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danramos is offline danramos
2011-06-04 , 09:21
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#91
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
Maemo devices have had high return rates since the N800.
I can't say I'm too surprised by that. The N800 was the last good Maemo device, as far as I can tell. Adding a slide-out keyboard just adds more weight and more moving parts. Also, I really, really thing that it was a BIG mistake to move away from having a D-pad. Once again--they could have been far ahead of everyone else about advantageous things such as TABLES and even d-pads on tablets for gaming and/or digital movements like in menus. Ugh. Nokia--what a goddam shame. They were sitting on a goldmine and decided to just piss it all away.

Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
Allegations of willful harm are made out of ignorance. The simplest truths are that Nokia has been far too conservative for its own good, and in the case of internet tablets, did not really know what they had.
Allegations of willful harm are made out of evident history and statements that can be summarized as simply as "WONTFIX". They didn't literally step all over their customers, but it was just as bad that they ignored customer demands, ignored customer concerns, provided incredibly frustrating responses or refused to respond at all, provided little to NO support (hardware/repair/etc), provided little presence (virtually NONE in North America) and terrible face-to-face experiences with Nokia sales/support/etc when they WERE available, ...I mean, I could go on. :P In the metaphorical sense, yes... they stepped all over their customers and it's showing lately. (People aren't exactly flocking back to a Nokia after the experience of owning one, despite even well-made devices.)
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onethreealpha is offline onethreealpha
2011-06-04 , 09:24
Posts: 434 | Thanked: 990 times | Joined on May 2010 @ Australia
#92
Others have also stated that the move to qt was something that stole a lot of time that could have been spent on optimising harmattan and refining the UI.
without additional resourcing, this almost guarantees a failure to meet deadlines for getting a product out to market.

the lack of clarity (at least for the public) about where Harmattan fitted in to Nokia's Meego strategy seems to have fuelled a reluctance to push forward on the Meego front. It seems easy, at first glance, to assume now that Nokia were pushing Harmattan as their "Meego" phone. It may have been "step 5 of 5" in the Maemo cycle, but with Meego API's t would seem to also be step 1 of x in the move ot full Meego

It would be interesting to see if Nokia's decision to drop the Meego push coincided with the first rumblings from within Meego and the TSG that they would not accept Nokia using the "Meego" tag on the Harmattan Device.

opting for WM (with a green light to customise) would be the only obvious external os choice to allow Nokia to not become like the many other hardware clones, err manufacturers on the market
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danramos is offline danramos
2011-06-04 , 09:26
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#93
Originally Posted by ericsson View Post
I guess that is the difference between Nokia, MS and you. Where Nokia and MS looks for and creates reasons for why this will work, everyone here are pessimistic and negative naysayers like the ones we find tucked away somewhere at the end of the longest corridors of bureaucracies.

I mean come on, MS+Nokia may not be your (ours) choice of phone, but they will do it great commercially and will be loved by the general public. That is what Nokia and MS is all about. Fringe devices such as the n900, and to some extent the communicator series - we can only hope that Nokia+MS is still in the mood to do these cool things as well.
heh*cough*... like I said elsewhere... Yah. Those Microsoft Windows Phone 7 devices are just FLYING off the shelf. And Nokia is doing faaaantasticly bad. Putting two bad tastes that go worse together. Not only is it not our choice of phone here on this forum, but they're both proving that they're increasingly less successful commercially. The general public doesn't seem to be impressed with either of these companies right now.
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Nokia's slogan shouldn't be the pedo-palmgrabbing image with the slogan, "Connecting People"... It should be one hand open pleadingly with another hand giving the middle finger and the more apt slogan, "Potential Unrealized." --DR
 

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ericsson is offline ericsson
2011-06-04 , 09:47
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#94
Originally Posted by danramos View Post
heh*cough*... like I said elsewhere... Yah. Those Microsoft Windows Phone 7 devices are just FLYING off the shelf. And Nokia is doing faaaantasticly bad. Putting two bad tastes that go worse together. Not only is it not our choice of phone here on this forum, but they're both proving that they're increasingly less successful commercially. The general public doesn't seem to be impressed with either of these companies right now.
You stupid woman I mean seriously, how ignorant is it possible to become? It works like this, it is not what is right now, it is what will be. Like two cars, one with a fantastic, reliable and powerful yet immature engine, but a chassis that falls apart (all existing WP7 phones). The other car has a perfect chassis, high quality, never breaks, but with an obsolete engine that really isn't fit for todays tasks compared with the competition.

When you blend those two cars, it is for the purpose of having an excellent engine in an excellent chassis. Shouldn't be so difficult to grasp should it? Will MS and Nokia make it work? Well, they try hard to, and have no other way to the future, this is their shot. I believe they will make it, not because I love Nokia or MS, but because it is a very good strategy, and they need this to survive.

It will also be a real alternative to iPhone and Android.
 
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marxian is offline marxian
2011-06-04 , 09:55
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#95
Originally Posted by ericsson View Post
You stupid woman I mean seriously, how ignorant is it possible to become? It works like this, it is not what is right now, it is what will be. Like two cars, one with a fantastic, reliable and powerful yet immature engine, but a chassis that falls apart (all existing WP7 phones). The other car has a perfect chassis, high quality, never breaks, but with an obsolete engine that really isn't fit for todays tasks compared with the competition.

When you blend those two cars, it is for the purpose of having an excellent engine in an excellent chassis.
Take a look a Nokia's new blended car:



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ericsson is offline ericsson
2011-06-04 , 10:17
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#96
Originally Posted by marxian View Post
Take a look a Nokia's new blended car:



Exactly what I meant
 
tkatchev is offline tkatchev
2011-06-04 , 10:53
Posts: 163 | Thanked: 256 times | Joined on May 2010
#97
What??

WP7 is already a commercial failure, and already hated by the general public.

This years before the first Nokia WP7 phone release.

If Nokia wanted a phone that's 'loved by the general public', they would have gone with Android.

What Nokia really wanted was billions of dollars in bonuses from Microsoft for the Nokia board members.

Originally Posted by ericsson View Post
I mean come on, MS+Nokia may not be your (ours) choice of phone, but they will do it great commercially and will be loved by the general public. That is what Nokia and MS is all about. Fringe devices such as the n900, and to some extent the communicator series - we can only hope that Nokia+MS is still in the mood to do these cool things as well.
 

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danramos is offline danramos
2011-06-04 , 10:55
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#98
Originally Posted by ericsson View Post
You stupid woman I mean seriously, how ignorant is it possible to become? It works like this, it is not what is right now, it is what will be. Like two cars, one with a fantastic, reliable and powerful yet immature engine, but a chassis that falls apart (all existing WP7 phones). The other car has a perfect chassis, high quality, never breaks, but with an obsolete engine that really isn't fit for todays tasks compared with the competition.

When you blend those two cars, it is for the purpose of having an excellent engine in an excellent chassis. Shouldn't be so difficult to grasp should it? Will MS and Nokia make it work? Well, they try hard to, and have no other way to the future, this is their shot. I believe they will make it, not because I love Nokia or MS, but because it is a very good strategy, and they need this to survive.

It will also be a real alternative to iPhone and Android.
Jane, you ignorant slut. I see that you are confused--you clearly gave that impression immediately with your opening. Given your profoundly confused state, I can now understand how you might make the argument you made, and overlook the other obvious possibility you posed: When you blend those two same cars, it might be for the purpose of having an excellent engine in an excellent chassis, but through the miracle of Microsoft's and Nokia's amazing choices over the last few years, we could easily end up with the unimpressive, unwanted engine and a chassis that in fact might still fall apart--and worse, it might even be a throwback to big, clunky chassis that only your grandfather might appreciate, complete with fins, circular brake lights and a dark cloud that follows it everywhere because it's not nearly as energy efficient and innovative an engine and chassis as everyone else, who has gone on and evolved the whole market instead of playing catch-up like Microsoft+Nokia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weekend_Update
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Nokia's slogan shouldn't be the pedo-palmgrabbing image with the slogan, "Connecting People"... It should be one hand open pleadingly with another hand giving the middle finger and the more apt slogan, "Potential Unrealized." --DR
 
danramos's Avatar
danramos is offline danramos
2011-06-04 , 10:59
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#99
Originally Posted by tkatchev View Post
What Nokia really wanted was billions of dollars in bonuses from Microsoft for the Nokia board members.
Also sex. Nokia wanted sex with Microsoft. Big, fat corporate sex. Money is just their way of fertilizing their future Kin.
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Nokia's slogan shouldn't be the pedo-palmgrabbing image with the slogan, "Connecting People"... It should be one hand open pleadingly with another hand giving the middle finger and the more apt slogan, "Potential Unrealized." --DR
 
ericsson is offline ericsson
2011-06-04 , 11:22
Banned | Posts: 974 | Thanked: 622 times | Joined on Oct 2010
#100
Originally Posted by danramos View Post
Jane, you ignorant slut. I see that you are confused--you clearly gave that impression immediately with your opening. Given your profoundly confused state, I can now understand how you might make the argument you made, and overlook the other obvious possibility you posed: When you blend those two same cars, it might be for the purpose of having an excellent engine in an excellent chassis, but through the miracle of Microsoft's and Nokia's amazing choices over the last few years, we could easily end up with the unimpressive, unwanted engine and a chassis that in fact might still fall apart--and worse, it might even be a throwback to big, clunky chassis that only your grandfather might appreciate, complete with fins, circular brake lights and a dark cloud that follows it everywhere because it's not nearly as energy efficient and innovative an engine and chassis as everyone else, who has gone on and evolved the whole market instead of playing catch-up like Microsoft+Nokia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weekend_Update
Reality check. MS rules the PC world. We may dislike it as much as we want, they still rule. Nokia still rules the mobile market, they sell more phones than anyone else. Nokia and MS is the two most influential companies in PC/mobile. Now they join forces for a new mobile ecosystem and devices and OS. It is not like they will fail because some fanboy nobrain zealots wants them to, or dislike them or hope or pray or whatever.

They will fail if they fail to make good devices and fail to make a good ecosystem, they will succeed if the achieve making good devices and ecosystem. It is that simple. Judging by the state of iOS and Android, MS+Nokia have to make really really piss poor devices and ecosystem to fail. They won't. Already there are 18000 apps, half a year before any Nokia-WP7 is out, they have mail, navigation, search, everything, it is "just" a matter of putting the pieces together.

People generally don't care what OS their phones are running, but they know that Nokia will be totally renewed very soon, obviously they hesitate purchasing a Nokia now. People now that a real Windows phone will be a Nokia, obviously they hesitate purchasing a Samsung or HTC, and both of them have better Android devices in any case.
 
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