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Milhouse is offline Milhouse
2010-02-23 , 20:44
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#151
Originally Posted by Reggie View Post
A forum for each device from my experience, works, from the end-user perspective.
Do you mean what I would call a "sub-forum" (forum within a forum) for each device, rather than a forum per device on a separate server?

I can certainly see the merits of the former, with owners clubbing together to help out etc., and perhaps when there are multiple devices running MeeGo it's the kind of organisational change that could, if thought appropriate, be made to a a meego.com forum.

What concerns me is a forum on one server for MeeGo Device X, and a forum on another server for MeeGo Device Y, and a device independent forum at meego.com, when there is so much overlap between device X and device Y and the membership of meego.com.
 
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Reggie is offline Reggie
2010-02-23 , 20:52
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#152
Originally Posted by Milhouse View Post
What concerns me is a forum on one server for MeeGo Device X, and a forum on another server for MeeGo Device Y, and a device independent forum at meego.com, when there is so much overlap between device X and device Y and the membership of meego.com.
Sorry if I misunderstood you. Yes, that is painful, but you know what, it happens all the time. Not that it is correct, but most of the time, it happens when there are no official forums for that device or a lack of support in that 'official' forum. It's the latter that needs to be done right.
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fms is offline fms
2010-02-23 , 20:58
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#153
Originally Posted by qgil View Post
I don't see the birth of a meego.com forum as the death of talk.maemo.org!!
Actually, just because you do not see it, does not mean it will not happen.

tmo is indeed a very interesting place with a lot of value. Why not keeping it to discuss about those Nokia products with Maemo/MeeGo inside.
Problem is, a lot of people will now have to keep track of both forums and they will most likely abandon one of them for the other. This is most likely going to be detrimental to both tmo and the meego.com forums. Can we please just have a single site, with subforums dedicated to MeeGo and Maemo devices, with Maemo stuff being slowly phased out as MeeGo devices hit the market? Notice that it is quite possible to have this site accessible from both talk.maemo.org and talk.meego.com domains and have different visual themes/style depending on which domain the user is coming from. You can even reorder subforums based on the domain, placing MeeGo subforums at the top for the meego.com users!
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Milhouse is offline Milhouse
2010-02-23 , 21:04
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#154
Originally Posted by Reggie View Post
Sorry if I misunderstood you. Yes, that is painful, but you know what, it happens all the time. Not that it is correct, but most of the time, it happens when there are no official forums for that device or a lack of support in that 'official' forum. It's the latter that needs to be done right.
Ultimately I would like to see representation for all MeeGo devices within a single MeeGo forum, I think most people agree with that (although I could be wrong).

The sticking point seems to be whether end-user device support is going to play nicely with the big boys and their technical discussions - I can't see why it shouldn't.

What if there were two meego.com hosted forums, maybe a dev.meego.com and a talk.meego.com with the devices split out within the latter and a wider range of discussion/banter/chat, while technical discussion takes place in the former? I'm not suggesting it's ideal, not even sure it offers any advantages from a forum administration point of view... just that I think we're going round in circles.
 

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Texrat is offline Texrat
2010-02-23 , 21:27
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#155
Originally Posted by Milhouse View Post
Ultimately I would like to see representation for all MeeGo devices within a single MeeGo forum, I think most people agree with that (although I could be wrong).
I'd really rather see brand-specific stuff in its own forum.

This was all cut-and-dry when Maemo AND every device pointed back to Nokia. That won't be the case going forward. And I don't think MeeGo wants to be the *official* support channel for every type of hardware it winds up on. If this is successful, that leads to a very messy forum-- worse than we have now, and people complain now. A lot.

Consider: MeeGo is the brand now.

I'd rather focus on the OS, the applications... the aspects that are universal or mostly so. And for devices, certainly allow the posts but for triage purposes that would include referrals to better fora (like Forum Nokia). Many here want a "Complaints" subforum here for a similar purpose-- maybe MeeGo.com forum ends up with a Device Questions subforum...
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Last edited by Texrat; 2010-02-23 at 22:34.
 

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Jaffa is offline Jaffa
2010-02-23 , 21:58
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#156
Originally Posted by qgil View Post
Or wasn't http://www.talkandroid.com/android-forums/ the "more official" forum? It's really difficult to tell who is who in the world of Android forums.

Actually the Android case is an example of clearly separate forums for developers and rest of the world.

The official Android "forums" are http://developer.android.com/resourc...ty-groups.html

http://androidforums.com/ is a private initiative from http://phandroid.com/ and both sites ar full of advertisement. I guess it's someone's business, and in it sense of course their interest is to embrace as much as possible.
And, as you say on Twitter, this is a "mess". All the people I know who own Android devices say they own an Android device. However, because android.com doesn't provide a space for power-users and enthusiasts to sit, there are fora popping up everywhere fragmenting the user community - let alone the user community from the developer community from the power-user community.

meego.com taking a "we cater to the developers who build on top of our platform" will discourage developers from interacting with users (why do I want to follow 4 different sites to see who's talking about my software) and prevent a critical mass of MeeGo users from gathering in any one single place.

Nokia obviously wants MeeGo to be a brand which is exposed to users (otherwise we'd have "Maemo 6, powered by MeeGo" for Harmattan) - so going to whatever lengths are necessary to prevent the fragementation of the platform that every commentator says is a risk and/or issue for Android must be the #1 priority as one of the two commercial stakeholders. Not turning away from end-users, not washing your hands of existing Maemo devices and not providing easy-to-use cross-platform, cross-device tools, deployment options and APIs for developers are the way to do that.

However, how much can we do to prevent that? Why device vendors, operators and private businesses would act differently with MeeGo?
Surely something that Nokia can answer from their own point-of-view and any other manufacturers Nokia have been talking to? This is a case of leading by example early on and using the shared leadership of the TSG to ensure that technically the platform can deliver that. (Similar sentiments can be expressed here about the talk of vendor-specific app stores rather than enabling/facilitating an Extras model for "MeeGo" applications.)
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Jaffa is offline Jaffa
2010-02-23 , 22:10
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#157
Originally Posted by fms View Post
Problem is, a lot of people will now have to keep track of both forums and they will most likely abandon one of them for the other. This is most likely going to be detrimental to both tmo and the meego.com forums. Can we please just have a single site, with subforums dedicated to MeeGo and Maemo devices, with Maemo stuff being slowly phased out as MeeGo devices hit the market?
A big part of how quickly maemo.org will fade out is whether MeeGo is a realistic day-to-day OS for existing Maemo 5 users; Harmattan users and maybe even N8x0 users.

If, despite MeeGo's open source platform and the power and leadership Nokia have for MeeGo (and their own devices), Maemo 5 is the last usable OS for the N900, and there's no realistic progression from "MeeGo/Harmattan" to "real MeeGo"; then maemo.org will have a long life which will decline slowly. If, however, Maemo as an OS is replaced on thousands of devices with MeeGo then the decline could - and should - be a lot quicker.

It's also important to note that we're told Harmattan plans aren't changed by the MeeGo announcement (we don't know how much they were planned around MeeGo anyway - perhaps why the SDK is late?). Therefore, I'm going to assume that Harmattan is basically Fremantle + Qt 4.x + Aegis.

Even if this is released under a MeeGo brand, the people who are best placed to support that OS, and get existing Maemo applications running on the "community managed" Gtk+ is the existing Maemo community. Spawning a MeeGo forum too quickly will mean that one of the few things that Nokia are bringing to MeeGo (apart from their name) - the existing community of savvy power-users and enthusiasts will be lost. This will have two effects:
  1. The MeeGo community will be at the 770 level in terms of processes, procedures, channels and so on. It will take years to grow that community into something of the complexity of the Maemo community (and many of the same mistakes can be avoided). This effectively "reboots" Maemo into MeeGo, meaning that Nokia is starting with a new next-generation mobile platform rather than continuing the one they've got; meaning more lost ground against iPhone OS and Android.
  2. The existing Maemo community will have no continuity into MeeGo, and we might as well go and buy in to a different platform.

Of course, point #2 may mean Nokia can get rid of some of us ;-)
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maxximuscool is offline maxximuscool
2010-02-23 , 22:38
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#158
MeeGo Forum is boring.. I registered but there is nothing much happening there. So cannot be day to day thing.

But what is the whole point of going to MeeGo forum? Since N900 is not official support by MeeGo and it's only good for Developers. We are the normal Users won't find it that related to N900 at the moment until QT4.6 is released or something.
Last edited by maxximuscool; 2010-02-23 at 22:41.
 
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Texrat is offline Texrat
2010-02-23 , 22:47
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#159
WHAT MeeGo forum?
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silvermountain is offline silvermountain
2010-02-23 , 23:25
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#160
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
WHAT MeeGo forum?
Oh man, they are great!
There's candy, free booze - and no Bugzilla.
Pretty much heaven.

I likes it!
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