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krisse is offline krisse
2009-04-25 , 14:32
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#91
Skipping the question of whether the Internet Tablets have seen "significant" sales as we don't know the sales numbers or targets,
Just looking at the 5800 alone, it is now apparently accounting for 20% of touchscreen device sales globally. If the tablets were selling anything like that much, surely Nokia would have announced it by now.


we've been told since September that Nokia will soon position Maemo devices at the top of their product line, pushing S60 devices down to mid-level.
I don't know who told you that, but I have difficult believing them when Nokia is putting all their promotional efforts into the N97, which is due out in a couple of months:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2O2Li74EYew

The only way maemo devices could "push" S60 to mid-level is if maemo was used on a phone, otherwise maemo wouldn't really be an alternative to S60.

But if Nokia does try to make a maemo-based phone, it would mean developing two rival smartphone platforms simultaneously (maemo and symbian) which isn't good business sense. Apple got into that situation with the Apple II and Macintosh, and we know what happened there...



The continued, and even increased, hiring for Maemo during a recession that has forced Nokia to cut jobs in other areas only reinforces the importance of the platform to the company. This is further bolstered by signs that Nokia is preparing to have at least two Maemo 5 devices on the market simultaneously, presumably targeting different market segments.
I agree that's a good sign, but I'd be a lot happier knowing that this development would end up in a viable product.

Internet tablets without telephony aren't viable products. People do not want general pocket computers that lack the ability to do phone calls. If there was a demand for it, someone would be selling them in large quantities by now.



As for Tablet School, the articles and user-facing content fit neatly into the discussions about making maemo.org's news feeds less technically intimidating; and having someone of your clarity and passion writing software reviews (for example) would be of great benefit.
I write guides for the kind of people who don't even know what a command line is.

Apparently half of maemo users are developers, and I'm willing to bet the other half are mostly hardcore tech users. What would be the point of me being involved with a crowd like that?


making maemo.org's news feeds less technically intimidating
Maemo.org is never, ever, going to be a suitable place for consumers because it's a developer site.

Yes, end users of maemo and developers of maemo both use maemo, but their relationship to it is totally different and there is no potential overlap.

Imagine trying to merge a supermarket and chef school all into one building because chefs and supermarket customers deal with food: it would make no sense.
 

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mullf is offline mullf
2009-04-25 , 15:32
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#92
Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles View Post
This is a really silly decision to make when you haven't even seen the device.
I've seen how each new device gets worse and worse and worse, in terms of what I'm looking for from a tablet. The 770 was great, and it's been all down hill from there.
 
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2009-04-25 , 16:04
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#93
Originally Posted by krisse View Post
Internet tablets without telephony aren't viable products. People do not want general pocket computers that lack the ability to do phone calls. If there was a demand for it, someone would be selling them in large quantities by now.
Nokia wouldn't still be producing the tablets if A. they weren't selling and B. they didn't have a plan to end up with something they think will sell big.

Originally Posted by krisse View Post
Apparently half of maemo users are developers, and I'm willing to bet the other half are mostly hardcore tech users.
From what numbers? This is clearly not supported by the number of pure newbies we get bouncing through here and the number of users who still use Tablet School.

Originally Posted by krisse View Post
Maemo.org is never, ever, going to be a suitable place for consumers because it's a developer site.
Unfortunately, since you stormed out of the community, a lot has changed and your information has gone out of date. I disagree with 90% of the assertions you've made about the tablets and the community, and I and others have offered plenty of facts that would seem to disprove or erode many of those assertions, but you seem set or ignoring or dismissing them. So, why don't we just agree that you've made up your mind about the platform and that it's time to close Tablet Scene and move on?

(Just, FYI, it's "Maemo" and "maemo.org", not "maemo" and "Maemo.org")
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GeneralAntilles is offline GeneralAntilles
2009-04-25 , 16:07
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#94
Originally Posted by mullf View Post
I've seen how each new device gets worse and worse and worse, in terms of what I'm looking for from a tablet. The 770 was great, and it's been all down hill from there.
For me, it's been exactly the opposite. With the N800, I got a real SoC, stereo speakers, real memory card slots and a kickstand. It was a vast improvement over the 770. Then we got the N810 with a transflective screen, built-in GPS, and a slightly smaller size without sacrificing the form factor.

With the next generation, we're getting a really kick-*** SoC, a ton of awesome built-in features (FM RX/TX, accelerometers, dual cameras, etc.), and software to match.

I'd say it's time you stop pouting about the 770's hardcover and get over it or move on.
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2009-04-25 , 16:15
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#95
Originally Posted by GeneralAntilles View Post
I'd say it's time you stop pouting about the 770's hardcover and get over it or move on.
The hardcase is only one of multiple features on the 770 that I like that have gone/certainly look like they are going to go away. I posted about the features I like in my 770 here.
 
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2009-04-25 , 16:24
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#96
@krisse

I've seen these numbers more than once, so if they're true you're wrong about non-cellular devices. As of mid-March 2009, Apple has sold over 13 million iPod Touch's. And as of today I have not seen any announcements that Apple is discontinuing (sp?) that product. Nokia has my blessing to go after that market.
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2009-04-25 , 18:05
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#97
Originally Posted by daperl View Post
@krisse

I've seen these numbers more than once, so if they're true you're wrong about non-cellular devices. As of mid-March 2009, Apple has sold over 13 million iPod Touch's. And as of today I have not seen any announcements that Apple is discontinuing (sp?) that product. Nokia has my blessing to go after that market.
It's been about a year and a half since the iPod Touch launched, but let's be generous and assume it's only been a year.

13 million units a year is about 1% of the cellular market, which manages well over 1000 million units a year in total. Even just looking at smartphones, they account for about 100 million units a year. Cellular is in a totally different league, non-cellular doesn't even come close.

Looking at one company alone, Nokia sells about a million phones per day, so they'd sell 13 million phones in just under two weeks.

Whatever way you look at it, removing telephony greatly reduces the potential sales of a pocket-sized device.


So, why don't we just agree that you've made up your mind about the platform and that it's time to close Tablet Scene and move on?
I'm not criticising the maemo platform, I'm criticising Nokia for continually putting maemo onto hardware that is never going to generate enough sales to justify development costs. In a recession that kind of action is liable to kill the platform.

I like the maemo platform, that's why I'm trying to publicise what has to happen for the platform to survive.

If I wanted maemo to fail I'd be agreeing with every mistake Nokia makes! ;-)
 
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2009-04-25 , 21:26
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#98
You don't think 13 million is significant for a device that is not a phone, yet shares all of its technology with the most popular high-end phone? It's almost free money.

Call me naive or uninformed, but I think Nokia would welcome this high class problem.
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