iPhone and iPod Touch SDK is amazing... Wow. - Page 18 - maemo.org

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	tso	2008-03-13 , 00:30
	Posts: 4,783 \| Thanked: 1,253 times \| Joined on Aug 2007 @ norway	#171

Originally Posted by Benson

O Great Modem in the Sky, spare us the torment of n00bish legions who know naught, and yet strive to know less!

heh, september that never ended anyone?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_September

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	tso	2008-03-13 , 00:32
	Posts: 4,783 \| Thanked: 1,253 times \| Joined on Aug 2007 @ norway	#172

Originally Posted by HellToupee

Uhh hows that any different to this

http://maemo.org/downloads/OS2008/

you go there on n8*0 click the click to install button and OMG it installs no hassles, it was so hard. Difference is you do not have to get apps from there, you can go to other maemo apps sites, no lock in.

from what i understand, appstore will be a program, kinda like application manager, running on the phone. but probably with the spit polish that apple put on all their ui's...

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	brontide	2008-03-13 , 00:41
	Posts: 868 \| Thanked: 474 times \| Joined on Oct 2007 @ Capital District, NY, USA	#173

Originally Posted by HellToupee

Uhh hows that any different to this

http://maemo.org/downloads/OS2008/

It differs in at least 10 engineer years in R&D of the UI. While I may disagree with their business decisions I usually can not fault their choices and elegance in UI design.

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	Benson	2008-03-13 , 01:01
	Posts: 4,930 \| Thanked: 2,272 times \| Joined on Oct 2007	#174

Originally Posted by tso

but probably with the spit polish that apple put on all their ui's...

Yeah, don't tell anyone, but Karel Jansens is a secret Apple agent. He's been helping them with that ui work...

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sherifnix	2008-03-13 , 01:16
Posts: 344 \| Thanked: 26 times \| Joined on Jan 2007	#175

Originally Posted by brontide

It differs in at least 10 engineer years in R&D of the UI. While I may disagree with their business decisions I usually can not fault their choices and elegance in UI design.

Ah well. That idea seems to be lost on them.

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vvaz	2008-03-13 , 07:53
Posts: 356 \| Thanked: 231 times \| Joined on Oct 2007	#176

Originally Posted by sherifnix

Apple has 2% of the worldwide smartphone market and it has 50 times the web traffic than any other mobile. Google assumed it was an error and had their engineers recheck the data. Haha!

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/667f13de-da6...0779fd2ac.html

A few taps and you're in a catalog of 3rd party apps. No dependencies, repositories... or digging in your settings to find some setting to allow apps without certificates to install since nothing is really certified. S60 and Maemo are way behind Apple's delivery platform.

1. Looks like Apple begun its dance with numbers. "2% of smartphone market". Heh. Target in SJ iPhone keynote was 1% of global market of *all* phones in 2008 - 10mln of sold iPhones. Now look - as of January, after 6 months Apple sold 4mln. It makes expected 8mln without taking into consideration stagnating demand natural in all tech toys. You should add that approximately 25% of that is jailbreaked and don't enter phone market. That means only 6mln *phones* sold, the rest are PDAs. 60% of target. Oops.

2. If you read article without bias you would read also that main reason of internet usage among users was smart packaging and (my guess) relative cheapness of data plan comparing to price of iPhone. Also Apple forced AT&T and other carriers to abandon their own "portals". Don't know how it looks in USA but in Poland users are forced to use telecom portals with categories and all links prepared for users as start pages of Internet. Users *don't need* to use Google to find their content. Even searching is done through that portals so no hits for Google.

My acquitances are buying smartphones for: GPS, PIM, digital camera and video, MMS, Internet is on very distant place. Oh, and big screen is great for viewing photos.

3. There will be repository for iPhones. It will have just different name. And lack of dependencies isn't particularly good. Lack of dependencies means static libraries. Static libraries mean bigger hard disk and RAM usage. I suppose this is behind ridiculous Apple constraints on apps, not some fancy HIG.

This is the only point where I can partially agree with you. Nokia/Maemo desperately needs Maemo Linux distribution with proper hardware infrastructure and manpower behind it.

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	sachin007	2008-03-13 , 08:34
	Posts: 2,041 \| Thanked: 1,066 times \| Joined on Mar 2006 @ Houston	#177

Originally Posted by sherifnix

There is no doubt Nokia sells a crap ton of S60 devices Whats funny is that people aren't using the features on them. I know a few girls with N75's here in the US and they have NO idea what the hell S60 is or that they can install apps. To them its just a camera phone and they paid extra for the bigger screen. Its poorly marketed and very confusing for them. These girls all loaded the browser once or twice and just gave up because it was a pain in the *** to use. They pick my iPhone up and they are on Facebook in 5 seconds.

Apple has 2% of the worldwide smartphone market and it has 50 times the web traffic than any other mobile. Google assumed it was an error and had their engineers recheck the data. Haha!

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/667f13de-da6...0779fd2ac.html

Goes to show you that software design is everything. Apple's opportunity here is that they can sell services that people want. Having an AppStore and iTunes Store right there without any configuration is so great. This simply isn't there on any Nokia device S60 or Maemo.

A few taps and you're in a catalog of 3rd party apps. No dependencies, repositories... or digging in your settings to find some setting to allow apps without certificates to install since nothing is really certified. S60 and Maemo are way behind Apple's delivery platform.

Exactly. Apple iphone and touch are for noobs who dont have the time or interest to do more than what apple wants them to do. Theya are the ones who would log on to facebook, myspace etc but the internet tablet is for geeks. when properly used it is almost a complete laptop replacement and we geeks like trying out new things just like the general public likes to chat on facebook.

But the problem here is that internettablettalk is a geek website and not for apple style noobs. So how would you expect someone to support apple in our forum? The inverse would happen if i posted about the internet tablet in the iphone trendy forums. Its high time you understood this!!

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	Karel Jansens	2008-03-13 , 12:13
	Posts: 3,220 \| Thanked: 326 times \| Joined on Oct 2005 @ "Almost there!" (Monte Christo, Count of)	#178

Originally Posted by Benson

Yeah, don't tell anyone, but Karel Jansens is a secret Apple agent. He's been helping them with that ui work...

__________________
Watch out Nokia, Pandora's box has opened (sorta)...
I do love explaining cryptic sigs, but for the impatient: http://www.openpandora.org/

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sherifnix	2008-03-13 , 13:43
Posts: 344 \| Thanked: 26 times \| Joined on Jan 2007	#179

Originally Posted by vvaz

1. Looks like Apple begun its dance with numbers. "2% of smartphone market". Heh. Target in SJ iPhone keynote was 1% of global market of *all* phones in 2008 - 10mln of sold iPhones. Now look - as of January, after 6 months Apple sold 4mln. It makes expected 8mln without taking into consideration stagnating demand natural in all tech toys. You should add that approximately 25% of that is jailbreaked and don't enter phone market. That means only 6mln *phones* sold, the rest are PDAs. 60% of target. Oops.

2. If you read article without bias you would read also that main reason of internet usage among users was smart packaging and (my guess) relative cheapness of data plan comparing to price of iPhone. Also Apple forced AT&T and other carriers to abandon their own "portals". Don't know how it looks in USA but in Poland users are forced to use telecom portals with categories and all links prepared for users as start pages of Internet. Users *don't need* to use Google to find their content. Even searching is done through that portals so no hits for Google.

My acquitances are buying smartphones for: GPS, PIM, digital camera and video, MMS, Internet is on very distant place. Oh, and big screen is great for viewing photos.

3. There will be repository for iPhones. It will have just different name. And lack of dependencies isn't particularly good. Lack of dependencies means static libraries. Static libraries mean bigger hard disk and RAM usage. I suppose this is behind ridiculous Apple constraints on apps, not some fancy HIG.

This is the only point where I can partially agree with you. Nokia/Maemo desperately needs Maemo Linux distribution with proper hardware infrastructure and manpower behind it.

Apple's goal was to sell 10 million by the end of 2008 right? They are still on track. What's your point? In the US its something like 28% of the smartphone market. Its definitely a different market here, where Nokia is in the single percent range. Its very likely they will hit 100% of that goal, and if a 3G iPhone hits this year it will probably break right past 100% in the holiday season.

Internet usage... Regardless of the forced portals everyone else has to use, all phone browsers suck, including the S60 one. They are NOT convenient to use, navigation is barely adequate. That is what I was getting at. Having WebKit as the engine alone doesn't make it any good. All the "geeks" throw out is, "S60 uses the same engine as Safari!" but it doesn't change the fact that its no fun to use a joystick and number pad to browse.

This same issue extends into pretty much every aspect of the user interfaces on phones (and N8x0). Poor design and input. The iPhone isn't perfect, but its the first one out there that is actually respectable. You'll notice over the next few years that everything will become similar to it. Flicking, Dragging, Inertia, Finger Input. They have it right.