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bbin	2011-07-06 , 09:17
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 305 times \| Joined on Sep 2009 @ Espoo, Finland	#1531

Originally Posted by Rugoz

I think for nokia the n9 is not really about meego. Its what you can do with Qt on top of any OS. That is why I actually believe them when they say there will be software updates and new features, because it probably can all be done in Qt.

This is exactly how I see it. "Meego" core doesn't mean anything to Nokia anymore. It is all about Qt.

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	erendorn	2011-07-06 , 09:41
	Posts: 738 \| Thanked: 983 times \| Joined on Apr 2010 @ London	#1532

Originally Posted by bbin

This is exactly how I see it. "Meego" core doesn't mean anything to Nokia anymore. It is all about Qt.

But I still find it very nonsensical that Qt won't be ported to WP7.
It would bring transition between Symbian and WP (good for nokia and Microsoft), homogeneity as first planned in Nokia portfolio, would instill confidence in investors and developpers, and incidently would support MeeGo with the potential ports (good for us). Such a win-win situation, and still won't happen

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	OVK	2011-07-06 , 09:55
	Posts: 559 \| Thanked: 1,017 times \| Joined on May 2008 @ Finland	#1533

Originally Posted by erendorn

But I still find it very nonsensical that Qt won't be ported to WP7.
It would bring transition between Symbian and WP (good for nokia and Microsoft), homogeneity as first planned in Nokia portfolio, would instill confidence in investors and developpers, and incidently would support MeeGo with the potential ports (good for us). Such a win-win situation, and still won't happen .

Yes, I don't get it either.

Current Nokia strategy in a nutshell:

1. Reach for "The next billion" with dumbphones (S40 that will get Qt, maybe it will even get Swipe UI that is Qt based)
2. Smart Phones (WP7, no Qt here)
3. Future disruptions that feed material to Smart Phones (Qt is here)

For me it seems obvious that number 2. is missing something essential if Nokia wants that the people atracted by number 1 would later move to number 2. And number 3 can't feed anything (software wise, hardware is of course different matter) to number 2 because the technologies are incompatible.

I just don't get the rationale behind that. And that is why I am currently not a Nokia shareholder and also will not be before this starts to make any sense.

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Rugoz	2011-07-06 , 10:26
Posts: 457 \| Thanked: 600 times \| Joined on Jan 2010	#1534

I just don't get the rationale behind that.

They want to see their services on as many phones out there as possible. For google android itself does not really matter, its about their services on top of it.

Other handset manufacturers are reluctant to make meego phones, because nokia is behind. They rather use android or wp7.
So essentially nokia thinks with Meego the reach of their services will be limited, while with wp7 (and other microsoft products like tablets, bing maps) the number of users will be far bigger.

You must realize that the nokia board is obsessed with services, they neglected other things like dev. tools and UI for years and concentrated their resources on ovi crap. The only two products which survived the process were maps and music.

There is a rationale behind it, but I don't agree with their strategy at all. Do they want to survive on location based services?

Last edited by Rugoz; 2011-07-06 at 10:30.

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	Verythrax	2011-07-06 , 10:57
	Posts: 190 \| Thanked: 167 times \| Joined on Aug 2009 @ Brazil	#1535

Originally Posted by OVK

Yes, I don't get it either.

Current Nokia strategy in a nutshell:

1. Reach for "The next billion" with dumbphones (S40 that will get Qt, maybe it will even get Swipe UI that is Qt based)
2. Smart Phones (WP7, no Qt here)
3. Future disruptions that feed material to Smart Phones (Qt is here)

For me it seems obvious that number 2. is missing something essential if Nokia wants that the people atracted by number 1 would later move to number 2. And number 3 can't feed anything (software wise, hardware is of course different matter) to number 2 because the technologies are incompatible.

I just don't get the rationale behind that. And that is why I am currently not a Nokia shareholder and also will not be before this starts to make any sense.

Isn't the 1st item a repagination of that idea of bringing smartphones for the lower end?

Before, the strategy was to make S60 go down the spectrum and replace S40, while Maemo/MeeGo whould take the mid-high end.

Now, if I understood the "next billion" strategy correctly, they are canning S60 and making S40 more "smartphone"-like, with Qt, webapps, maps and multitasking..

Last edited by Verythrax; 2011-07-06 at 11:02.

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	OVK	2011-07-06 , 11:09
	Posts: 559 \| Thanked: 1,017 times \| Joined on May 2008 @ Finland	#1536

Originally Posted by Verythrax

Isn't the 1st item a repagination of that idea of bringing smartphones for the lower end?

Before, the strategy was to make S60 go down the spectrum and replace S40, while Maemo/MeeGo whould take the mid-high end.

Now, if I understood the "next billion" strategy correctly, they are canning S60 and making S40 more "smartphone"-like, with Qt, webapps, maps and multitasking..

Yeah. But I still don't see where the WP7 (without Qt) fits in the big picture.

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	Verythrax	2011-07-06 , 11:19
	Posts: 190 \| Thanked: 167 times \| Joined on Aug 2009 @ Brazil	#1537

Originally Posted by OVK

Yeah. But I still don't see where the WP7 (without Qt) fits in the big picture.

It's more a residual effect. Before, with Maemo/MeeGo in the bigger picture, Qt made more sense because it would promote easy porting between it and S40/60, providing a strong ecosystem. The Nokia's plan was to get rid of the dumbphoes, being the leading company is doing that, and creating their "vision" of connectivity in the future. But Symbian was behind the schedule, and you all know the rest of the story.

Now, with Elop, WP7 entered late to the picture, and Qt doesn't make much sense with it, cause the original Qt strategy didn't considered WP7 in first place. But Nokia will not abandon Qt yet cause it still plays a major role in the strategy (next billion, disruption, incubated MeeGo dev, S60 support to 2016), despite losing one of the may point of having it in the first place (compatibility).

I believe we will see something about Qt on WP7 in the future, if it doesn't sink first. maybe it's one of the "privileges" that Nokia got from MS?

Last edited by Verythrax; 2011-07-06 at 11:25.

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jalyst	2011-07-06 , 11:32
Moderator \| Posts: 5,320 \| Thanked: 4,464 times \| Joined on Oct 2009	#1538

Originally Posted by kanishou

While I of course can't tell you any internals, I will say that nothing fishy is going on and in all likelyhood the N9 will be out when it's ready.
Even if Elop would be a trojan or the devil in person, he would have to be quite stupid to try any foulplay, when quite a few disgruntled devs wouldn't hesitate to call him out on that. From what I can tell though, Nokia management wants the N9 to succeed like the rest of us (aside from Dave and danramos ).

I'll find it hard to believe that nothing fishy's going on if it's still not available anywhere in the world by the end-of-Sept.
But as you say, maybe by then some disgruntled devs will call him out, if it gets to that, or maybe they won't...

Originally Posted by shallimus

Just curious: what about WP7 makes you want to spend money on it? Follow-up: what makes a non-Nokia WP7 phone more attractive than a Nokia MeeGo phone (even if the N9 is delayed)?

1) I don't like to rule out any platform out until I've actually used it extensively.
2) Try re-reading my prior post

Originally Posted by danramos

Why do you respond to it? You're clearly taking me (and probably the N9) far too seriously. heh I came for InternetTabletTalk and ended up being told I should like the N9... why WOULDN'T I want the worst for it? By comparison, the N900 is an incredibly wonderful computer--and I didn't even like that move away from the N8x0 line as it is. Why do *I* check back? Hoping that something running Linux gets released that follows in the Maemo/MeeGo footsteps that I can like. So far, I remain unimpressed. Clearly, you're much easier to impress.

Sigh, I'm not telling you to like anything.
But the tone of your posts 99.99% of the time consist of:
Nokia's ****, the platform's ****, the software's ****, the hardware's ****, yadda yadda.
We get your point... We really do!

Why not wait till you have the device in your hands & can compare it directly to other highend's?
Or at least until others can do that thoroughly for us....

Most folks are subscribed to this thread so that they can the obtain the "last pieces" WRT hw/software/availability/pricing.
And then (so long as pricing's not crazy & delivery isn't horridly delayed) they're already sold & ready to start assessing it.

Nothing personal but you don't want to add anything to the thread, other than constantly trying to prove why "it's ****".
I personally just want to find out more about it... but it's a free world I guess!

Originally Posted by keflex

Basically, you're all stupid.

Argument won? LOL gold

Originally Posted by gerbick

I hate to nitpick, but that would mean purchasing:
microUSB adapter

flash drive

Samsung LCD (or any LCD that supports flash drives)

Instead of just having one HDMI cable that connects to most any TV or (new) monitor that supports HDMI.
I fail to see the convenience.

I personally don't want to use my smartphone as my primary media player.
Other (far better) devices for that purpose...
But it'd still be "nice" to output HD video, particularly since it's very commonplace amongst highend's now.

Originally Posted by mooglez

You seem quite stuck inside a box, unable to think of use cases for others.
Here's a use case from a business travelers PoV.
I carry a laptop around with me, with all the spare batteries, accessories and cables, it is a pretty heavy package.
if the N9 had an HDMI out, I could in most cases replace the laptop fully with the N9, and instead carry with me N9, mHDMI <> HDMI cable, foldable bluetooth keyboard & mouse.
This would save me up to 5KG of carry on luggage!
<SNIP>(

It hasn't yet been ruled-out unequivocally that MHL is implemented or do-able later via the 3.5" or mUSB.
If it's coming or is a possibility, then a HDMI converter cable would be included or attainable for 720p out.

Originally Posted by shady

dlna ... the same rationalization you had wrt the fmtx and bt you should apply here b.w hdmi and dlna.
its moot, its supported, you can still get hd a/v to your component system.

I personally don't see how DLNA's the panacea.
And yes while it's likely to be supported it's not clear whether there'll be a decent UI.
Which is important for the "masses", not just nerds like us.

Originally Posted by keflex

Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha no he doesn't, he has no idea Engadget even exists. Try again.

I don't quite agree there....
I've read/watched execs reference Engadget & similar sites quite a few times.
Can't recall where/when now, & CBF'd searching, but they do occasionally.
Point is, I think such sites often have a "big" impact on wider community 'perception'.
Of course we're mainly on the fringes...
We asses device on their overall merits, not based on what popular opinion dictates.
Or at least I'd like to think most of us here do O_o

Originally Posted by Dave999

This is most boring waiting thread i ever been in...boring.

LOL, agreed.

Originally Posted by Dave999

Yeah that looks like me. That is not my best statements. But if you think that is my top 4 it's ok . I will leave this page in about 135 thanks. I hope it don't takes to long.

Added my thanks to help you with your impending departure

Originally Posted by ysss

Will he be there for YEARS to make sure of that claim though?

Why does he have to be there for years to ensure the claim's carried out?

He's speaking on behalf of the company, not just saying something he'd like the company to do isn't he?
Of course companies change plans, so as always never an iron-clad guarantee, but better than nothing.

Originally Posted by Dave999

I have been here so long so I have heard all the chuck Norris jokes twice an still loves them. But I guess I can hear them one last time before I leave. Nokia is dead. Keyboard phones are dead, N9 is soon to be dead.
I have to create at least 24 goodbye threads before I go...
The n900 still going strong though

Originally Posted by Dave999

Anyone really ganna do that?
Ohh...I'm on fire...

Epic troll is EPIC

Originally Posted by ysss

<SNIP>The 'real' product universe runs on money. You can't just throw time, interest and effort like the codes on FOSSworld.

Well the opportunity was there to build towards many of the strengths you highlight there WRT the Apple ecos.
Alas it was never really pushed hard....
They never "really" got started with the N900, as it was apparently still a "learning device" & Symbian the golden child.
Still, there's always an option to start somewhere w/a small truly commercial ecosystem for QT/Meego, & build on top of that.
But that's mostly fallen by the wayside now anyway, so there's no point even bothering to argue for it

Originally Posted by gerbick

Ever tried DLNA when your phone is on one public accessible network and the device you need is on the locked down corporate one?
Yeah. Been there. Done that.
The idea that the lack of HDMI is a moot point only is so when/if you've accepted the fact that most other companies and other offerings, N8 inclusive, have it whereas the newer N9 does not.
Yet another bad decision, imho.

Have to agree, DLNA's not a replacement for 720p video-out.
Handy, but not a replacement.

Originally Posted by Dave999

This would be nice. Another meego device would be great. But for now, I'm running around on the dark side and showing my disappointment. A series of devices would have get nokia back on track...

Aha so your true colours come out!
You really do love maemo/meego

Originally Posted by Rugoz

I think for nokia the n9 is not really about meego. Its what you can do with Qt on top of any OS. That is why I actually believe them when they say there will be software updates and new features, because it probably can all be done in Qt.

Yeah I don't really agree with that.
Not while Microsoft is not allowing the use of QT on WP.

Originally Posted by erendorn

But I still find it very nonsensical that Qt won't be ported to WP7.
It would bring transition between Symbian and WP (good for nokia and Microsoft), homogeneity as first planned in Nokia portfolio, would instill confidence in investors and developpers, and incidently would support MeeGo with the potential ports (good for us). Such a win-win situation, and still won't happen .

^This, fair for both of them...

The leviathan is coming

http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/20...nufacturer.ars

Last edited by jalyst; 2011-07-06 at 15:53.

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	casper27	2011-07-06 , 11:36
	Posts: 844 \| Thanked: 521 times \| Joined on Jan 2009 @ UK southampton	#1539

Wow jalyst responded to every person in the entire thread at once, well done

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	Dave999	2011-07-06 , 12:11
	Posts: 7,075 \| Thanked: 9,073 times \| Joined on Oct 2009 @ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side	#1540

I just don't like nokia anymore. I have my days as a troll and other days when I'm in good mood and a contributer to this community. It's like Dr jekyll and Mr hyde...

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