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2009-11-24
, 09:07
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Posts: 1,418 |
Thanked: 1,541 times |
Joined on Feb 2008
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#502
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Originally Posted by fanoush
I am afraid I have to agree with fanoush on this one. Developer or no developer, if the thing breaks, it is still broken =(
That reasoning still doesn't make sense. If I need it for development and it breaks, it is end of development. Not good.
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2009-11-24
, 09:19
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Posts: 137 |
Thanked: 170 times |
Joined on Jul 2008
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#503
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Originally Posted by qgil
As DDP device is for development will I get serial cable with it? I would like to do some kernel development for it and this is hard without such lowlevel access.
The reason is that they are supposed to be used for development, and not as primary devices.
JTAG informations would be nice too but probably will never be made available.
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2009-11-24
, 09:38
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Posts: 2,152 |
Thanked: 1,490 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ Czech Republic
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#504
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Just reiterating the point just in case in was missed in my previous post. This quote worries me a bit
Originally Posted by qgil
It is always great to find another way to help developers and I'm all for the listed stuff, but shouldn't really Nokia re-think some stuff behind DDP, Forum Nokia etc. (OVI store requirements mentioned elsewhere)? IMO times are changing. I wonder how many apps in iphone store are produced by commercial/for profit entities that can treat devices as disposable things and how many of them are done by hobbyists? What made sense with Symbian few years ago makes less sense today.
This DDP has got some problems and surely next time we will approach it differently.
...
- Get interesting deals cutting down entry costs for anybody loving Maemo and having difficulties paying the full prie of a device.
- Maybe something like a maemo.org voucher for contributors with +nnn karma can be done.
And leave Forum Nokia for Forum Nokia users. It will be your choice to join their programs or not.
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2009-11-24
, 09:51
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Posts: 2,355 |
Thanked: 5,249 times |
Joined on Jan 2009
@ Barcelona
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#505
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Originally Posted by sachin007
Exactly. While I personally believe "don't look a gift horse in the mouth" (specially since this is my first DDP and wouldn't want to mess up :P), most of the people on the program are going to use it as primary device, and that is a fact.
Especially because this device program includes maemo.org contributers more than developers...
I don't know what the DDP guys had in mind, but most of us are no companies -- and, at least, if I had a "primary device" myself I wouldn't have got the DDP one in the first place. Why would a lone coder have two devices?
I have to wonder if no warranty is only the first limitation in a series of coming ones since "the device is not for use as primary device"....
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2009-11-24
, 09:55
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Posts: 2,152 |
Thanked: 1,490 times |
Joined on Jan 2006
@ Czech Republic
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#506
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Originally Posted by Hrw
Good points behind this jabbing. DDP would be better if it allowed stuff like this (even with NDA signed). Serial port is the easier part but stuff like JTAG info, cold flashing info etc would be useful.
As DDP device is for development will I get serial cable with it? I would like to do some kernel development for it and this is hard without such lowlevel access.
JTAG informations would be nice too but probably will never be made available.
And BTW, this is off topic but serial port pinout for previous devices are known. I recently got serial working with 770 and N800 (I have two such devices with broken display and both work over serial). It is only about geting ca-42 cable from ebay (mine was US $2.68 including shipping), cutting it and attaching/soldering to right points, no extra HW needed. Just beware that there are two variants of such ca-42 cables, one with more wires that needs extra 3V power (or 5V so they can be used both with 3v and 5v levels) and one with less of them that are powered from USB port and work without extra power and use 3V. If you need such cable, let me know. I have few of them (both good and 'bad' variant) and can point you to ebay seller with high probability of having that easier variant.
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Last edited by fanoush; 2009-11-24 at 11:37.
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2009-11-24
, 10:25
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Posts: 137 |
Thanked: 170 times |
Joined on Jul 2008
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#507
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Originally Posted by fanoush
I know that serial pinouts are known. But it require hand soldering and combinations how to have serial attached and battery still in place when instead some kind of Nokia service tool can be used. And if DDP is meant for **development** then such tool should be made available as part of deal.
this is off topic but serial port pinout for previous devices are known.
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2009-11-24
, 10:32
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Posts: 138 |
Thanked: 262 times |
Joined on Oct 2006
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#508
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Originally Posted by qgil
It's not really a discount then, so much as a gamble. I can't afford to gamble with this much money. Can you fix this Quim? I want to believe.
So yes, confirmed. DDP devices don't have guarantee. The reason is that they are supposed to be used for development, and not as primary devices.
I guess I'll have to decide whether to re-order elsewhere, or get a 3rd party warranty. Will there be other items missing from the box? Video cables? Headphones?
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2009-11-24
, 10:41
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Posts: 3,401 |
Thanked: 1,255 times |
Joined on Nov 2005
@ London, UK
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#509
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The thought occurred to me that the people least able to afford a full-price N900 will be the most likely people to take a gamble on the DDP, and they will be the same people who can least afford to be left with a €250 paperweight. I really do fear that this forum in the near future will be full of negative vibes from people who took the gamble on DDP, and lost.
The DDP is undeniably a good deal, but only if you can afford to take the risk on throwing away €250, or able to write it off against tax.
The DDP is not a good deal for community members/open source developers who are giving their own precious time to support and evangelise the N900, typically their only N900.
Contrary to popular opinion I do want the N900, maemo.org, Maemo 5 and Nokia to succeed, but this isn't the way to go about it. Since a warranty on DDP devices is extremely unlikely I think the only solution is to now offer discount codes to DDP eligible members for use in Nokia Stores that will bring the price down to €250 or thereabouts.
Last edited by Milhouse; 2009-11-24 at 10:54.
The DDP is undeniably a good deal, but only if you can afford to take the risk on throwing away €250, or able to write it off against tax.
The DDP is not a good deal for community members/open source developers who are giving their own precious time to support and evangelise the N900, typically their only N900.
Contrary to popular opinion I do want the N900, maemo.org, Maemo 5 and Nokia to succeed, but this isn't the way to go about it. Since a warranty on DDP devices is extremely unlikely I think the only solution is to now offer discount codes to DDP eligible members for use in Nokia Stores that will bring the price down to €250 or thereabouts.
Last edited by Milhouse; 2009-11-24 at 10:54.
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2009-11-24
, 10:48
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Posts: 3,105 |
Thanked: 11,088 times |
Joined on Jul 2007
@ Mountain View (CA, USA)
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#510
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Originally Posted by lma
As answered before, our invitation was made to the people that received it, nominally. It's up to them to decide what to do with it.
Does it make sense for eligible people who are not going to take advantage of the DDP offer to somehow give it back so it can be redistributed to interested people on the queue? If the budget and devices have been allocated it seems a shame to let them go unused, at least if the logistics are not too complicated.
I'd be happy to wait a while longer for this to be setup as long as it ensured a full warranty - I guess the only people who would be unhappy would be those who would not be able to obtain a US keyboard.