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2009-12-09
, 00:05
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Posts: 607 |
Thanked: 450 times |
Joined on Sep 2009
@ Washington, DC
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#12
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Originally Posted by jsa
I wish that were the case but all too often even the most reasonable non-complimentary posts are attacked by our fanboys.
I guess it's mostly about how the complaints are presented. If the post is civilized and constructive I've found you get pretty reasonable replies.
Originally Posted by jsa
I'd try and answer it honestly as best you know. This is especially true of apps which may or may not be under development. Unfortunately it is not true of the Maemo OS.
Just an example: "This phone doesn't have X, this is complete bull****! Android has this, how dare Nokia release this kind of crap! It's unusable for me because of this!"
Now how do you answer this? You can say that maybe the feature wasn't a priority, after all it's just a matter of time and resources.
Part of the problem is that Nokia hides too many answers. You want to know the planned release date (2 Feb 2010) and content of Firefox 3.5.7 (which is two releases away)? Go to https://wiki.mozilla.org/Releases. You want to know about Firefox 4 which isn't scheduled until 2H2010? Go to https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/Roadmap. You want to know about any Maemo release date or content? Nokia isn't telling.
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2009-12-09
, 00:07
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Posts: 280 |
Thanked: 72 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
@ Switzerland
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#13
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Idiots .
__________________
How come wrong numbers are never busy?
How come wrong numbers are never busy?
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2009-12-09
, 00:11
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Posts: 373 |
Thanked: 40 times |
Joined on Nov 2009
@ Norwich
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#15
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you do have a point but hopefully the parts of the functionality that are still a little basic will be improved upon in time and if not i'm 90% sure there'll be 3rd party applications that will be more comprehensive in their abilites. for example a better media player. flash 10 support i suppose is down to nokia / maemo team unless its possible to make your own plugins for the browser (not sure cos havent played with the SDK much yet) in which case to open source community will surely deliver some flash 10 support. I think really its only a matter of time before the device has everything it needs
Last edited by NotTheMessiah; 2009-12-09 at 00:15.
__________________
i finally have the device and its even better than i could have ever possibley imagined! well done nokia, very well done indeed!
i finally have the device and its even better than i could have ever possibley imagined! well done nokia, very well done indeed!
Last edited by NotTheMessiah; 2009-12-09 at 00:15.
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2009-12-09
, 07:46
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Posts: 2,173 |
Thanked: 2,678 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
@ Cornwall, UK
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#16
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Actually, Eyn, I think you're missing my point.
As jsa has pointed out, there's an issue with how complaints are presented: it is hard to know what to say when someone posts a rant because it seems they just want to rant.
However, there is nonetheless a good response, not in words but in actions.
When an individual says one thing and does another, a good rule of thumb is that there is more 'truth' in their actions than their words. If you take The Community as a whole (not sure you can, but just for this point) the Community may be saying "Go buy an iphone, you whinger!" but what it is doing is filtering the rant to see if there is a valid complaint and acting on that complaint accordingly. If you only take the words at face value as the response, you will see only a tiny bit of how people are responding to complaints.
Which is, as Texrat pointed out, a filtering exercise. Filter the valid compaint out from the rant, then filter the useful response out from the unwelcoming unkindness.
Would it be ideal if every complaint (and especially the calm, rational ones) were met with an equally calm reply that there's already a bug filed/brainstorm posted/app under development? Sure it would. Sadly, internet fora don't work like that. Hopefully the people complaining also realise that.
Maybe you could be part of the solution by pointing people to where their complaints are being addressedand encouraging them to vote on bugs and brainstorms?
Last edited by RevdKathy; 2009-12-09 at 08:17.
As jsa has pointed out, there's an issue with how complaints are presented: it is hard to know what to say when someone posts a rant because it seems they just want to rant.
However, there is nonetheless a good response, not in words but in actions.
When an individual says one thing and does another, a good rule of thumb is that there is more 'truth' in their actions than their words. If you take The Community as a whole (not sure you can, but just for this point) the Community may be saying "Go buy an iphone, you whinger!" but what it is doing is filtering the rant to see if there is a valid complaint and acting on that complaint accordingly. If you only take the words at face value as the response, you will see only a tiny bit of how people are responding to complaints.
Which is, as Texrat pointed out, a filtering exercise. Filter the valid compaint out from the rant, then filter the useful response out from the unwelcoming unkindness.
Would it be ideal if every complaint (and especially the calm, rational ones) were met with an equally calm reply that there's already a bug filed/brainstorm posted/app under development? Sure it would. Sadly, internet fora don't work like that. Hopefully the people complaining also realise that.
Maybe you could be part of the solution by pointing people to where their complaints are being addressedand encouraging them to vote on bugs and brainstorms?
__________________
Hi! I'm Kathy and I'm a Maemo Greeter! Welcome.
Useful links for newcomers: New members say hello , New users start here, Community subforum, Beginners' wiki page, Maemo5 101, Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Did you know Meego.com has forums too?
Hi! I'm Kathy and I'm a Maemo Greeter! Welcome.
Useful links for newcomers: New members say hello , New users start here, Community subforum, Beginners' wiki page, Maemo5 101, Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)
Did you know Meego.com has forums too?
Last edited by RevdKathy; 2009-12-09 at 08:17.
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2009-12-09
, 09:14
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Posts: 289 |
Thanked: 560 times |
Joined on May 2009
@ Tampere, Finland
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#17
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Originally Posted by DaveP1
Yes, fanboyism stinks. But can you really avoid it anywhere? I'd urge everyone to really try and see the shades of grey.
I wish that were the case but all too often even the most reasonable non-complimentary posts are attacked by our fanboys.
Originally Posted by DaveP1
I was mostly talking about the out of the box package. I honestly think that some people might be better off with something else for now. There are features missing, rough edges, annoyances and I don't think anyone here is denying it? But people seem to get offended if they are (often realistically) suggested that maybe this iteration isn't the best for their use case.
I'd try and answer it honestly as best you know. This is especially true of apps which may or may not be under development. Unfortunately it is not true of the Maemo OS.
I'm not sure if I understood you correctly.. so do you really think that Nokia or the Maemo team isn't constrained by time and resources? Of course they are. I'm 100 % sure they didn't leave all this stuff out because they thought it wasn't needed. It's balancing between when to release and what to put in. Now what you _can_ argue is whether they should have released it later with more features implemented. This is a matter of opinion and there are good arguments on both sides.
Originally Posted by DaveP1
This is another case where things just aren't black and white. Just food for thought.. What if Firefox missed the planned release date? Do you think there'd be something in the league of 10000 angry messages on their boards and people proposing class-action lawsuits like here? Do you think Nokia's and Mozilla's business models and competition are similar enough so that you can just compare the practices 1:1? I don't think Nokia is keeping information on themselves just to piss people off but I'm most certainly not saying there's no room for improvement.
Part of the problem is that Nokia hides too many answers. You want to know the planned release date (2 Feb 2010) and content of Firefox 3.5.7 (which is two releases away)? Go to https://wiki.mozilla.org/Releases. You want to know about Firefox 4 which isn't scheduled until 2H2010? Go to https://wiki.mozilla.org/Firefox/Roadmap. You want to know about any Maemo release date or content? Nokia isn't telling.
You can find quite a bit of information about stuff brewing at Nokia that is publically available, so it also isn't quite right to say that Nokia isn't telling about their future plans.
| The Following User Says Thank You to jsa For This Useful Post: | ||
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2009-12-09
, 09:27
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Posts: 3,159 |
Thanked: 2,023 times |
Joined on Feb 2008
@ Finland
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#18
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Originally Posted by God
thank you for this useful post
Idiots .
...not
__________________
Want to know something?
K.I.S.S. approach:
wiki category:beginners. Browse it through and you'll be much wiser!
If the link doesn't help, just use
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Want to know something?
K.I.S.S. approach:
wiki category:beginners. Browse it through and you'll be much wiser!
If the link doesn't help, just use
Google Custom Search
| The Following User Says Thank You to ossipena For This Useful Post: | ||
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2009-12-09
, 09:30
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Posts: 418 |
Thanked: 174 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
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#19
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Originally Posted by ossipena
thank you for this useful post
...not
You should go back and look at some of your own posts ossipena...
__________________
I luv Google
I luv Google
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2009-12-09
, 09:36
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Posts: 3,159 |
Thanked: 2,023 times |
Joined on Feb 2008
@ Finland
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#20
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Originally Posted by jsa
I've noticed the same.
I guess it's mostly about how the complaints are presented. If the post is civilized and constructive I've found you get pretty reasonable replies. But way too often people come here just to vent. They're pissed of because feature X that they had with their previous device Y doesn't exist or they don't like how something works and label the whole device crap in the process. That's when they get jumped on, because there are quite a lot of happy users to whom that feature X might be trivial and have the device for entirely different reasons.
Just an example: "This phone doesn't have X, this is complete bull****! Android has this, how dare Nokia release this kind of crap! It's unusable for me because of this!"
Now how do you answer this? You can say that maybe the feature wasn't a priority, after all it's just a matter of time and resources. But will they take it for an answer? No. The second option is to just say they might be better off with Android then? But in the end there just is no answer that will satisfy them. I usually just stay quiet.
people write their firs post at really aggressive tone when their device is rebooting all the time. blaming that the device is ****, nokia will die because of that, community members are all gay etc...
a) there is thread here for that
b) there is a bugzilla entry for that
c) http://www.google.fi/search?rls=en&q=n900+random+reboot
(both of two previous can be found from first page)
or the n900 really sucks where OP starts by dissing the device and continues it until he admits at the end that he can't give his device away
remember that forest will always answer at the same tone you shout at there.
first lot of people come here trollin all the way when there is a delay, then another mob comes here to troll about how n900 is a failure (and they have defective hw for example).
and at the same people blame the community because they're not spoonfeeding about how to install extras-dev or testing stuff and other .debs. then they will come and blame n900 because it was bricked in the process.
so in nutshell: there is no realistic way to please that group of people....
__________________
Want to know something?
K.I.S.S. approach:
wiki category:beginners. Browse it through and you'll be much wiser!
If the link doesn't help, just use
Google Custom Search
Want to know something?
K.I.S.S. approach:
wiki category:beginners. Browse it through and you'll be much wiser!
If the link doesn't help, just use
Google Custom Search
to big for my pocket and I have to carry an extra phone.