Let's talk Nokia stock! - Page 201 - maemo.org

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specc	2012-07-22 , 03:50
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#2001

Originally Posted by cheve

you have missed the point. at least for where i live, big national chains all offer 'deal' like that - ie. you pay some $$ up front and then tie to some 2 or 3 yr contract. it may sound a rip off to you, but these are the options the average joe/jane can have. the point i am making is this: for these national chains to offer the Lumia 900 with such terms within such a short time after official release of Lumia 900, it really means that this phone is not selling well at all - bad news for Nokia.

Here are other reference points(all with 3yr contract term) for you - SGS3 ( $129), SGS2 ( $0), iphone 4 ($99, 32GB, this is not 4s), the iphone 4s($160 for 16GB; $270 for 32GB), blackberry bold ($75). As a re-cap, nokia Lumia 900 ( $0, plus $100 gift card). These asking prices reflect the highest $$$ that the average public are willing to pay. it does not look good for Lumia 900, specifically, at about 1 month ago, they were asking for $50 or so.

Fair enough. But that is not a free market. A three year contract is way too long. Only the phones with a track record can hope to compete on such terms. Or more correct, the phone with a track record (top Galaxy, iPhones etc) will have huge advantages. Even a one year contract is dubious regarding the principles of free competition.

Nevertheless, the Lumia 900 seems to be DOA also here. The Lumia 800 and 610 are selling well though. They are cheaper off contract and are also offered with cheaper contracts.

SamGan	2012-07-22 , 04:30
Posts: 648 \| Thanked: 650 times \| Joined on Oct 2011	#2002

Originally Posted by specc

Now, if WP8 also include some more functionality, both HW and software, more of what I'm used to with Symbian/Maemo/Android, then there is no objective reason to not accept it as a good state of the art OS. Not for anyone.

It will take more than a few more functionality to make WP8 competitive with Android and ios. Right now it is still playing catch-up unless MS has something spectacular in store which it hasn't announced yet.

Originally Posted by specc

The only reasons for not liking it will be of the philosophical and/or emotional kind.

A very blanket statement with no supporting basis. It's hard to discuss logically with someone who is so emotionally attached to his pre-conceived notions that nothing else can penetrate.

Originally Posted by specc

But, as with the Amiga, you never now. I would be very surprised though if 1. WP8 does not gain a decent market share. 2 Nokia does not again become a profitable company.

I would be very surprised if it can gain more than single digit market share in its first year and it won't be enough to keep Nokia alive.

Last edited by SamGan; 2012-07-22 at 04:33.

mikecomputing	2012-07-22 , 07:32
Posts: 3,464 \| Thanked: 5,107 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Gothenburg in Sweden	#2003

What if nokia actually release an highend wp8 phone with camera like 808. Wouldn't that itself be a success?

however i will personally not buy it.

gerbick	2012-07-22 , 08:18
Guest \| Posts: n/a \| Thanked: 0 times \| Joined on	#2004

Originally Posted by mikecomputing

What if nokia actually release an highend wp8 phone with camera like 808. Wouldn't that itself be a success?

Nope. It wouldn't.

mikecomputing	2012-07-22 , 08:55
Posts: 3,464 \| Thanked: 5,107 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Gothenburg in Sweden	#2005

Originally Posted by gerbick

Nope. It wouldn't.

Why not? I mean alot of people want a decent camera in theyr pocket that can replace normal cameras? And right now there only is one and thats 808 but problem with 808 is nokia doesnt marketing it and people wait for wp version of it?

Or does samsung have gooxd camera mobiles similar to 808?

specc	2012-07-22 , 09:53
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#2006

Originally Posted by SamGan

It will take more than a few more functionality to make WP8 competitive with Android and ios. Right now it is still playing catch-up unless MS has something spectacular in store which it hasn't announced yet.

The UI/UX is already way beyond with it's integrations and general use and feel.

A very blanket statement with no supporting basis. It's hard to discuss logically with someone who is so emotionally attached to his pre-conceived notions that nothing else can penetrate.

Nonsense. If you are going to comment, then comment what I am writing, not something else.

I would be very surprised if it can gain more than single digit market share in its first year and it won't be enough to keep Nokia alive.

WP8 is not what keep Nokia alive, it only keep Nokia smartphones alive. S40 and S30 is what keeps Nokia alive. WP8 phones are necessary to compete with iOS and Android though, and the ecosystem.

specc	2012-07-22 , 09:55
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#2007

Originally Posted by gerbick

Nope. It wouldn't.

LOL

THIS statement I will present to you 6-12 months from now

Cue	2012-07-22 , 10:19
Posts: 840 \| Thanked: 823 times \| Joined on Nov 2009	#2008

Originally Posted by mikecomputing

Why not? I mean alot of people want a decent camera in theyr pocket that can replace normal cameras? And right now there only is one and thats 808 but problem with 808 is nokia doesnt marketing it and people wait for wp version of it?

Or does samsung have gooxd camera mobiles similar to 808?

Actually, a lot of people won't care as long as the pictures are "good enough". The N8 and 808 didn't sell well even though they had the best cameras. It's a niche and a very small one at that, much like an FM transmitter/receiver. Those who care about photography will not throw away their lenses and DSLR, those who don't are happy with their current phone camera. It is a selling point but I doubt it's as influential as you think, especially if it adds bulk to the phone.

specc	2012-07-22 , 10:47
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#2009

Originally Posted by Cue

Actually, a lot of people won't care as long as the pictures are "good enough". The N8 and 808 didn't sell well even though they had the best cameras. It's a niche and a very small one at that, much like an FM transmitter/receiver. Those who care about photography will not throw away their lenses and DSLR, those who don't are happy with their current phone camera. It is a selling point but I doubt it's as influential as you think, especially if it adds bulk to the phone.

What are you talking about. The N8 is still selling well, two years after launch. It sold about 4M a quarter for at least a year, much less now though, but it's a classic and still on the shelves.

The 808 haven't really reached the shelves yet. But this phone IS Osborned. Everyone but the die hards (camera/Symbian) are waiting on a Lumia PureView.

Cue	2012-07-22 , 11:21
Posts: 840 \| Thanked: 823 times \| Joined on Nov 2009	#2010

Originally Posted by specc

What are you talking about. The N8 is still selling well, two years after launch. It sold about 4M a quarter for at least a year, much less now though, but it's a classic and still on the shelves.

The 808 haven't really reached the shelves yet. But this phone IS Osborned. Everyone but the die hards (camera/Symbian) are waiting on a Lumia PureView.

If it were selling well then why the need to change strategy? What is wrong with you people, one day you are saying they were struggling to sell phones the next they were hot sellers. It clearly wasn't selling enough in their eyes for them to have pushed for a strategy change. The N8 was their flagship high-end mass marketed device and was available long before the Elop announcement so that particular phone wasn't Osborned, and when it was much later on what was the reason for doing so if they believed it sold well?
The decline in handset sales were there and it still is today. It may be a "classic" among the Nokia fans but that's all it is, much like the N900.

Sticking a good camera on a WP (which is no more desirable and doing no better than the symbians of past or present) and expecting it to sell on that fact alone is in my opinion being far too optimistic. The same misplaced optimism that was shown after the announcement, sticking WP on a Nokia and expecting sales to skyrocket or even increase.

Expecting a Lumia Pureview to turn things around has little research behind it and is very much an individual wanting a particular thing and that individual expecting the mass market to react in kind. Cost cutting is a different matter.

Last edited by Cue; 2012-07-22 at 12:09.