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2011-03-08
, 23:07
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Posts: 1,680 |
Thanked: 3,685 times |
Joined on Jan 2011
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#12
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If i hear anyone say the word ecosystem again I am going to punch them in the dick, that goes for other horseshit such as 'synergise' and 'vertical integration'.
OK?
OK?
__________________
N900: One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die.
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2011-03-08
, 23:12
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Posts: 1,341 |
Thanked: 708 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#13
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Originally Posted by mikecomputing
You will see, the first Meego phone with (Alien) Dalvik VM will be a success story. Myriad has hinted they've been discussing with couple of hw manufactors. It is a mistake if Nokia comes without and Samsung comes with next autumn (Meego phone).
here we go again about Dalvik dont you get it or what? Dalvik/Andrroid is a different ecosystem. its like saying linux on desktop will not success if Linux doesnt havee support for windows api.
hell no meego has already a good ecosysteem in form of qt problem is stuipid Nokia decisions nothing else...
I understand if Qt+C++ developers are afraid of competition, but there is room and use cases for both in the same open platform.
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2011-03-08
, 23:27
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Posts: 3,464 |
Thanked: 5,107 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
@ Gothenburg in Sweden
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#14
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Originally Posted by zimon
competition? first of its just pointless have Dalvik.
You will see, the first Meego phone with (Alien) Dalvik VM will be a success story. Myriad has hinted they've been discussing with couple of hw manufactors. It is a mistake if Nokia comes without and Samsung comes with next autumn (Meego phone).
I understand if Qt+C++ developers are afraid of competition, but there is room and use cases for both in the same open platform.
Next QtQuick language is not C++ its javascript based. Qt also has Pyside/python so if you think it has todo with favourite language youre wrong.
Point is we dont need yet another sdk in form of Dalvik SDK when wee already have a SDK in form of Qt?
it will just fragment and hurt Meego platform.
and btw having Dalvik why dont have .NET(mono) also? and why not Adobe AIR?
no thanks atleast not in core meego. you forget that more sdk:s also take more ram@and flashmemory. We already has those problems in Mameo 5 in form of both Qt/Gtk+ where Qt probadly is slower cause it doesnt fit on NAND and instead is stored inEMMC. so how do you fix this issues with a fully DalvikSDK + QtSDK?
Right now I dont think meego handset will sucees et all.
Evderything seems still going dogslow and Elop also has scared away some devs both inside and outside Nokia...
But if meego "only succes if it has Dalvik" why dont just go with buy an Android handset instead?
My personal option right now is to go webos if it doesnt happen something good at the meego onference in may...
Last edited by mikecomputing; 2011-03-08 at 23:40.
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2011-03-08
, 23:46
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Posts: 275 |
Thanked: 389 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
@ Sydney
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#15
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Originally Posted by vi_
That would be a an impending disruption rather than a "future disruption"
If i hear anyone say the word ecosystem again I am going to punch them in the dick, that goes for other horseshit such as 'synergise' and 'vertical integration'.
OK?
__________________
Quick Widgets - http://wiki.maemo.org/Quick_Widgets
Quick Widgets - http://wiki.maemo.org/Quick_Widgets
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2011-03-08
, 23:58
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Posts: 1,341 |
Thanked: 708 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#16
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Originally Posted by mikecomputing
It is not LSB Linux platform like Meego is.
But if meego "only succes if it has Dalvik" why dont just go with buy an Android handset instead?
There is much more people who rather develop in Java than with (messy and error prone) QML+Qt+C++ for lots of reasons. And Dalvik has some good improvements over standard Java, which hopefully will be integrated to real Java one day also.
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2011-03-09
, 00:26
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Posts: 1,746 |
Thanked: 2,100 times |
Joined on Sep 2009
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#17
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Originally Posted by zimon
An LSB Linux platform is irrelevant if you've effectively thrown out the whole of the platform by going Dalvik. Which, of course, was the whole purpose in Google using it.
It is not LSB Linux platform like Meego is.
Last edited by wmarone; 2011-03-09 at 00:57.
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2011-03-09
, 09:36
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Posts: 1,341 |
Thanked: 708 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#18
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Originally Posted by wmarone
Dalvik and its (Android) software libraries could be thought just like Java and its libraries or Python and its libraries. It is a way how interpreted languages succeed that they have some kind of standard software library with them.
An LSB Linux platform is irrelevant if you've effectively thrown out the whole of the platform by going Dalvik. Which, of course, was the whole purpose in Google using it.
And I rather run Java-applications also on a LSB compliant Linux system than in MS-Windows. I like to have SELinux and standard Linux tools underneath. So would many Android developers.
I think Java/Dalvik as just an improved J2ME/MIDP-platform.
When Dalvik has come to Meego, and if Meego succeeds, some Java-developers may start to use Qt from Java/Dalvik.
Running applications in a VM is a modern thing and has come to stay also in mobile devices. There is a still place for native applications, but in a long run I think their share will go smaller.
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2011-03-09
, 10:14
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Posts: 61 |
Thanked: 30 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ Madrid, Spain
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#19
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Going back to topic, to me this new appointment only means that while Meego does exist at Nokia as an OS, there has to be someone leading the project.
On the other hand, the Meego for N900 official support is just a consequence of the cancellation of the original Qwerty N9-00 Developer device.
The Meego product will be a stylish touchscreen, qwertyless, they need a Qwerty device to encourage developers to test and extend the platform and thus, N900 seems like a good alternative if you have no other devices in the pipeline.
My two cents.
On the other hand, the Meego for N900 official support is just a consequence of the cancellation of the original Qwerty N9-00 Developer device.
The Meego product will be a stylish touchscreen, qwertyless, they need a Qwerty device to encourage developers to test and extend the platform and thus, N900 seems like a good alternative if you have no other devices in the pipeline.
My two cents.
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2011-03-09
, 10:28
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Posts: 5 |
Thanked: 1 time |
Joined on Mar 2010
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#20
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In Nokia's decision to go WP7 the element that makes least sense is to not port Qt to WP7.
The point of Nokia buying Qt was to commoditize the OS, so that apps would not be so tightly coupled to - say - symbian.
Windows mobile market share is sinking, and unless the first WP7 phone from Nokia is a huge hit, it is highly unlikely that WP7 market share will ever make it into double digits. And the chances of the first wp7 phone being a hit are slim - it will have problems - it usually takes 2-3 iterations to get something new like that right.
So Nokia must have a plan B. Obviously they cannot publicly announce it as it would signal lack of confidence in plan A, but it must exist.
And this is the weird part: How will they be able to move to another platform if all the apps are silverlight-based?
If Microsoft decides sometime in 2012 or 2013 to abandon WP7, Nokia will be (very far) up **** creek.
Had Nokia insted crafted the agreement with Microsoft so that porting Qt to WP7 was part of it, they would, in my view, be far better off.
I imagine that there have been hard diskussions on this subject internally in Nokia, and I hope that some of the (somewhat encouraging) announcements we have seen around Meego in the last two weeks, are expressions of these discussions.
The point of Nokia buying Qt was to commoditize the OS, so that apps would not be so tightly coupled to - say - symbian.
Windows mobile market share is sinking, and unless the first WP7 phone from Nokia is a huge hit, it is highly unlikely that WP7 market share will ever make it into double digits. And the chances of the first wp7 phone being a hit are slim - it will have problems - it usually takes 2-3 iterations to get something new like that right.
So Nokia must have a plan B. Obviously they cannot publicly announce it as it would signal lack of confidence in plan A, but it must exist.
And this is the weird part: How will they be able to move to another platform if all the apps are silverlight-based?
If Microsoft decides sometime in 2012 or 2013 to abandon WP7, Nokia will be (very far) up **** creek.
Had Nokia insted crafted the agreement with Microsoft so that porting Qt to WP7 was part of it, they would, in my view, be far better off.
I imagine that there have been hard diskussions on this subject internally in Nokia, and I hope that some of the (somewhat encouraging) announcements we have seen around Meego in the last two weeks, are expressions of these discussions.
Hell no! Meego has already a good ecosystem in form of Qt problem is stupid Nokia decisions who had scared away alot of Qt and Meego devs even if the Qt framework is very good/stable and development with Qt(Quick) is easy/powerfull.
Biggest Problem is Nokia. Not lack of yet another framework(dalvik)
And btw. Meego doesnt need zillions halfdone apps in a store like Android. What Meego needs is quality apps this is far more important than zillion apps.
Last edited by mikecomputing; 2011-03-08 at 23:14.