so, combined with mClock, the N800 is now also my bedside clock that I can easily view if I wake up at night *and it won't get screwed up if the power goes out*,

- I can watch an episode or five of 'Rome' that's sitting on one of my 4GB cards while laying in bed (if I wake up at night) without having to convert the .avi,

- I can grab the N800 and read an email or scan the net,

- there's some very nice apps out there that help me make the N800 (mostly) work the way *I* want it to work,

- and when I know I'll be away on a trip, it's small enough and handy enough to toss into a bag and I get to bring all this goodness with me (assuming I'll have access to wifi).

I saw the iTouch and loved the design. But I hated the premium price and the closed access to 3rd party stuff. But it were sure purr-teh.

But, yeah, I wish they'd come up with something better than "Nokia N800 Internet Tablet"... .