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MoJo	2011-06-10 , 23:07
Posts: 108 \| Thanked: 120 times \| Joined on Dec 2009	#81

Well I hope folks know that a couple of months after Nokia and Microsoft got together, Microsoft revised the standardized spec down from 1GHz to 800MHz, as well as they now allow both a dual core next gen Qualcomm and ST Ericsson chips. These are what Elop is talking about, concessions which Microsoft has made. This was made in a presentation at MIX11:

http://channel9.msdn.com/events/MIX/MIX11/DVC19

Also keep in mind that the current 1GHz will be the mid range devices by next year, the 800MHz is the low end segment, and the dual cores will serve the high end.

As for MeeGo not being able to scale as easily, their might be truth to it because with WP7 you obtain an OS that is optimized by MS for that SoC whereas MeeGo the OEM has to take care of that as well. Does that fault it although, probably not and he is most likely dumping on MeeGo for other reasons. The scale of the tie in with MS, and the amount they each are hedging on each other is probably what forced Elops hand. To get play in the maps service, I am sure MS said "no unless you drop Symbian and commit to us". This is what corporate negotiations are, you don't get anything for free and MeeGo is bashed because somewhere in the agreement it was a decision reached by both for doing business with each other. He will never publicly state this, that is why weak applesauce is coming from Elop regarding MeeGo. All agreements are forward looking, so consider his statements 2 or three years down. They would not hold true because by then MeeGo is more mature, the ecosystem is a year old, and engineers/ programmers are more comfortable with working on MeeGo on putting it on a variety of different hardware.

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	danramos	2011-06-10 , 23:34
	Posts: 4,672 \| Thanked: 5,455 times \| Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA	#82

Originally Posted by MoJo

Well I hope folks know that a couple of months after Nokia and Microsoft got together, Microsoft revised the standardized spec down from 1GHz to 800MHz, as well as they now allow both a dual core next gen Qualcomm and ST Ericsson chips. These are what Elop is talking about, concessions which Microsoft has made. This was made in a presentation at MIX11:

http://channel9.msdn.com/events/MIX/MIX11/DVC19

Also keep in mind that the current 1GHz will be the mid range devices by next year, the 800MHz is the low end segment, and the dual cores will serve the high end.

As for MeeGo not being able to scale as easily, their might be truth to it because with WP7 you obtain an OS that is optimized by MS for that SoC whereas MeeGo the OEM has to take care of that as well. Does that fault it although, probably not and he is most likely dumping on MeeGo for other reasons. The scale of the tie in with MS, and the amount they each are hedging on each other is probably what forced Elops hand. To get play in the maps service, I am sure MS said "no unless you drop Symbian and commit to us". This is what corporate negotiations are, you don't get anything for free and MeeGo is bashed because somewhere in the agreement it was a decision reached by both for doing business with each other. He will never publicly state this, that is why weak applesauce is coming from Elop regarding MeeGo. All agreements are forward looking, so consider his statements 2 or three years down. They would not hold true because by then MeeGo is more mature, the ecosystem is a year old, and engineers/ programmers are more comfortable with working on MeeGo on putting it on a variety of different hardware.

I'm not feeling that "concessions" vibe, unless you mean some kind of wholesale "come to the dark side" garbage. There isn't a sense here of any real form of concessions or deal-making going on. It appears to be a complete change of corporate personality, not a give-and-take. Even if you were right and he simply couldn't state those facts as such publicly, what he IS stating in public is repeatedly undercutting Nokia's and his own image and competency. What I'm saying is that I think he might be clinically stupid, based on public statements. :P

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	onethreealpha	2011-06-11 , 00:02
	Posts: 434 \| Thanked: 990 times \| Joined on May 2010 @ Australia	#83

200mhz isn't much of a concession when pretty much all of Nokias current "flagship" devices (n8, E7, X7, E6) across a range of device segments all share a processor that is lower than that.

I don't see WP7 running on a low end device unless the ui is nothing more than a command prompt.

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	ysss	2011-06-11 , 00:07
	Posts: 4,384 \| Thanked: 5,524 times \| Joined on Jul 2007 @ ˙ǝɹǝɥʍou	#84

Originally Posted by Kajko

Meego is a dead horse. Get over it.

So that's why everyone's wanting to beat it....

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	danramos	2011-06-11 , 00:22
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Originally Posted by ysss

So that's why everyone's wanting to beat it....

Fixed that for you.

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MoJo	2011-06-11 , 00:24
Posts: 108 \| Thanked: 120 times \| Joined on Dec 2009	#86

Originally Posted by danramos

I'm not feeling that "concessions" vibe, unless you mean some kind of wholesale "come to the dark side" garbage. There isn't a sense here of any real form of concessions or deal-making going on. It appears to be a complete change of corporate personality, not a give-and-take. Even if you were right and he simply couldn't state those facts as such publicly, what he IS stating in public is repeatedly undercutting Nokia's and his own image and competency. What I'm saying is that I think he might be clinically stupid, based on public statements. :P

Clinically stupid? That is a bit of a hyperbole. He hasn't made comments favorable to MeeGo but nor has he axed MeeGo. He just doesn't publicly state what MeeGo and future disruptions mean in the grander scheme of ecosystem building going forward. Will MeeGo be marketed commercially or will it forever remain in an experimental lab as a prototyping OS within Nokia? This is what he needs to explain to this community who have invested a lot in Maemo and MeeGo. TMO is the pure definition of the Nokia base, and as of late none of us really feel good about Nokia's direction even I have come to terms with WP7 but then it still doesn't sit well with me ... the only reason I came to terms is that I tried WP7 and wasn't mortified by the experience even though I bricked my phone due to MS's stupid SD card choice and Dells lack of integrating a recovery path something I hope Nokia knocks sense into MS with. When the phone was working, it was quite well and I saw how Mango could really strengthen it.

Anyways I look now at MeeGo and what I have been seeing with MeeGo development. WP7 is something tangible, MeeGo is still a dream and concept just about to be realized. Nokia needs a clean break, Elop is seeing to it by cutting the anchors of Nokia, even if he didn't do anything today the status quo was not sustainable. Call him stupid, I see him publicly saying that Symbian is going as a sign of honesty and good communication. I think Elop is trying to fix a credibility deficit brought about by old Nokia insiders work ethics. I did not trust anything OPK and his old team said, as nothing they said has come to fruition, this guys says it and executes it ... he even held his ground at AllthingsD, this is a good leader even when you disagree with him you have to assume he is working with numbers you and I aren't privy to. Nokia can't afford to patch up a problem any more, the whole house has to be brought down to the foundations and be rebuilt from the ground up.

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ericsson	2011-06-11 , 01:02
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Originally Posted by danramos

I'm not feeling that "concessions" vibe, unless you mean some kind of wholesale "come to the dark side" garbage. There isn't a sense here of any real form of concessions or deal-making going on. It appears to be a complete change of corporate personality, not a give-and-take. Even if you were right and he simply couldn't state those facts as such publicly, what he IS stating in public is repeatedly undercutting Nokia's and his own image and competency. What I'm saying is that I think he might be clinically stupid, based on public statements. :P

Why make such a creative analysis that ends in Elop being a stupid jerk no matter what? it is getting boring by now. Have you tried MeeGo for the N900? it is essentially in the exact same state as it was one year ago. MeeGo is a joke, and it never made any sense why Nokia went from Maemo to MeeGo.

What has happened is that Nokia wanted it all, but failed miserably when executing its plan. Either the plan was terrible, the ingredients were rotten or they simply couldn't execute it. My guess is a little bit of everything. Elop is merely the unfortunate fire fighter that came too late to rescue the house, but just in time to rescue the people and the safe.

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	onethreealpha	2011-06-11 , 01:12
	Posts: 434 \| Thanked: 990 times \| Joined on May 2010 @ Australia	#88

Originally Posted by ericsson

Have you tried MeeGo for the N900? it is essentially in the exact same state as it was one year ago.

= EPIC FAIL

spoken like someone who neither follows the bug lists, tests daily builds, or has first hand experience of What (and Where) Meego is today.

this is the sort of cr*p that the likes of Stskeeps, Tswindell and others who actually contribute to the Meego project get sick of trying to correct.

We, as consumers, don't need the likes of Elop or MS to kill Meego. People like you will do it for them, with your misinformed forum posts

./set_ignore_to_yet_another_troll

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