Producing Qwerty OtherHalf --order counter: 75/75 --ordering closed - Page 7 - maemo.org

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dirkvl	2013-10-08 , 16:50
Posts: 1,104 \| Thanked: 5,652 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Holland	#61

Originally Posted by kulve

I googled a bit and those (some no-brand clones?) seem to be still available from china quite cheaply. Might not be a bad idea to use something like that instead of trying to do that part DIY-style.

Link? It is not my intention to use the N900 keyboard as a final form, I just had it laying around. Parallel to this thread is a design thread to investigate the perfect form-factor! Feel very free so suggest cheap ways to get keyboard parts there. Design is one thing, pricing and availability another!

In the mean time, the toner transfer totally worked! The white stuff is some paper that hasn't completely dissolved, but that is not a problem. It needs some touching up, but this is totally usable.

Originally Posted by minimos

You don't need to order 1500 of those (if it's ok to pay a bit more per piece).
Check e.g. Digikeys, you can order a 'Digi-Reel' (which is a piece of the 1500 reel) of ADP5588 of any size, or you can buy a single sample.

Okay, that sounds better! However, power-wise it is not very efficient to use voltage-controllers and it is an extra part, which takes in extra space and extra complexity. The best design a the simplest design!!! How about this one?

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jalyst	2013-10-08 , 16:54
Moderator \| Posts: 5,320 \| Thanked: 4,464 times \| Joined on Oct 2009	#62

Originally Posted by kulve

I would guess that it's too late. But certainly it would be nice to get a verification whether or not it is there.

Is this not something useful to establish with Jolla before moving too far ahead?

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	Mikkosssss	2013-10-08 , 17:09
	Posts: 645 \| Thanked: 519 times \| Joined on Apr 2012 @ Finland	#63

Originally Posted by dirkvl

In the mean time, the toner transfer totally worked! The white stuff is some paper that hasn't completely dissolved, but that is not a problem. It needs some touching up, but this is totally usable.

Nice!

If this works I will use your guide when I get my Jolla.

And Then I will try make nice sliding thing. I have lots of parts.

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jalyst	2013-10-08 , 17:14
Moderator \| Posts: 5,320 \| Thanked: 4,464 times \| Joined on Oct 2009	#64

^Same, this could become a invaluable resource/guide longer-term if Jolla/partners don't deliver on a decent qwerty OH.

dirkvl	2013-10-08 , 17:14
Posts: 1,104 \| Thanked: 5,652 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Holland	#65

Originally Posted by jalyst

Is this not something useful to establish with Jolla before moving too far ahead?

Yeah, totally! In the mean time I am just tinkering around (and for now building an I2C keyboard for my RPi!). I would love to be in contact with Jolla. I send them an email quite recently, but no reply so far. Registering for twitter and harassing them online is not my kind of cookie.

Jolla seems to be aware of this topic. So, Jolla, if you are reading this: feel free to relieve us with information about the I2C connection (which is to boring for general public anyway) here. And if you have some spare CAD drawings laying around, I am very discrete

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TemeV	2013-10-08 , 17:15
Posts: 121 \| Thanked: 231 times \| Joined on Oct 2013	#66

Originally Posted by dirkvl

Okay, that sounds better! However, power-wise it is not very efficient to use voltage-controllers and it is an extra part, which takes in extra space and extra complexity. The best design a the simplest design!!! How about this one?

Power-wise... Small MCUs tend to consume several milliamps. With ADP5588 and a cheap switching regulator, eg. http://fi.farnell.com/texas-instrume...ter/dp/1685654 you get a long with less than a hundred microamps.

Complexity is more than counting components. That regulator requires 3 external components. ADP5588 is way less complex than any MCU.

So I would say going with a regulator and i2c qwerty controller is less complex, cheaper and less power consuming solution.

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jalyst	2013-10-08 , 17:23
Moderator \| Posts: 5,320 \| Thanked: 4,464 times \| Joined on Oct 2009	#67

Originally Posted by dirkvl

Yeah, totally! In the mean time I am just tinkering around (and for now building an I2C keyboard for my RPi!). I would love to be in contact with Jolla. I send them an email quite recently, but no reply so far. Registering for twitter and harassing them online is not my kind of cookie.

Alright, alright, I get ya, I've "tweeted" them, lets hope they don't get all "smoke n mirrors" on our asses!

https://twitter.com/JediTWang/status/387465481927405568

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mikecomputing	2013-10-08 , 18:08
Posts: 3,464 \| Thanked: 5,107 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Gothenburg in Sweden	#68

Originally Posted by kulve

I've been playing a bit with ST's STM32x chips and started dream about having a qwerty built around it when I bumped into this thread.

For PCB designs I really recommend Kicad. It's open source, commonly used and works on Linux and Windows.

It's not that hard to design a PCB with Kicad and order it from Itead. And Itead's prices are very suitable even for individual hobbyists.

Hmmmm I personally is alergic with MCU manufactors that only has IDE/Compiler/debuggers that only works in windows. Isn't STM32 winblows only?

If thats the case it should not be used. I say the same about 8bit Microchip... AVR is better for 8bit (even if it sucks bigtime to user 8/16 bits this days when ARM costs less...

Open project shall use open and platform independent toolchains atleast... (means GCC)

Originally Posted by dirkvl

For a potential version 2 prototype, this might be a potential candidate! Runs up to 5.5 volts, 1mm thick and lots and lots of functionality!

However, I have zero experience with programming these kind op microprocessors. Also, putting this thing on a pcb is a bit out of my reach. Please help if you have serious skills!

http://cdn.meme.li/i/oz8yt.jpg

IMHO use ARM that works with GCC toolchain and often costs less. see my other posts. And also works with more debugprobes...

Originally Posted by jalyst

Is this not something useful to establish with Jolla before moving too far ahead?

Yeah think that too... same for the voltage discussion... batteryvoltage != I2C != mainboard

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Last edited by mikecomputing; 2013-10-08 at 18:25.

kulve	2013-10-08 , 18:34
Posts: 59 \| Thanked: 66 times \| Joined on May 2007	#69

Originally Posted by mikecomputing

Hmmmm I personally is alergic with MCU manufactors that only has IDE/Compiler/debuggers that only works in windows. Isn't STM32 winblows only?

I use Windows only for gaming. With STM32 I'm using open source tools only and they work very well, especially with the newer boards.

Originally Posted by mikecomputing

Yeah think that too... same for the voltage discussion... batteryvoltage != I2C != mainboard

I guess there's no reason for them to provide different voltage on the power line compared to i2c logic level. Although 1.8V is quite common with modern phone ARMs.

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TemeV	2013-10-08 , 19:07
Posts: 121 \| Thanked: 231 times \| Joined on Oct 2013	#70

Originally Posted by kulve

I guess there's no reason for them to provide different voltage on the power line compared to i2c logic level. Although 1.8V is quite common with modern phone ARMs.

I think there is a ton of reasons. Most significantly that there is not much modern ICs that can handle the battery voltage and even less MCUs. I'd bet that CPU core of the chipset Jolla uses operates on something between 1V and 1.8V. Most IO logic levels are most likely 1.8V. 5V circuits are quite obsolete these days and even 3.3V starts to get rare. Battery voltage (around 3.6V in this case) is almost never used as IO voltage. Most likely the i2c logic level of OH is 1.8V.

Raspberry pi uses 3.3V. If you're going to use it with raspberry pi, I'd recommend regulating the voltage to that.