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2008-12-10
, 14:31
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Joined on Oct 2007
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#122
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Originally Posted by BoxOfSnoo
It seems completely true from here. Absence of explicit qualifiers (such as "with other compatible software") does not negate obvious implicit qualifications. (At least I assume that's where you think it's untrue...)
Oh yeah here on the box it says "Internet calling with web camera..." Cool! only that's not completely true, is it?
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World's first inductively-charged N900!
World's first inductively-charged N900!
| The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Benson For This Useful Post: | ||
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2008-12-10
, 15:11
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Posts: 259 |
Thanked: 72 times |
Joined on Dec 2007
@ Halifax, NS
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#123
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Originally Posted by Benson
It works for you? Cool, you have google chat on your device, let me fire up google chat on my desktop and you can explain to me how you got it working!
It seems completely true from here. Absence of explicit qualifiers (such as "with other compatible software") does not negate obvious implicit qualifications. (At least I assume that's where you think it's untrue...)
Or do you need compatible software *and* compatible hardware? Wow, that's kinda against the whole intent of the Internet isn't it?
I say it's not *completely* true because in actual use cases, it does not function. I include Gizmo in this, because when I tried it was unusable as a videochat device. With profound proprietary hooks like that in the device you better believe they should mark something on the box. Someone before mentioned the word "disingenuous"?
If you want more picky, the next column on the box calls it a webcam. Go to something like mebeam.com and tell me if the webcam works on... you know, the web.
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2008-12-10
, 16:12
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Posts: 3,841 |
Thanked: 1,079 times |
Joined on Nov 2006
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#124
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Originally Posted by pycage
Internet isn't an alias for 'world wide web'. That's just a single service. For a rough idea about how many there are, try 'cat /etc/services' on your Nokia.Well, AFAIK, the internet tablets are advertised for mobile internet. They do that very fine compared to other mobile devices and even support Flash, which is very uncommon for mobile devices.
Certainly email is a major, important part of 'mobile internet'-ing.
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N800/OS2007|N900/Maemo5
-- Metalayer-crawler delenda est.
-- Current state: Fed up with everything MeeGo.
N800/OS2007|N900/Maemo5
-- Metalayer-crawler delenda est.
-- Current state: Fed up with everything MeeGo.
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2008-12-10
, 16:30
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Posts: 243 |
Thanked: 172 times |
Joined on Sep 2007
@ silicon valley
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#125
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Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
Ok. When I see articles talking about nokia porting qt back from april, and they own the gosh-darned thing, it doesn't seem entirely unreasonable to think they might be officially supporting it by now and not just as a "community project."
Nokia is porting Qt, the results of which are available right now in Extras. But for Fremantle Qt will only be community supported, the official support will come with Harmattan. This means a Qt Garage project and distribution through Extras (much like Python).
Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
I was looking at the toolkits they have running on top of it (tidy?) and that's more minimal than what I expect. If I really wanted to build a very rich UI from complete and total scratch it's fine, but that is not what I'm targeting.
Unfinished how, exactly? Are you referring to the example Clutter UIs available or the actual toolkit? Either way, recall that this is only a pre-alpha.
Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
What if someone wanted to try installing it? Do most people keep extras-devel available all the time?
I didn't make a differentiation because it isn't relevant here. They've got somewhere in the ballpark of 6 months to polish it up and move it to Extras. Give it time.
Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
That's the hat I'm wearing right now for this project, so yes. However I'll want to run this on an n900, not an n8xx, so I want to know what is and is not going to be "officially" available. Sounds like qt isn't guaranteed to be well supported enough to use out of the box for fremantle and that's what I wanted to know.
From your questions, it sounds like you're more of an application developer, so you're gonna want to wait for a later alpha release or the beta release around March-May.
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2008-12-10
, 16:42
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Posts: 3,397 |
Thanked: 1,212 times |
Joined on Jul 2008
@ Netherlands
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#126
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Usually, 'unlimited' means 'limited but we won't tell you the limit'. If you'd download fullspeed (3.5 mbit) on 3G 24/7 you'd burn about 886 gbit (110 GB) a month. Try it out for fun and profit, but most ISPs will either: 1) contract you with a 'special offer' or 2) cap the crap out of you. You've been warned.
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Goosfraba! All text written by allnameswereout is public domain unless stated otherwise. Thank you for sharing your output!
Goosfraba! All text written by allnameswereout is public domain unless stated otherwise. Thank you for sharing your output!
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2008-12-10
, 16:50
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Posts: 99 |
Thanked: 28 times |
Joined on Jun 2008
@ Philadelphia, PA
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#127
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Originally Posted by allnameswereout
I assume this was in response to the data services discussion. You are correct that the service is truly not unlimited. ATT caps their "unlimited" media net plan at 5GB as far as I know. Not sure about their other services. I usually only burn a couple hundred MB a month.
Usually, 'unlimited' means 'limited but we won't tell you the limit'. If you'd download fullspeed (3.5 mbit) on 3G 24/7 you'd burn about 886 gbit (110 GB) a month. Try it out for fun and profit, but most ISPs will either: 1) contract you with a 'special offer' or 2) cap the crap out of you. You've been warned.
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2008-12-10
, 17:59
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Posts: 5,478 |
Thanked: 5,222 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ St. Petersburg, FL
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#128
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Originally Posted by sarahn
Considering that Nokia hired the primary Qt on Maemo guy to work for Maemo Software, I'd say they're putting plenty of money on it. Honestly, though, there are a ton of very talented people currently working on Qt for Maemo. Just because it doesn't happen to be "blessed" this time around, doesn't suddenly make it useless ****. Personally, if I were one of those people working on Qt, I'd be more than a little offended to hear somebody pass judgement about it without even using the damn thing.
Ok. When I see articles talking about nokia porting qt back from april, and they own the gosh-darned thing, it doesn't seem entirely unreasonable to think they might be officially supporting it by now and not just as a "community project."
Originally Posted by sarahn
The new Hildon isn't out yet, so the toolkits you see available now aren't the ones that will be available later. Again give it time and wait for a release that you're actually the intended audience of.
I was looking at the toolkits they have running on top of it (tidy?) and that's more minimal than what I expect. If I really wanted to build a very rich UI from complete and total scratch it's fine, but that is not what I'm targeting.
Originally Posted by sarahn
Extras-devel isn't the end of the world, and, yes, a lot of people keep it enabled all the time. Why don't you try it and see? I think you're likely to be pretty impressed by how well Qt works on Maemo at this point.
What if someone wanted to try installing it? Do most people keep extras-devel available all the time?
They'll push it to Extras when it's ready, of course, but perhaps you should consider actually talking to the people involved? They're listed on the Garage project page I linked in my last post.
Originally Posted by sarahn
See, now you're jumping to more conclusions based on assumptions and bad data. Python is a community-supported toolkit, and it's perfectly usable out-of-the-box (ever tried Canola?). So your argument that community is synonymous with "wont work out-of-the-box" is bunk.
That's the hat I'm wearing right now for this project, so yes. However I'll want to run this on an n900, not an n8xx, so I want to know what is and is not going to be "officially" available. Sounds like qt isn't guaranteed to be well supported enough to use out of the box for fremantle and that's what I wanted to know.
Let's step back, try taking a look at what's available right now (which I think you'll find quite satisfactory), then maybe come back in a few months when the beta is out and see what you think then. I'm quite certain you'll be more than satisfied.
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Ryan Abel
Ryan Abel
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2008-12-10
, 18:11
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@ Vancouver, BC, Canada
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#129
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Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
A large part of this release is for Nokia to collect feedback on the architecture before it becomes too late to push some changes, so if you've got opinions (hopefully productive ones backed by evidence or experience) then let 'em loose.
Originally Posted by qole
I'd love to do that; what can I do? Is it just a case of picking through the source code, or is there something I can actually run and test? And if there is, what do I need to make that happen?
Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles
So, nobody answered my question. Does that mean that there's no practical use for this SDK except to show that Nokia is serious about open source? Who are these platform developers? What exactly do they develop? Can you give me an example?
This is a very early pre-alpha release intended to give platform developers and those folks interested in the platform architecture a jumpstart on Fremantle, and for Nokia to begin collecting feedback about it from them. This release is not intended for application developers, nor is it intended for users.
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2008-12-10
, 18:29
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Posts: 1,635 |
Thanked: 1,816 times |
Joined on Apr 2008
@ Manchester, England
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#130
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Originally Posted by qole
me, I will be playing specifically towards liqbase!
So, nobody answered my question. Does that mean that there's no practical use for this SDK except to show that Nokia is serious about open source? Who are these platform developers? What exactly do they develop? Can you give me an example?
I will be getting it all installed this weekend hopefully.
I want to see how things sit and once I do that I'll do some testing with clutter on my laptop and see if its buildable on both.
of course it would be easier with a device, but it will do for now.
The alternative to diving straight in with clutter is ensuring my app as it stands builds (I dont think i can run it though, i've never been able to get it working in the past in emulation).
If I know it *builds* on the new device it makes life easier, but if there are missing libraries due to changes I will need to adapt and make ifdefs in code.
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liqbase sketching the future.
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liqbase sketching the future.
like what i say? hit the Thanks, thanks!
twitter.com/lcuk
I dunno about you but my mobile Internet experience starts with typing something in... hmm, can't quite do that without falling over a long standing finger-keyboard bug in MicroB. (That Mr. Abel acknowledges on bugzilla).