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Bec is offline Bec
2009-12-28 , 10:53
Posts: 876 | Thanked: 396 times | Joined on Dec 2009
#1
Future

In the future red pill mode will be removed. Similar function can be accomplished by Root access and rootsh can be instaled via application manager.
Why in the world would anybody want to disable red pill mode?

As a beginner barely getting used to linux I find red pill mode to be a very confortable way of installing .deb packages.

How can someone even start to imagine that installing apps via the terminal can be likeable??? It's a horrible nightmare that would require for me to start googleing and learning all kinds of crappy commands I do not know nothing of!

I say red pill should not only be kept, but the app manager should have the capability by default of installng .deb packages from the internal memory.
Either that or make the .debs installable by clicking when in the internal memory.

Thank you !
 
shapeshifter is offline shapeshifter
2009-12-28 , 11:12
Posts: 187 | Thanked: 345 times | Joined on Nov 2009
#2
Originally Posted by Bec View Post
It's a horrible nightmare that would require for me to start googleing and learning all kinds of crappy commands I do not know nothing of!
What??? Oh noes, You would actually need to learn something? That's outragous!!!


Last edited by shapeshifter; 2009-12-28 at 11:14.
 

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lorelei is offline lorelei
2009-12-28 , 12:46
Posts: 479 | Thanked: 641 times | Joined on Dec 2007 @ Switzerland
#3
Wasn't the red pill mode supposed to be used by "users knowing what they are doing"?

Honestly, I expect that anyone using red pill mode is at least comfortable with using the "crappy command" to fix a possible mistake made with the red pill.
 

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jak is offline jak
2009-12-28 , 12:50
Posts: 104 | Thanked: 47 times | Joined on Sep 2009 @ Kassel, Hesse, Germany
#4
Originally Posted by Bec View Post
Why in the world would anybody want to disable red pill mode?

As a beginner barely getting used to linux I find red pill mode to be a very confortable way of installing .deb packages.

How can someone even start to imagine that installing apps via the terminal can be likeable??? It's a horrible nightmare that would require for me to start googleing and learning all kinds of crappy commands I do not know nothing of!

I say red pill should not only be kept, but the app manager should have the capability by default of installng .deb packages from the internal memory.
Either that or make the .debs installable by clicking when in the internal memory.

Thank you !
A functionality for advanced users which can be replaced by another functionality for the same target group can be removed. If you don't know how to do it on the command-line, you shouldn't be doing it via the GUI.
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Julian Andres Klode - Debian Developer, Ubuntu Member

See http://wiki.debian.org/JulianAndresKlode and http://jak-linux.org/.
 

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ewan is offline ewan
2009-12-28 , 12:55
Posts: 445 | Thanked: 572 times | Joined on Oct 2009 @ Oxford
#5
I think the point is exactly to discourage people from (among other things) installing random debs given how bad an idea that usually is compared with using the repositories like any sane person.
 

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Bec's Avatar
Bec is offline Bec
2009-12-28 , 12:58
Posts: 876 | Thanked: 396 times | Joined on Dec 2009
#6
Originally Posted by shapeshifter View Post
What??? Oh noes, You would actually need to learn something? That's outragous!!!


Oh noes why do you think linux fails to catch to the wide range of audience?

Because I use this in XP to make extra nice customisations to my sistem right afrer the install without having to click here and there and search for silly configs. <- this is handy
Code:
@FOR /F "DELIMS=" %%? IN ('REG QUERY HKLM\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Network\{4D36E972-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318} /S^|FINDSTR \\Connection$') DO @REG ADD "%%?" /V ShowIcon /T REG_DWORD /D 0 /F>NUL
FOR /F "DELIMS=" %%? IN ('DIR/B/AD %TEMP%\*') DO RD/S/Q "%%~f?"
COPY "%AllUsersProfile%\Desktop\*.*" "%USERPROFILE%\Desktop"
for /f "usebackq delims=" %%d in (`"dir /ad/b/s | sort /R"`) do rd "%%d"
DEL /s /q "%USERPROFILE%\Desktop\*.*"
shutdown -s -t 20


Writing a command line EACH and every time I want to install a .deb is annoying =/= handy

Ever wondered why your N900 has a nice UI instead of "~ $" when you start it up?
Or why you can acces the phone via an icon instead of "./phone"

I guess it's because people like using GUIs instead of commandlines.
I know it's quite a shock but anyone can LEARN a stupid commandline, but most people simply rather used a nice interface, install an app with two clicks instead of writing down a whole line of text - suppose you know why they say time is money?
 

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Bec is offline Bec
2009-12-28 , 13:05
Posts: 876 | Thanked: 396 times | Joined on Dec 2009
#7
A functionality for advanced users which can be replaced by another functionality for the same target group can be removed. If you don't know how to do it on the command-line, you shouldn't be doing it via the GUI.
Yeah and then let's remove terminal also and make it installable via app manager since only advanced users need it anyway.
Anyone can google the command to install each and every .deb their hearts desire.

I was just trying to underline that redpill is simply more confortable to use and if John Doe wants to install a .deb John Doe will install a .deb, red or bluepill or even by writing down a command he doesn't even understand - no matter what.

Red pill makes it easy to overcome an unnecesary timetaking step that anyone will eventually do, having no idea what the command they just wrote means.
I'm sorry no one sees this like I do...
Last edited by Bec; 2009-12-28 at 13:19.
 

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shapeshifter is offline shapeshifter
2009-12-28 , 13:24
Posts: 187 | Thanked: 345 times | Joined on Nov 2009
#8
Uhm, well I don't really want to engage in a pointless debate here, but I'll answer just this once:
Originally Posted by Bec View Post
Oh noes why do you think linux fails to catch to the wide range of audience?
Because people are lazy, and for various other reasons - a lack of buttons not being one of them. (Ever seen KDE? Many, many buttons.)

Originally Posted by Bec View Post
Writing a command line EACH and every time I want to install a .deb is annoying =/= handy[/B]
Originally Posted by Bec View Post
...install an app with two clicks instead of writing down a whole line of text - suppose you know why they say time is money?
You can't seriously tell me that you're faster clicking like 10 times to get from the home screen to the application manager, browse to the .deb location and go on installing it and then closing the app manager again, compared to typing "dpkg -i /path/to/file". That's a very popular misconception on command line use. The command line is fast. Very fast. For many tasks I can guarantee you I'm faster on the CLI then some clicky GUI. A GUI is mainly of use in CG, complex image manipulation and parallel multitasking of few apps/channels at a time and web browsing. Other then that, the CLI is always faster then a GUI approach, but, as you so whiningly pointed out, there's some learning involved.

To give this thread at least some amount of meaning, here's a barely related drawing:

and a rabbit for added cuteness:


Now why don't you just move along. If you're not happy, just write a script to do it and put a big red pill button on your desktop.
Last edited by shapeshifter; 2009-12-28 at 13:56.
 

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Bec's Avatar
Bec is offline Bec
2009-12-28 , 13:25
Posts: 876 | Thanked: 396 times | Joined on Dec 2009
#9
"dpkg -i /path/to/file"
So you do realize most people are too lazy to write that and rather choose widows where "dpkg -i /path/to/file" translates into "click, click" or "enter"
Commandline is not as easy to use for most people and while walking on the street it'd rather use an already enabled red pill mode and install a .deb using one finger, instead of having to take the keyboard out and type blindly using both my hands on-the-go.

So please "dpkg -i /path/to/file" in a crowded bus with no seats, while having nothing to hold on to.

And it's not like anyone needs to know anything more than "ctl-c" and "ctl-v" to enable the extras-devel repository, that is far more dangerous than the scarce .deb packages that work with maemo anyway.
Last edited by Bec; 2009-12-28 at 13:34.
 
Bec's Avatar
Bec is offline Bec
2009-12-28 , 13:44
Posts: 876 | Thanked: 396 times | Joined on Dec 2009
#10
Originally Posted by shapeshifter View Post
If you're not happy, just write a script to do it and but a big red pill button on your desktop.
Yes' id really like to know how to write that script, and even more how to manage the shortcuts from the main menu, from the "More..." menu and how to fix the icon on transmission that seems to "break" after every reboot.

But I guess the geekyness is weak within me and i've much to learn

Originally Posted by shapeshifter View Post
Now why don't you just move along..
And thanks for this sample of famous linux knowitall-to-noob friendlyness
Last edited by Bec; 2009-12-28 at 13:48.
 

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