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Cruelkix is offline Cruelkix
2008-10-01 , 03:43
Posts: 100 | Thanked: 38 times | Joined on Apr 2008
#101
I will not be upgrading from my n810 if there is no hard keyboard. I love my n810 keyboard and honestly I have relatively large hands. I'm 6' and can just barely palm a basketball (If I move I lose it, haha). The slide out design and placement of the keyboard is perfect, the keys and dpad just need a little love. I think a flush screen is the only other thing that would be really great along with a way to use the thing as both a camera and a webcam (like the n800 can). After that its internal hardware and software. The size and wieght are fine by me. I wouldn't sacrifice the screen size for anything.

As far as the OP. Keep the D-pad! Just make it better please.
 
ragnar is offline ragnar
2008-10-01 , 07:50
Posts: 631 | Thanked: 1,123 times | Joined on Sep 2005 @ Helsinki
#102
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
I respect ragnar and his experience, but I hope his opinion is not indicative of groupthink in that organization. The company in general already has a repuation (in the US at least) of not listening to customers, and thinking Our Way is The Way.
It's a matter of perspective here. Me personally, and Nokia as a company, listens to customers in a vast array of ways, through many user studies, usability tests, customer feedback etc. It's certainly not Our Way is The Way.

Obviously the goal is to make Maemo Software a mass market success. For that - and I hope people here do not take it the wrong way (foolish hope!) - the people here on this site do not fully represent the hopes and needs of an average mass market consumer. Early adopters (and developers) accept and look for solutions that need to be ... how should I say it, streamlined for wider acceptance. The future trends are picked up already, but in order to them to become mainstream, they need to packaged and presented in a manner which is somewhat contrary to what some people here feel.
 
doubledee is offline doubledee
2008-10-01 , 08:48
Posts: 14 | Thanked: 4 times | Joined on Sep 2008
#103
ah, it all just seems a bit of a shame - I agree with the guy who uses his d-pad for scolling ebooks/pdfs, with the other poster who uses drop down menus and then d-pad for executing commands (I've found myself doing that more, not less).

i think the keypad is great, but I didn't go for the 810 because you have to open it to get to the d pad. now it seems that won't be too much of a worry for the 900

still, i like to go forward rather than back, i suppose I just don't want to wait too long!
 
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lcuk is offline lcuk
2008-10-01 , 10:52
Posts: 1,635 | Thanked: 1,816 times | Joined on Apr 2008 @ Manchester, England
#104
I specifically fell in love with my n810 based on the keyboard.
I do not want a PDA.
I do not want to lose half my screen for a soft keyboard.

Of course, some software works really well onscreen and for small short wizards and dialogs its great, but if someone decided to make (for instance) a nice fast kinetic word processor or IDE It would be extremely wasteful to have to give up half the screen for it.

Now, if we could *double* the touchscreen size and have a slideout virtual keyboard or something, then I would agree.

But some tasks just need as much of the screen as possible.

$0.02
 

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Texrat is offline Texrat
2008-10-01 , 11:11
Posts: 11,700 | Thanked: 10,045 times | Joined on Jun 2006 @ North Texas, USA
#105
Originally Posted by ragnar View Post
...Nokia as a company, listens to customers in a vast array of ways, through many user studies, usability tests, customer feedback etc. It's certainly not Our Way is The Way. .
Hey, I work there, too. I know what I see.

Seriously, there are obvious flaws in our info gathering and dissemination processes. I'm well aware we do the work, but I'm also aware it isn't always properly prepared and/or digested. That's a common theme these days on the internal blogs. Just ask "the Hulk".

EDIT:

And in case the subject comes up, I don't think I'm revealing anything secret here. This disconnect is common to most large corporations, and consumers in the US have been grumbling about Nokia's deaf ears for at least a few years now.

The disconnect is obvious in certain regional sales numbers... in lack of positive street cred... in the success of some competitors' products.

I won't go into further details because then that would get sticky. I know you have read my blog, ragnar, but make sure to check out others. I'm actually mild in my criticisms-- others, especially some of my peers in your neck of the woods, don't mince words when it comes to Nokia's drift away from certain customers.

As for people here not representing consumers, I think you have a point in some respects but are off base in others. Many on this forum are leaders, who capture the sentiment of consumers and present it in concrete terms. Their well-reasoned input should be thoughtfully considered, not dismissed out of hand.
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Last edited by Texrat; 2008-10-01 at 12:02.
 
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fpp is offline fpp
2008-10-01 , 12:24
Posts: 2,853 | Thanked: 968 times | Joined on Nov 2005
#106
Yup. I've "sold" a few tablets to coworkers myself (or rather sold them on the tablets), who would otherwise have gone on to line Apple's pockets :-)
 
SD69 is offline SD69
2008-10-01 , 13:03
Posts: 1,513 | Thanked: 2,248 times | Joined on Mar 2006 @ US
#107
Originally Posted by ragnar View Post
It's a matter of perspective here. Me personally, and Nokia as a company, listens to customers in a vast array of ways, through many user studies, usability tests, customer feedback etc. It's certainly not Our Way is The Way.

Obviously the goal is to make Maemo Software a mass market success. For that - and I hope people here do not take it the wrong way (foolish hope!) - the people here on this site do not fully represent the hopes and needs of an average mass market consumer. Early adopters (and developers) accept and look for solutions that need to be ... how should I say it, streamlined for wider acceptance. The future trends are picked up already, but in order to them to become mainstream, they need to packaged and presented in a manner which is somewhat contrary to what some people here feel.
This is Nokia's goal, but let's remember that Nokia discontinued their touchscreen phones, missing the biggest user trend of the last three years (and let's not forget clamshells). The static I heard at the time was about unifying behind the S60 platform or something similar, not user inputs. S60 endures, IMO, because it works well and this is Nokia's strength - not predicting user trends (some of which are things like the RAZR). Time will tell whether or not the barren TS only UI is a fad, but we should guard against the usability of maemo getting adversely affected by a fad.

I for one understand the goal of commercial success. But many of the comments here are from the user perspective, heavy users who have been in effect testers and who by and large want to keep their physical keys for one reason or another. They should continue to be supported by maemo.
 

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TA-t3 is offline TA-t3
2008-10-01 , 14:15
Posts: 3,841 | Thanked: 1,079 times | Joined on Nov 2006
#108
I've shown my N800 to "normal" people when travelling, and many of them fall for it completely. Some of them says it's exactly what they want. The problem though is that usually it's not possible to buy the N8x0 in any of those places (including African countries).
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ragnar is offline ragnar
2008-10-01 , 15:25
Posts: 631 | Thanked: 1,123 times | Joined on Sep 2005 @ Helsinki
#109
Originally Posted by SD69 View Post
I for one understand the goal of commercial success. But many of the comments here are from the user perspective, heavy users who have been in effect testers and who by and large want to keep their physical keys for one reason or another. They should continue to be supported by maemo.
Yes. Support but don't require, as I wrote in a previous post. Or 'take advantage of them if available, but don't make your design unusable if they do not exist.'
 

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killdeer is offline killdeer
2008-10-01 , 17:23
Posts: 73 | Thanked: 17 times | Joined on Jun 2008 @ Ontario, Canada
#110
Originally Posted by iamthewalrus View Post
Obscuring the screen... the cool thing to do is 'swipe' nowadays.
That may be true but how do I "swipe" one handed? I'd still prefer a "jog dial". Even if it's not on the front face it could be on a side panel.
 
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