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attila77 is offline attila77
2009-10-25 , 09:24
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#51
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
This is probably a stupid question... but is the following scenario possible and useful: desktop IDE developing directly on a Maemo device attached to the host via usb?
Not only possible, but it is exactly how Pluthon works. If you are allergic to Eclipse, but familiar with WingIDE, it also supports remote execution/debugging on the device.
 

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lcuk is offline lcuk
2009-10-25 , 15:38
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#52
Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
I'd still recommend Python for weekend coders, especially those with C(++)itis. At least with that you can forego the whole SB/SDK thing and still not have the problem above.


one slight problem with this (which is the same mini bug I have)

packaging on the device is lacking.

unless a generic simple mechanism can be made to get their creations off the device and into extras scratchbox will be needed for the final step.
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attila77 is offline attila77
2009-10-25 , 16:49
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#53
Originally Posted by lcuk View Post
one slight problem with this (which is the same mini bug I have)

packaging on the device is lacking.

unless a generic simple mechanism can be made to get their creations off the device and into extras scratchbox will be needed for the final step.
It's not as big of a problem as it seems. It's basically a one-liner (with some obvious minor tweaks like deps, changelog, etc):

Code:
dh_make example export DEBFULLNAME=”Hack Er” dh_make –email [email_address] --copyright=bsd --file ../foo.tar.gz
That's basically it ! Take a look at the packaging slides (the line above is from that presentation), basically everything you need to know is in there.

The only snag is that dpkg-dev (and dh_make) are not in Fremantle extras yet, but I guess that can be remedied if there is interest (Diablo has them).
 

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tekojo is offline tekojo
2009-10-25 , 19:01
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#54
Originally Posted by Sasler View Post
Something like this I was really hoping for.

But just to make sure that I understood correctly, let me ask a few questions:

1. Will the idea be to use Qt Creator (or something similar) for coding and then all one had to do is to compile it to Maemo (preferably with a single click )?

2. Will it have it have directly the ability to use Maemo style widgets (I'm not certain of the correct terms here) in its Form editor? Currently the Windows version of Qt Creator seems to have only Windows style widgets... I think.

3. Is the idea that run it in Windows for quick testing and eventually, when ready for testing on the actual device, compile it to Maemo?

Thanks
1. That's the long term target. Initially we'll most likely be satisfied with the work that has already gone into Qt Creator, it does have some capacity for using other compilers than the default.

2. Well... the thing is that the widget conversion happens on the maemo end. The point with Qt is that the same widgets just get rendered differently in different places. Maemo just looks a whole lot different with the idea of finger usability. Work ongoing to figure out how to make it work.

3. That's the initial idea, and it seems the easiest way. However the developer needs to remember the performance difference of running on a desktop x86 machine and an N900. That is until we get a realistic desktop emulation.
 

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tekojo is offline tekojo
2009-10-25 , 19:09
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#55
Originally Posted by Nathan View Post
Cool, I agree, hence my reason why I didn't like the eclipse solution I know that is being developed.

1. I know you don't like to commit to any specific time frame -- but are you talking like in the next 3 months; 6 months or farther out.

2. I assume this solution just allows you to create basic applications; and then submit them to the builders to create the actual application for them to test on their phone?

Nathan
Saying anything about time always causes expectations, but...

1. Really hoping for that 3-6 month period. I know that is forever, but let's see. And I am only hoping, with software it is always ready when it's ready :-)

2. First target is Qt development. I'm still reading up on Qt, but I am slowly leaning to the thought that the apps that can be made with Qt aren't basic. QGraphics, Phonon, WebKit, DBus, XML and such make for some pretty heavy duty applications really easy.
In essence yes, make it simple to create the app and package it. Nothing fancy, just the most common use case for starters.
 

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tekojo is offline tekojo
2009-10-25 , 19:20
Posts: 148 | Thanked: 484 times | Joined on Nov 2008
#56
Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
I might have missed something here, but how will you solve the problem of Maemo APIs if you develop with Qt Creator on a desktop platform ? Only the simplest of apps can be developed in Creator and then 'just compiled in SB', and even then, you WILL have ifdefs. Try to access the address book, the desktop, widgets, MAFW, the location framework, accelerometers, cellular or IM functionality and suddently you find yourself in the middle of nowhere...

I'd still recommend Python for weekend coders, especially those with C(++)itis. At least with that you can forego the whole SB/SDK thing and still not have the problem above.
Have to agree somewhat to this. Having read some of the Python apps in extras-testing this weekend, Python is a simple and fast way to get going.

However don't underestimate Qt before trying it out, the library set is impressive. I see it more as a language preference thing.
Qt is also a way forward. As said in Maemo 6 Qt will be much more central than now.
 
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lcuk is offline lcuk
2009-10-25 , 19:21
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#57
tekojo,

without worrying about the keystone generic Qt classes you mentioned, I think what attila77 said a couple of pages back is very relevant and will need catering for with the tablet classes.

Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
I might have missed something here, but how will you solve the problem of Maemo APIs if you develop with Qt Creator on a desktop platform ? Only the simplest of apps can be developed in Creator and then 'just compiled in SB', and even then, you WILL have ifdefs. Try to access the address book, the desktop, widgets, MAFW, the location framework, accelerometers, cellular or IM functionality and suddently you find yourself in the middle of nowhere...
even if these nokia mobile platform * classes return dummy data when run on the desktop initially (perhaps the API could be generic enough to allow outlook contact lookup etc) it would help integration. this is sasler said in reply.

is it possible to use some the C definitions in use for the current libraries to construct the revision 0.01 binding classes of the required functions based on their APIs?
(i know it is in python, but not sure how to go about it in Qt)

thats just just thinking about something like hermes or some of the requested/implemented widgets.


* named to attempt to cater for symbian too
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attila77 is offline attila77
2009-10-25 , 21:28
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#58
Originally Posted by tekojo View Post
Have to agree somewhat to this. Having read some of the Python apps in extras-testing this weekend, Python is a simple and fast way to get going.

However don't underestimate Qt before trying it out, the library set is impressive. I see it more as a language preference thing.
Qt is also a way forward. As said in Maemo 6 Qt will be much more central than now.
Hey, don't get me wrong, Qt is my weapon/toolkit of choice. Python/Eclipse/etc and Qt do not exclude each other, au contraire. Don't let the fact I occasionally write simple apps in GTK (too keep dependency sizes down) mislead you
 

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tekojo is offline tekojo
2009-10-26 , 13:05
Posts: 148 | Thanked: 484 times | Joined on Nov 2008
#59
Originally Posted by attila77 View Post
Hey, don't get me wrong, Qt is my weapon/toolkit of choice. Python/Eclipse/etc and Qt do not exclude each other, au contraire. Don't let the fact I occasionally write simple apps in GTK (too keep dependency sizes down) mislead you
Sorry, didn't know your preference (or rather ambidextrity) :-)

But we do want a solution for the simple native developer. Python is coming along pretty well by itself.
There are similar things to think about, like libraries and should they be wrapped. Speaking of which someone already put up a project to wrap N900 specific libraries to Qt style.
 
Sasler is offline Sasler
2009-10-28 , 13:22
Posts: 434 | Thanked: 325 times | Joined on Sep 2009
#60
Are there any good tutorials for coding to Maemo 5 in Qt?
 
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