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The N900 is now 15 years old! (8)
to Nokia N900 by whayong - 15 hrs, 2 mins ago -
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| The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to titan For This Useful Post: | ||
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2010-06-03
, 19:55
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Posts: 168 |
Thanked: 206 times |
Joined on Apr 2010
@ Finland
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#4352
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Originally Posted by abill_uk
If you are interested to know does the OC & kernel-config impact to power consumption (current drawn from battery), you can do very simple measurements by yourself.
From what i can read of this and from own experiance the "voltage" referred to is actually dropped to change the clock frequency not the actual working voltage of the cpu, having said this i would need to see the data sheet for the ARM device used in the N900 to be able to fully understand why someone said overclocking is "lowering" the voltage.
Voltage is not the reason you get heat on any electronic component it is actually the current being drawn that creates heat.
Please understand ohms law for this.
Battery voltage and current can be read easily, but use steady use conditions (i.e offline) and lock & load CPU. Then calculate power at different frequencies and loading conditions and compare to stock kernel.
I share your concern about lifetime of N900 when OC, but your modification to increase heat dissipation sound bit dangerous.
Most probably you'll get data corruption problems much earlier than actual CPU damage, as Titan said earlier. Junction temperature inside IC can be quite high and if you start to get close to that temperature then you'll feel it, as device will feel hot. Then you should really consider lower freqs or short pause to allow device to recover to normal temp.
ARM core power supply capacitors are designed to work at 600MHz reliable. Most probably device will work reliably also at higher frequencies, some evidence available as we have quite many running with OC N900. Faster the ARM run, faster the de-coupling caps must feed current to processor (= paracitic inductances and resitances must be smaller). This is one limiting factor for OC and reliable system. In practise it means that core voltage will have more high frequency ripple and voltage dips. If voltage will go too low it will cause resets or other unwanted issues for HW&SW.
PS. Let us be polite to each other. This is a great forum and I have gained a lot. Thank you all!
Last edited by Gusse; 2010-06-03 at 20:55. Reason: Just editing
| The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Gusse For This Useful Post: | ||
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2010-06-03
, 21:12
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Posts: 202 |
Thanked: 30 times |
Joined on Mar 2010
@ CZE
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#4353
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OT: This place is becoming a real mess, lol! Imagine, I used to be badgered by ppl saying OC N900 isnt possible or that its gonna cause serious damage to the device - and now, its even worse ...
__________________
"I'm a Nokia fan. Ericsson ruled, Sony Ericsson SUX!!!"
Titans kernel up-and-running, N900 PR1.2 @ XLV 250-900 (Overclocking Guide)
"I'm a Nokia fan. Ericsson ruled, Sony Ericsson SUX!!!"
Titans kernel up-and-running, N900 PR1.2 @ XLV 250-900 (Overclocking Guide)
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2010-06-03
, 21:41
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Posts: 86 |
Thanked: 10 times |
Joined on Nov 2009
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#4354
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I think we are all responsible for our own acts as soon as we enter the world of moding. visible disclaimers are enough to keep wise but novice ppl from attempting. but if ur a fool and novice both......have fun.
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2010-06-03
, 21:42
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Banned |
Posts: 3,412 |
Thanked: 1,043 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#4355
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I have really been wanting to overclock my 900 and the only thing that holds me back is the heat element but i am sure it can be done in a safe way with precautions.
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2010-06-03
, 21:47
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Posts: 1,729 |
Thanked: 388 times |
Joined on Jan 2010
@ Canada
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#4356
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Originally Posted by abill_uk
heat is normal (if you read more pages back and other threads, you will find this is true). even at stock, using the phone continuously for 30-60mins will cause heat on the device, and one of the main reasons is the n900 is battery operated.
I have really been wanting to overclock my 900 and the only thing that holds me back is the heat element but i am sure it can be done in a safe way with precautions.
so that is why this information is provided on the wiki to monitor your overclocking and the device's conditions,
i have been overclocking up to 1.15GHz since last month, i have 3 batteries and none of them overheats or explode.
__________________
if i did help you, just click "Thanks" on the lower right of my post. thanks!
"The best way to break a Spell is to prevent it from being cast in the first place"
N900: 1000/1150mhz; sampling_rate 15; up_threshold 150000;
if i did help you, just click "Thanks" on the lower right of my post. thanks!
"The best way to break a Spell is to prevent it from being cast in the first place"
N900: 1000/1150mhz; sampling_rate 15; up_threshold 150000;
| The Following User Says Thank You to gabby131 For This Useful Post: | ||
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2010-06-03
, 21:51
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Banned |
Posts: 3,412 |
Thanked: 1,043 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#4357
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Originally Posted by Gusse
I cannot agree with you more apart from one point and that is the caps issue because we are not talking about a nominal 600mhz as we would want to stay at a faster speed once the experiance has hit home and my real concern is for the m/b becoming brittle with time but that is a non modded situation.
If you are interested to know does the OC & kernel-config impact to power consumption (current drawn from battery), you can do very simple measurements by yourself.
Battery voltage and current can be read easily, but use steady use conditions (i.e offline) and lock & load CPU. Then calculate power at different frequencies and loading conditions and compare to stock kernel.
I share your concern about lifetime of N900 when OC, but your modification to increase heat dissipation sound bit dangerous.
Most probably you'll get data corruption problems much earlier than actual CPU damage, as Titan said earlier. Junction temperature inside IC can be quite high and if you start to get close to that temperature then you'll feel it, as device will feel hot. Then you should really consider lower freqs or short pause to allow device to recover to normal temp.
ARM core power supply capacitors are designed to work at 600MHz reliable. Most probably device will work reliably also at higher frequencies, some evidence available as we have quite many running with OC N900. Faster the ARM run, faster the de-coupling caps must feed current to processor (= paracitic inductances and resitances must be smaller). This is one limiting factor for OC and reliable system. In practise it means that core voltage will have more high frequency ripple and voltage dips. If voltage will go too low it will cause resets or other unwanted issues for HW&SW.
PS. Let us be polite to each other. This is a great forum and I have gained a lot. Thank you all!
I love the idea of OC i just wanted to try and make it safer, after all we are indeed screwing up the warranty for what it is worth so hell we might as well make a few improvements to gain the speed without killing the m/b.
I only said what i did because i have been inside this unit many times now and seen what heat does to it and that is without the OC situation.
Anyhow a bigger issue without mod is indeed the usb port but all anyone has to do is scrape away the paint and solder the damm port to the board properly instead of it being put on a tiny bit of copper around the port itself.
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2010-06-03
, 22:02
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Posts: 1,729 |
Thanked: 388 times |
Joined on Jan 2010
@ Canada
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#4358
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Originally Posted by Gusse
awesome! i agree with you on this, i always do that.
Most probably you'll get data corruption problems much earlier than actual CPU damage, as Titan said earlier. Junction temperature inside IC can be quite high and if you start to get close to that temperature then you'll feel it, as device will feel hot. Then you should really consider lower freqs or short pause to allow device to recover to normal temp.
when i feel my n900 is OC'd @ 1GHz for such a time, i revert it to DEFAULT oar ULV settings to rest for a while.
__________________
if i did help you, just click "Thanks" on the lower right of my post. thanks!
"The best way to break a Spell is to prevent it from being cast in the first place"
N900: 1000/1150mhz; sampling_rate 15; up_threshold 150000;
if i did help you, just click "Thanks" on the lower right of my post. thanks!
"The best way to break a Spell is to prevent it from being cast in the first place"
N900: 1000/1150mhz; sampling_rate 15; up_threshold 150000;
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2010-06-03
, 22:11
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Banned |
Posts: 3,412 |
Thanked: 1,043 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
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#4359
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Originally Posted by titan
One thing in life i have learned is to respect people and if you give people a chance then even you can learn as we never stop to learn in life.
please find another thread or better another forum for trolling.
the S/N ratio is already quite low here.
If you don't know how to show the necessary respect for other people you should practise some social interaction in the real world before you come back.
Assuming we're just a bunch of clueless kids playing with fire and waiting for the self-proclaimed superguru of electronics to arrive is just plain arrogant and therefore stupid.
It may well be your thread but if your not prepared to at least look at someone's points then what can i say?.
As Gusse said please be polite as it does go a long way.
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2010-06-03
, 22:34
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Posts: 670 |
Thanked: 747 times |
Joined on Aug 2009
@ Kansas City, Missouri, USA
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#4360
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Originally Posted by abill_uk
I hear ya - can't afford to risk mine, too dependent on it for too many things. So no blastin' away at 1.1G + for me. Just use settings on the conservative side and load Titan's 'power37' kernel and you won't have any problems. It's really a very low risk mod - if used conservatively.
I have really been wanting to overclock my 900 and the only thing that holds me back is the heat element but i am sure it can be done in a safe way with precautions.
I just wanted to smooth out scrolling, transitions, etc. a bit. So I just use 250 + 750 and it made a nice if subtle improvement. No change in heat I can detect.
Same with power settings. Tried 'ideal' for a while but the radios seemed kinda unstable (but that coulda been my imagination too). So I use the more conservative 'lv' and the phone is as stable as Twinkies still in the wrapper.
Of course, with higher risk comes higher reward...so before you bump up to 1G ya gotta ask yourself...do you feel lucky?
__________________
Registered Linux user #266531.
Registered Linux user #266531.
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the S/N ratio is already quite low here.
If you don't know how to show the necessary respect for other people you should practise some social interaction in the real world before you come back.
Assuming we're just a bunch of clueless kids playing with fire and waiting for the self-proclaimed superguru of electronics to arrive is just plain arrogant and therefore stupid.