Say, for business reasons, Nokia doesn't give us flash 10.1. Can the maemo community be given the porting kit?

Slow & resource hogging? HTML/JS combo is even more, in any given browser at that. is a direct comparison on a mobile platform, and on desktops its even more drastic but people hardly notice given the amount of CPU power computers of today have. AVM2 beats any JSVM out there every single time in both performance/watt ratio and speed of execution. By the account of slow & resource hogging we could banish all web browsers and return to the good old days of BBS & ANSI graphics.

Vector point for exploits? To this day, there was only one exploit that could potentially be exploited in a real world scenario, and it was patched less than a week after its discovery (so much of slow attention to plugging exploits/bugs, btw.). It was discovered on a minor version that was not directly distributed and there were only a several thousand downloads of that version before the fix. So far there has been no reports of anyone successfully gaining a control over a potential victims' computer via the Flash Player. All the browsers, including Mozilla published ones (and Mozilla claims to have security as their paramount concern), and don't even get me started on IE and Safari, have a far worse track record in that department.

Closed-source? HERE is what is closed-source about Flash and what isn't. Bottom line - Flash is an open platform and for the most part open-source technology, but Adobe is still in a position to control it. Even if you are a FOSS purist, there is a good chance that you are using at least some completely closed-source software like graphic drivers, and I don't see much moaning about that. When did the paradigm shift occurred from `we prefer free and open-source, but closed-source and commercial is fine if it works properly` to `death to every single commercial piece of software`? Or is it only applicable when it comes to Adobe? Why not bash Nokia and Maemo for that reason - Maemo platform is closed-source in more aspects than it is the Flash platform after all. Or let us shun Autodesk for not providing sources for any aspect of their software on Linux, yeah, that will teach them... to steer away from Linux for good.

I really hate to came out as an Adobe/Flash apologist, I honestly am not, but the amount of FUD being spread about the Flash platform, especially after Cupertino announced `no Flash on our iAmMagicalDevices`, is so staggering that somebody has to be `that guy` to level the field. At this point it really isn't about the platform itself, and especially not about Adobe (I couldn't care less if any company would go bankrupt as soon as tomorrow), it's about the right of choice that I don't want to be taken away because of some false accusations against a technology most people bash while not knowing a single thing about it. Because if we do that today for Adobe Flash, we could do that tomorrow for Java, or for Unity3D, or even JavaScript and CSS... I don't like Microsoft Silverlight at all, mainly because they really don't care about any platform other than their own, but I will defend their right to exist on the web as much as I will for Adobes', because HTML/JS just isn't good enough, and probably never will be. Restricting the technology only stifles the creativity, and I don't want to be a part of that movement - there is another company that's already leading at that 'philosophy' and they have far better marketers and PRs to push their agenda, thus a good amount of followers accordingly - I'd rather be on the other side of this `debate`.

Anyway, the last paragraph of my last post is where I stand... And I challenge anyone to come up with some real arguments against that (yes, there are some), and when I say real I mean fact and reality based, not FUD based.

That's all I have to say about that.

Just a side note -

The TBS website that Adobe used to demonstrate "Flash 10.1" on the N900 back in October runs just fine with the Micro b as is.

Funny...

I do; quite often in fact. Especially with regards to NVIDIA and their closed drivers. People complain all the time about making that open.

AMD gets more praise; as they have been directly contributing to the open source radeon drivers and they opened the 3D specs of the older designs so that open source drivers could be built. They are still closed for the latest drivers (due to third party NDA stuff); but IIRC their intention was to catch up the OSS drivers to their proprietary ones and fade out the proprietary altogether.

So; methinks you just don't hang around the right circles.

Well, it is true that I am not a FOSS purist, otherwise I wouldn't be using Maemo in the first place, but the amount of bit.ching and moaning about Flash being closed-source (where it actually isn't for the most part, and what matters more, it's open in the crucial areas (format, compiler and virtual machine)) dwarfs the one that you can hear about proprietary drivers, codecs and libraries. At least at the places of interwebs that I hold dear to me - I try to stay away from any purist, fundamentalist, zealot, fanboi and such communities as those are, IMHO, some real-deal wackos. The only opinion I want to hear from those is the one they are giving to their parole officer or appointed psychiatrist when trying to get out of a nut-house for a weekend.

Yes, in a perfect world, everything would be FOSS, but a perfect world does not exist, nor will it ever, and I don't know about you, but I'm not ready to throw away 90 of the tech out there just because some company might have a say in it. Especially not when some other company is actually running a FUD crusade against that company.

True, the perfect world isn't here - and that's why I use Maemo. I know it's not perfect; but it's the best alternative out there.. and most open compared to competitors. This is also why I'm more interested in seeing MeeGo 1.0 with a UI (hopefully this month) more than I care to see PR1.2.

I personally hate Flash because it's slow, bogs down my browser, and I think it's totally unnecessary to design an entire website in it.

I dunno about benchmarks; but I can tell you every time I load a straight static HTML page vs an all-flash interactive page: the HTML will be done first. Especially on slower connections.

I also don't like that there isn't really any proper "free" replacements for Flash. I hate monopolies; and Adobe basically has the monopoly on browser-based games and videos thanks to Hulu and Youtube and such using entirely Flash.

So, while I personally hate flash, and on both my desktop and now my N900 I have the flashblock stuff on there - I am not against, and in fact will be quite annoyed if Flash 10.1 doesn't come to the N900. Especially when it was already demo'd on it; and that Hulu does not work currently because it has moved to 10.1. This illustrates a reason why I hate there is no alternative to it.

The option should be there. Same logic I apply to Cedega/CXOffice/Wine. I support all those projects even though people scream we just "help" companies not develop for linux. They may be right; but I see no reason I should have to suffer and not be able to do what I want/need to do just because companies didn't develop for linux. So, I'm not a purist or zealot by any means, but I do have my ideals. Where possible; I'll avoid using proprietary SW, and will always advocate a more open approach to SW development.

Safari Mobile isn't crippled because lack of Flash, it's crippled by lack of plugin support.

Plugin support has been a staple in PC browsing for 14 years. All mobile browsers should support NPAPI or ActiveX just like their desktop counterparts. That way, people would have the option to choose whether they want to use Flash or any other plugin for that matter.

The OBJECT tag was pretty much invented for plugins and the W3C even mentions plugins as a use for that tag. HTML5 will still have the OBJECT tag whenever it becomes standardized. There's no deprecation movement going on in regards to that.

I do think Mozilla and companies that make other browsers should add support to filter plugins to domain whitelists, and also add the option for "Click to load" instead of just having all plugins auto-load. Both could even help with security...

Not "might" it will for sure!

And many people saying is only about Video. No! Not only.
Even vector content will be tessellate and powered by GPU as well.

and here is another one answer to the Job's lies

http://www.adobe.com/choice/flash.html

Can anyone make a tl;dr version of this thread

Actually is there a 1% chance for N900 to get flash 10.1? Do we have a reason to doubt what Qole said?

Here is why Flash Player engineers have problem with flash on Safari

http://blog.kaourantin.net/?p=81

And in this case, yes is not the best coded browser on the world.
I am only wondering what issues we can have regarding to this article when mainly using webKit here? Which is core of Safari isn't it? Is any alternative available?