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abill_uk is offline abill_uk
2011-08-21 , 17:14
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#241
Originally Posted by tekki View Post
Yes, and let the money flow cut off even earlier. Great idea! Revolution!

(or was that called suicide..)
Damm you man you got no spirit time to rally the lads and to hell with Nokia, who needs them !.

Let's face it they have dumped us anyhow so what do you want to do ? lie down and die ? naaaa you do not want to do that so gather arms and start the good fight for this community ! .
 
maacruz is offline maacruz
2011-08-21 , 17:30
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#242
Originally Posted by Graham Cobb View Post
No, it is a serious proposal. Only after Nokia decide they are not willing to continue funding them, of course.

Neither is needed -- plenty of other projects manage without them. There are plenty of garage alternatives on the Internet and developers can build their packages themselves and upload them directly to the repository.
Then you are willing yourself to do the porting of all current software to those services, and implement the autobuilder alternative to maintain the repos, I guess.
Or are you suggesting that we should dump all of our current codebase down the drain?
If Nokia pulls the plug, as it will probably happen sooner or later, what we have to do is to secure the transfer of those resources in Nokia managed servers to our own, and secure some fundings to keep those servers alive.
It doesn't make any sense this talk about dumping our current base resources unless we are forced to, either by being impossible to get them from Nokia, or by a complete lack of resources to maintain them.
 

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Texrat is offline Texrat
2011-08-21 , 18:03
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#243
Originally Posted by abill_uk View Post
Do you really need to know Nokia's position????.
I didn't ask the question, I answered it.
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Rauha is offline Rauha
2011-08-21 , 18:51
Posts: 1,400 | Thanked: 3,751 times | Joined on Sep 2009 @ Arctic cold of northern .fi
#244
Originally Posted by abill_uk View Post
Damm you man you got no spirit time to rally the lads and to hell with Nokia, who needs them !.

Let's face it they have dumped us anyhow so what do you want to do ? lie down and die ? naaaa you do not want to do that so gather arms and start the good fight for this community ! .
I'm right behind you, as soon as you have done even a single practical thing or some actual work in support of your plan.

Note: Making another post on the Interweb forums doesn't count.
 

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Graham Cobb is offline Graham Cobb
2011-08-21 , 18:53
Posts: 162 | Thanked: 351 times | Joined on Apr 2006 @ Cotswolds, UK
#245
Originally Posted by maacruz View Post
Then you are willing yourself to do the porting of all current software to those services, and implement the autobuilder alternative to maintain the repos, I guess.
Or are you suggesting that we should dump all of our current codebase down the drain?
Eh? Garage is nothing to do with current software -- it is a place to host shared projects. If there were any active projects in garage their owners could move them to some other service, of which there are plenty. Non-active projects would be archived with all their code available to anyone to download (as today) but with all the garage services terminated.

And the autobuilder is nothing to do with the repositories except that it is the only way, currently, to put packages into them. The repositories would be opened up so that the small number of developers who wanted to put software in them could do so directly, or via a volunteer who handles the occasional submission. Of course submissions would have to include both source and binary packages.

I am not proposing doing any of this now. My point is just that it is very likely that by the time Nokia pull funding, there will only be a small community of users and developers left, who can manage very well with just forums and a repository. That is a lot more than we had in the early days of the 770 community! There is no particular need to try to plan for keeping the current (expensive) infrastructure going indefinitely, as the community shrinks.
 

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maacruz is offline maacruz
2011-08-21 , 19:44
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#246
Originally Posted by Graham Cobb View Post
Eh? Garage is nothing to do with current software -- it is a place to host shared projects. If there were any active projects in garage their owners could move them to some other service, of which there are plenty. Non-active projects would be archived with all their code available to anyone to download (as today) but with all the garage services terminated.
Garage is more than the hosted code. It is the hosted code, the documentation, the bugs and the posts, at the very least all of it whould have to be mirrored in its current form to allow search engines to work. We can lose the services and go elsewere, but not the site.
And the autobuilder is nothing to do with the repositories except that it is the only way, currently, to put packages into them. The repositories would be opened up so that the small number of developers who wanted to put software in them could do so directly, or via a volunteer who handles the occasional submission. Of course submissions would have to include both source and binary packages.
IMHO you are wrong here. The autobuider is the right way to go, just look at any distro out there. It provides a normalized and repeatable environment to build the packages, a way to make sure all build dependencies are right and available for everyone, and helps in keeping the quality of the source packages high.
I am not proposing doing any of this now.
My point is just that it is very likely that by the time Nokia pull funding, there will only be a small community of users and developers left, who can manage very well with just forums and a repository. That is a lot more than we had in the early days of the 770 community! There is no particular need to try to plan for keeping the current (expensive) infrastructure going indefinitely, as the community shrinks.
And I see no reason to lose that much, if we can keep it. It is not that expensive (vm hosting is cheap today, isn't it?)
So we agree in how premature is to discuss pruning our infrastructure now.
In due time, we can assess how much each thing costs, what resources we have, and what we can keep or not.
 

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momcilo is offline momcilo
2011-08-21 , 20:27
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#247
Pulling the plug from our side does not make sense at the moment, but planning and discussing plans has.

I really hope Nokia will keep its word, and continue the funding until the end of 2012.

Some will say that end is coming. But if there are enough interested parties here, we might have maemo reborn.

It does not have to be dead-end.
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gerbick
2011-08-21 , 20:46
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#248
Originally Posted by momcilo View Post
Pulling the plug from our side does not make sense at the moment, but planning and discussing plans has.
As far as I would say, it does make sense. Less dependence on Nokia, the potential to be better might be on our side.

Sites like XDA are not connected to anybody. More activity, more hacking, more fun seems to happen there.

Here? Stagnation is the norm. I know the guys in the committee are doing tons behind closed doors, but they still have to basically kowtow to an unwilling master at the end.

Face it. We're the community that the post-Elop Nokia does not want to support. The majority of the folks around here **** on WP7 daily - most without ever trying it. Would you fund a group of folks that say your platform of choice is ****?

I wouldn't.

I really hope Nokia will keep its word, and continue the funding until the end of 2012.
Imagine if we were not dependent on Nokia. We need to find another option that kills that need. Get the files that we need to support the OS away from Nokia. Step away from Nokia, love some form of independence.

Not likely gonna happen, but one can dream.

Some will say that end is coming. But if there are enough interested parties here, we might have maemo reborn.
Doubtful. Zaurus died the same way. BeOS died the same way. Hell, I can name a few more if asked.

It does not have to be dead-end.
No, it doesn't. But it sure as hell feels like it.
 

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misterc is offline misterc
2011-08-21 , 21:13
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#249
why doesn't NOKIA want to release maemo.org or the closed bits?
  • they want maemo dead and buried by 31st of Dec 2012 18:25 (whatever timezone). the messages from the management and the marketing may hint @ this, indeed...
  • the reason why the N9 count down stopped... on 1st of Jan 2013, a new maemo.org will be reborn from its (our?) ashes, flashing start for the N9, with videos, software's and all. late for the party, but who knows what NOKIA's fortune will be by then... they might be glad to fall back even on that
  • business as usual?
    NOKIA has no plan so far to stop funding maemo.org, thus
    • they won't release the site
    • nor the closed bits
 
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tso is offline tso
2011-08-21 , 21:55
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#250
There is at least one response from a Nokia engineer claiming that the power subsystem is not opened because they are embarrassed about the level of spaghetti code.

Also, i think Nokia lawyers and leadership got a bit wary after the claims of exploding batteries and such.
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