Is it late to ask Nokia to make java and symbians applications workin on the N900? it could help us to use more applications.

I don't like how Apple and AT&T have made jailbreaking your iPhone a crime. I dislike it and disagree with it fully. And I'm one of the few iPhone users that have never asked for a moment of support. So I should be able to do anything I wish to my phone.

Bingo. But because it's not supposed to be done doesn't mean it shouldn't be.

Jailbroken phones are typically denied upgrades; however the scene supplies the updates rather quickly. I'm just not a fan of being told what to do on my item I've purchased.

That's why I wanted a N900 somewhat, but that T-Mobile frequency is the limiting factor.

And I disagree with them.

It has to be the most disappointing highly anticipated release I have seen in my life (3GS). I had most features on my JB iphone anyway.

You know... performance is brought up time and time again as a positive; however I hope the apps come forward and have the things that people want.

Video chat? Not shown so far - Skype won't have it. Location aware? It did make it, it seems... but will all apps (or most) be location aware?

Sorta takes me back to BeOS. 64-bit file system journaling, made for media from the ground up, made the PowerPC 604 actually scream whereas nothing else really did.

And yet, the fact it had no compelling apps for it other than the ones that came from BeOS and Gobi... it faltered. Well that and a healthy dose of Apple switching directions to BSD/NextStep surprising BeOS... but that aside.

It was pretty damn superior to everything out at the time, yet it had no apps that compelled people to get it, use it. And that's a potential problem I see with the N900. Only because I see how the N810 went down.

Not a lot of apps were updated. Not a lot of commercial apps came out for it. And as it stands, the community has yet to create a video chat app - outside of aMSN - that really was reliable enough for me to champion.

Now... with this talk about the iPhone, let me say this as an original iPhone and iPhone 3G owner... the 3GS should be seen by Nokia as a way to really stick it to the competition. The 3GS is a money grab. It's a disappointment because the rumors were better than the reality. Simply put, Apple got lazy. There could have been so much more potential - even a new look... and all of it centered around a slightly faster processor, a slightly better OS... but same look, perhaps a rather usable compass... and full 3D specs that will cause a slight rift in a bit (look for 3GS only games in a bit).

Now... with that said. the iPhone has fun, funky, stupid and some are downright deplorable. But with the advertisements stating "there's an app for this/that"... Apple is proving that marketing can make more strides than sheer technical awesomeness. A situation where the mediocre will come out on top.

Why? All of the bickering about "Which shell will it have?" or "Why isn't there a pipe key on the keyboard?" or even "Can I compile GCC on it?" (all of these are hyperboles, so treat them as such) don't exactly endear this platform to the masses.

And the masses, if they come... will ensure that commercial apps, or even support from those initial commercial apps (Skype, Gizmo, RTComm, Pidgin, et al) will continue and the better platform is not left behind.

I'm sure Nokia has this covered. But as far as it goes... seeing how the technically better product doesn't always mean a sure-win... I'm officially concerned. Very concerned.

And the majority of this site; forgive me... y'all are pretty damn niche for the most part. OpenMoko didn't survive due to its niche market. Zaurus (outside of Japan) had only a niche market... and it didn't survive. The aforementioned BeOS... while technically superior and it took some 10 years for some things to show up in other competing systems... it died too.

The 3GS release allowed the N900 to gain ground. I hope - no... I think that Nokia will take advantage of it. But as it stands, the marketing needs to be better than it ever was on the N810/N800. Which sounds simple - it's a phone now.

But it's not. A Linux based OS without any prior iterations of apps that were truly compelling to those outside of this community is a steep hill to climb.

Sorry for this long "rant", just came from the most interesting conversation with a bunch of commercial (read: non-technical) iPhone owners. I whipped out my N810... and confused the living hell out of them. It just... well, in their words "If that was also in a phone, I'd want it. But it'd take a bit of an investment to learn it fully..."

And that, my friends... is a concern of mine. The iPhone "just works"... sure it's locked down, Apple keeps it way too damn closed. But it "works". I don't have to add Application Catalogs for it. Not that I personally don't mind, but to see enthusiasm go to sheer terror in a few moments once they had to open up a terminal or installing something might include more than two steps.

I feel better with that out. Feel free to flame me. I just hope Nokia does well... and hopefully, they're listening.

I understand about your pessimism regarding apps. Let us see what apple had that made so many apps to be ported:

1. Easy to use interface
2. App store
3. Good Hardware
4. New OS and single form factor
5. Apple brand name

Now let us see nokia. Please dont compare earlier apps to maemo 5 because even though the platform is the same maemo 5 is for the masses.

1. From the user interface it looks like the UI is very easy to use. Of course the only problem is that unlike apple everything is so customizable that iphone users may be confused in the start... but i assume will get the hang of it if they can stay a little long.

2. Nokia already has app store. Nokia's policies will be way better than apple.

3. N900 has the best hardware.... there is no question about it.

4. Maemo 5 is a brand new OS for nokia unlike symbian which was just scaled for touch screens. And there are no variants like the symbian. This takes out a lot of varaibility within the applications in comparision to symbian apps. There are 100s of phone models using different symbian os with different packs and firmwares. The n900 atleast initially will be the only one and we know meamo will be on touch screens only. So less confusion and more usability

5. Apple's brand name is a bid advantage especially among the fan boys. Nokia cannot compete with apple with brand name atleast in the US.

Let us see what will happen..... time will tell.

I personally think you're overlooking the SDK and the ease of developing for that platform.

I'm not pessimistic, I'm rather hopeful yet concerned.

And besides, in the realm of phones, who's bigger than Nokia?

The best hardware does not always win.

That's true. But is N900 really supposed to compete with iPhone?
It's like comparing Windows and Linux and saying can Linux win.

iPhone is for the masses. N900 can be but it's not.
Nokia makes like 50 different models. Apple = just one.

I think this N900 should be more compared to HTC / Sony Xperia.

When I got the N95 8GB, it was great. Very customizable, very "computer" like.
Tons and tons of 3rd party apps available and did nearly everything I wanted.
But it wasn't something I would get for my wife or my mum etc.
I'll tell them to get an iPhone coz it's nicer and MUCH simpler.

But with this N900, it's a bit different.
Seems it's much 'nicer'. Nearly iPhone-like easy also.
Maybe finally, Nokia made something which apeal to both.

Eh, I was looking at that when considering the iPhone (though the AT&T's huge plan costs is a big negative.. it's 70 a month!). But backgrounder is very instable and crash prone it seems.

Said gerbick:
"Palm Pre doesn't support OBEX."

Of all the devices out, you mention the newest one with the newest OS? How long before you think Palm supports it? Three years?? Besides the Pre, what phone, smart or feature, over $275, doesn't have OBEX push?

Gerbick said in response to my assessment of Google Maps' lack of offline data:
"I've yet to be out of my cell network - and I've traveled 49 out of 50 US states. Mind you, when I'm out of area, I tend to know where I'm going anyway."

Ok, but a navigator is mainly for when you get lost. And what do you tell the Indian farmer is the remote village where there is no data service? He had a Tom Tom for navigation, but wants a smartphone. Should he get an iPhone or a Symbian/Maemo one with offline map data? If you rarely travel outside of civilized or networked areas, do you even need mapping software?

You make many excuses for Apple, but were you stuck in New Orleans during Hurricane Katrina, with no cellular service for miles, you'd see the superiority of the more flexible platform. Like the guy on HGTV's "Real Estate Intervention" says,"I think you will make any excuse for your [device], but you have to admit, this [Nokia device] is better equipped and worth more than yours."


Gerbick said:
"Too bad Wayfinder isn't the same as Navteq because Wayfinder on the N810 basically sucked."

Wayfinder sucked period. Navteq isn't an app, by the way, but a map data company. They make the maps many companies use for maps and programs. It's owned by Nokia, and most companies pay them for that data to make their maps. If a map app has Navteq maps, they're usually the best, much better than Google's.


Gerbick said:
"On your platform of choice, you have Navteq and whatever Ovi will hopefully deliver. On the iPhone, it's there (Google Maps) by default and other options exist."

We all know that. You see an app that's free to download on every device that supports installing apps as a selling point? Ovi Maps vs. Google Maps is no contest! And much more options existed for Symbian, and will for Ovi as well. The fact is that Apple lags on navigation features. But the iPhans call it a computer??

I chose that one for a singular purpose. They didn't support it for a reason in the initial release. I won't even start to guess why they didn't... so you have two modern OS on popular phones that don't support something that's... well, wanted by you and not on those two mainstream phones.

Reason all you want, they had a reason for not including OBEX. Could possibly be the stupidest reason ever.

ahem. 49 states. I travel a lot. And some of these areas, are rather remote.

I still don't escape my cellphone coverage nor places where I just can't figure out where I'm going. I'm not your typical case.

I make no excuses for Apple. And I don't see jack crap that a "superior" open platform brings to the table either.

Apple sucks. I don't get where you'd think otherwise. Nokia didn't deliver on the 770, N800 nor N810 in these so-called "superior" areas in communication nor mapping. Not a damn thing.

Stop hyping what's not there. Once it gets there and is even better, I'll do you one better... I'll actually use it.

Seriously don't know where the hell you're getting your ideas from dude. I've not big-upped Apple at all. And don't get me started in on AT&T.

Better is opinion. Your opinion. I'm always looking for better, but with what I've seen, Nokia has yet to deliver. I'm waiting to see.

iPhone isn't a computer. It's a money grab. I said that a few posts back too.

Seriously, you got a chip on your shoulder while addressing me that doesn't even need to be there.

Later.