You sorta went wide left with your description and landed from handsets - which... I agree is an odd beast to pin down in the US - to carrier issues - the fact that users pay for incoming calls isn't what Nokia has to deal with.

So... with Nokia now at about 8.1%, perhaps the US is the second lost market, the first being Japan.

And agreed. The USA market is noisy. Perhaps Nokia just should give up on it 100% and go all online orders only.

Nokia has many issues in the USA:

- Handsets: Nokia handsets are now what US geeks/bloggers like; and hence, what the public knows about. I suspect some Not Invented Here syndrome as well. And we already know how hard has been for Nokia to adapt. Very, very roughly, phones like the iPhone have taught the user to prefer form over function. In countries like mine, people want the more function they can afford for their money.

- Carriers: If they don't perceive value; they aren't going to subsidize the handset. Or worse, they are going to lock and cripple it (E-71x).

- Carrier practices: For more reference, http://communities-dominate.blogs.co...-camera-3.html

Most of the practices detailed there where left behind in Latin America around 1996 at most; except locking handsets; however, you can pay extra to get them unlocked when you buy the handset.

- Carrier technology: How much can Nokia leverage with carriers depending on what they buy. On Wednesday I was visiting one of our carriers and I was shown the softswitch controlling the phones of our entire capital. It was a revealing experience to say the least.

- Marketing: speaks for itself. In countries like mine, the name "Nokia" commands respect in itself and most of the promotion is done by the carriers anyway. However, Nokia is always behind big events, like concerts or sport matches.

It is a steep road up. And I don't think the climb is profitable. But the noise is starting to become, well, noisier.

I agree as well,
they need to understand and know facts before they debate multi bilion dollar corporations products with their little to no knowledge narrow points,
Nokia invested over 40 billion in research for their phones in the this decade,a fact.......

Their seems to be this blind fanatism of ''iphone'' It captures the avreage people's intrest at first but in a way I think people are too blind to see what is put on the table in the long run
I really don't care what the majority believes anymore

ll add my 2 cents.

Asia

Nokia is huge. everytime i travel to pakistan im drowning in nokia marketting and ad's. owning a nokia is a status statement. almost like owning a mercedes. saying you own a HTC hero or Samsung gets you no where.
this is convincing evidence that nokia knows where their money market is. Asia is still getting used to 2G/3G and touch screen means nothing. people live and use devices for functions not for showing off a new app daily. as an example phones with flash lights are a big hit.

i went bowling with friends and nokias comes with music ad's were plastered all over the floors. and during a trip to a village in the middle of no where i saw a nokia phone being charged between farm animals and a tractor.

that is not to say nokia only has a low market presence. go to lahore and ul see n900 displayed along with every n series device. iphone is non existent. they are available but there is no demand. of course there are good reasons why apple dont invest in asia but for the wider message in this post it reiterates nokia isnt dead and is not disappearing anytime soon.

USA

enough has been said about this already but i will differ in that i dont think nokia is a non contendor. it is a niche brand which when owned earns respect. i went through a security check once and when emptying my pockets the security guard stopped me only to ask what phone i was holding. on saying it was a N70 he wanted to know more about it. this was 2007.

N95-8 had random strangers on the NY subway asking me about the device. having lived in the UK most of my life no one has ever asked me anything. except last week when a most innocent HR woman from my work said on seeing my N900 'is that one of those apple phones'. i frowned and just said its nokia.

that however is not a typical response. most people also dont know that microsoft make phones. does that mean windows phones days are numbered? maybe. but i think not.
The UK market loves nokias. the USA really is alone with all this noise. the bank i work for has 120k employees. everysingle one of them has a nokia. most colleagues have e71's. yes thats not a flagship device but nokia isnt a one poodle company. it has an eco system which apple can only steal a tiny share from.


lost a little direction here but thats how i view nokia today. love it or hate it but it has moved the mobile world forward and to dismiss it is foolish. its a giant that will move slowly but will surely move. it wont stir the phone world every month but it will keep working - it just needs to be shown us in the west just need more loyality from them.

the thing i find, is that even if nokia dont find the US a profitable market to try and command, because it would cost them a hell of a lot,
most of the media that is shoved in our faces comes from america, so infact they have to win over the americans because its harming thier sales in every country with internet access, that and thier terribly drwn out transitional stage that theyve been in for the last couple of years.
im sick of hearing about iphones but they love them, and everyone sitting here where i live listens to them and thinks its cool to love them too. android fever is starting to kick in big time now as well, but androids not half bad imho haha

yep, its noisy, because outside of asia it seems all non-english tech news is translated english tech news. Tech news more often then not written in usa.

reminds me of people in norway talking about miranda rights becase all the crime dramas on tv are US made.

Living in New York City, the difference between Apple's marketing and Nokia's marketing is stark. Apple, with billboards on every corner, AT&T retail stores, and their own Apple stores (4 in Manhattan now) is pretty much everywhere.

Nokia is the company that sells free flip phones with contracts. Whenever I use my N900, the reaction from people usually starts with a, "I remember my old Nokia. That phone wouldn't break no matter what!"

Nokia has largely ignored the USA market, and maybe for good reason. I am not going to pretend I know more about their business than they do themselves but I still think Nokia has a chance in the American market.

They have the products (N8, E72, E73, N900, 5800, etc). All they need is the marketing and carrier support (Like it or not, that is how more than 90 percent on Americans buy their phones).

Hyundai (and even Kia) have had a big turnaround in America recently with the release of a few excellent cars AND more importantly an aggressive ad campaign. If Nokia wants, they can definitely draw people back to their phones in America.

If Motorola can do it...

No, it really matters. It was stated that his phone received updates after two years. I don't know when he got his device or when the last update was released, but the model isn't two years old. It's more like a year and a half.

So, there's no truth in it having two years worth of support and updates - yet. Two years life cycles are different from a year and a half life cycles are different from a year life cycles. It really matters.

The problem is, they did it by moving to Android. Samsung are trying to replicate Motorolla's success with Droid by building on Android with the Galaxy brand and have forecast a huge increase in sales over the next financial year. HTC became a major player in the US market through their links with Android. There's a common thread, and Nokia has ruled out that option.