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2011-12-07
, 10:36
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Posts: 1,197 |
Thanked: 2,710 times |
Joined on Jan 2010
@ Hanoi
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#72
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It is out of discussion that swipe is clever, beautiful and efficient and can be customised.
Imo, what Keferen points out very well and more detailed than I would every be able to bring up the patience for, is the inconsistency of underlying system interface.
This is a bit of a frankenstein mix on the N9 while the N900 offers system wide consistency and coherence.
With the N900 they, whoever were the gods working at Nokia that made it happen, have finally shown understanding of interface design.
Lack of user friendly interface design has brought Symbian down and would make Maemo stand out.
It is surprising not to say frustrating to see that part of the logic and learnings from the N900 have vaporised in the N9.
Because if the N9 had the interface consistency of the N900 with addition of swipe overlay, it would make it a better phone for all of us.
The N9 users, even new, no N900 owner and never been in the market for a Nokia Internet Tablet would have had a better device if Keferen's points would have been respected.
But the points needed to be integrated from a start. "there is an app for that" can fix a lot will miss the beautiful level of integration that makes Maemo 5 still the pinnacle of mobile OS design. (Apart from WebOS , hehe)
Imo, what Keferen points out very well and more detailed than I would every be able to bring up the patience for, is the inconsistency of underlying system interface.
This is a bit of a frankenstein mix on the N9 while the N900 offers system wide consistency and coherence.
With the N900 they, whoever were the gods working at Nokia that made it happen, have finally shown understanding of interface design.
Lack of user friendly interface design has brought Symbian down and would make Maemo stand out.
It is surprising not to say frustrating to see that part of the logic and learnings from the N900 have vaporised in the N9.
Because if the N9 had the interface consistency of the N900 with addition of swipe overlay, it would make it a better phone for all of us.
The N9 users, even new, no N900 owner and never been in the market for a Nokia Internet Tablet would have had a better device if Keferen's points would have been respected.
But the points needed to be integrated from a start. "there is an app for that" can fix a lot will miss the beautiful level of integration that makes Maemo 5 still the pinnacle of mobile OS design. (Apart from WebOS , hehe)
| The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to ste-phan For This Useful Post: | ||
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2011-12-07
, 11:28
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Posts: 648 |
Thanked: 650 times |
Joined on Oct 2011
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#73
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Originally Posted by litemotiv
Using the app screen as a task switcher would be terrible idea in my opinion. When you mix up icons and running apps as icons confusion is the result. It also takes away the best feature of the multitasking screen - being able to see what the app is doing at a glance. For eg., you may be downloading something and just want to check whether it has finished and this can be done without maximizing the app as the mini screens are live.
I've mentioned it before in this thread, but swipe manager is not a real fix.
The real problem i think is one of redundancy: the app launcher already is a task switcher. The switcher itself becomes mostly a place where you need to close tasks, yet it occupies one third of the basic interaction of the phone (i.e. one of the three virtual desktops).
In general use, people just want to start and switch apps, and switching to another app could just as well be done via the launcher. So the task switcher in my opinion should never be one of the primary desktops.
Maybe the list of running apps should just be listed as icons in the roll-down screen you get when clicking on the status bar. Pressing and holding an icon could throw a [close / cancel] popup. If really needed there could also be a small button there to view the open apps in a thumbnail view (such as the current task switcher).
The philosophy of the OS is one of real multitasking instead of 'smart backgrounding', ok i get that. But how many apps really need to stay fully active in the background? Very few in practice i think. So also in that regard it would make more sense to smart background every app by default, and give a manual method to keep an app truly active in the background. This would reduce the number of icons that need to be shown in the status screen, and would remove the need for this dedicated task switcher screen completely. Imo it's a win-win-win situation:
- simpler and more efficient desktop interaction with 2 screens
- more battery efficient (only manually selected apps stay active)
- more control (active apps list can be reached from every screen by clicking status, instead of having to swipe to the task switcher screen first).
Tl;dr the task switcher should not be dedicated part of the main interaction of the phone. 2 virtual desktops (homescreen + app launcher) would be a much more efficient approach for 90% of the normal use cases.
This is where we have to agree to disagree. When it comes to interface everybody have their own personal opinion so there is no satisfying all. The designers have to take a middle path which they think will satisfy the most users but there will always be detractors. I don't mind swiping an extra screen to get to the screen I want, it take negligible time. Right now my main grouse is the lack of folders for the app screen which makes locating an icon time consuming. However I understand this is coming in PR1.2.
| The Following User Says Thank You to SamGan For This Useful Post: | ||
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2011-12-07
, 13:04
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Posts: 138 |
Thanked: 100 times |
Joined on Oct 2011
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#74
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It's only 1 swipe from current task/app to task switcher, that's the use of swipe manager. Task switcher screen is good for - looking to see if the download is finished, switching from one app to another fast, from photos to videos to web, if it's paused, just a tap will bring it up from where it left off.
I prefer 3 screens to 2 screens, then have to scroll down all the way.
I prefer 3 screens to 2 screens, then have to scroll down all the way.
| The Following User Says Thank You to eaglehelang For This Useful Post: | ||
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2011-12-07
, 15:28
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Moderator |
Posts: 5,320 |
Thanked: 4,464 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
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#75
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Originally Posted by BigBadGuber!
Wow you actually got two thanks there...
You seem to be obsessed with my postings. I suggest you buy N9 before you post anything in the future
Moving up in the community, apparently being a useful voice I see!?
Odd, not sure why they'd be thanking you.
Esp. if they'd noticed the content of 90% of your posts.
Originally Posted by ste-phan
LOL okay, talk about hypocrisy...
and start reading instead of derailing the thread with your unconditional N9 love.
Ps yes N9 is a great phone , I owe you a positive PR1.3 review. W/O mentioning N900.
typed on N900, couldn't bring up the effort on N9. ooops
You've derailed numerous threads with your rantings about how much the N9 sux in X ways.
And then gone on to make blanket assertions that it's utterly inferior to the N900.
In your eyes, it's almost as if the N900 was the "ark of the covenant" from launch day.
And that there wasn't anything the community/Nokia needed to improve.
If you actually read my prior post (it's readable), it has nothing to do with "N900 sux overall & N9 is uber!"
It explains why I'm just not interested in that silly game...
You're the one interested in doing the opposite, you're the one w/unconditional N900 fanboy love.
Or you're a much heavier user of some other OS, & you're simply practicing the art of "divide & conquer."
Or you're just one hell of a whiny bugger, I'm going with that one.
Last edited by jalyst; 2011-12-07 at 19:09.
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2011-12-07
, 15:51
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Banned |
Posts: 706 |
Thanked: 296 times |
Joined on May 2010
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#76
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Originally Posted by jalyst
did you get your N9 yet? Your comments.are meaningless if you don't possess the device. Stop trolling and go to the kiddies pool.
Wow you actually got two thanks there...
Moving up in the community, apparently being a useful voice I see!?
Odd, not sure why they'd be thanking you.
Esp. if they'd noticed the content of 90% of your posts.
LOL Buddy,
If you actually read my prior post (& it's readable), it has nothing about trying to advance the N9 against the N900.
You're the only one interested in doing the opposite, you're the only one w/unconditional N900 fanboy love matey
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2011-12-07
, 15:56
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Posts: 40 |
Thanked: 57 times |
Joined on Dec 2011
@ The Netherlands
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#77
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Originally Posted by SamGan
I understand where you're coming from. I am a UX designer myself in daily life, and 99% of the time i'm required to think about what "normal" people want. My guess is that those people are not looking for a task switcher screen like the one we have right now, but i do understand why a (smaller) group of power users finds it very useful.
Using the app screen as a task switcher would be terrible idea in my opinion. When you mix up icons and running apps as icons confusion is the result. It also takes away the best feature of the multitasking screen - being able to see what the app is doing at a glance. For eg., you may be downloading something and just want to check whether it has finished and this can be done without maximizing the app as the mini screens are live.
This is where we have to agree to disagree. When it comes to interface everybody have their own personal opinion so there is no satisfying all. The designers have to take a middle path which they think will satisfy the most users but there will always be detractors. I don't mind swiping an extra screen to get to the screen I want, it take negligible time. Right now my main grouse is the lack of folders for the app screen which makes locating an icon time consuming. However I understand this is coming in PR1.2.
So it's perfectly okay to agree to disagree on this one. I personally feel that Android has addressed this issue better than MeeGo, especially in ICS 4.0, but there is something to say for the current approach as well when you regard the N9 as a computer first and foremost, rather than a handheld communications tool.
So maybe i'm just more of a 'normal' user with some 'power user interests', i want the system to manage for me as much as it can (which is one of linux's strong points ofcourse), but give me the means to interfere when i deem it necessary. The current task switcher approach is more about putting all the power (and responsibility) in the hands of the user, which is certainly defendable if power users are your primary target group.
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2011-12-07
, 16:18
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Banned |
Posts: 706 |
Thanked: 296 times |
Joined on May 2010
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#78
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Overall I like the design and UI. I wish that after double tapping, one could simply tap on the texts or emails that are on the screen to get to the message, instead of swiping. I also agree that back arrows are counterintuitive, but I can get over it as this is mostly in the settings. You can swype within emails, which is great, although it needs to be more fluid. The point of this device is not to be N900, but a handy, mass produced device that does basic smartphone functions in a simple and intuitive way. I find mysefl swiping the iphone now........its addictive.
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2011-12-07
, 16:19
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Moderator |
Posts: 5,320 |
Thanked: 4,464 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
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#79
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Originally Posted by BigBadGuber!
When/if the White 64GB arrives in Australia, I'll compare it with the Black one, & then buy.
did you get your N9 yet?
Originally Posted by BigBadGuber!
Actually they're not...
Your comments.are meaningless if you don't possess the device.
I still invest a considerable amount of time understanding the device.
And prior to it, I have owned & used (still do) the N900.
Stop trolling and go to the kiddies pool.
That's rich coming from someone who's widely known to be the single-biggest troll here.
Don't make me dig-up all those inane posts, please sir.
Anyway I'm done if you are.
Last edited by jalyst; 2011-12-07 at 19:18.
| The Following User Says Thank You to jalyst For This Useful Post: | ||
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2011-12-07
, 16:40
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Posts: 194 |
Thanked: 43 times |
Joined on Sep 2010
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#80
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op,
i do not agree one bit with you.
i too owned the nokia n900, in fact i owned five of them. It was my favorite phone and nothing could have been better than the n900.
until the nokia n9 arrived at my home via overnight delivery. i never though i would use a phone which did not have a featured physical keyboard but i am.
when i try to use my n900 after using my n9 for extended times, i just can not. the n9 truly makes you feel that the n900 is now obsolete.
i cN not wait for more nokia flag ship releases which succeed the n9
i do not agree one bit with you.
i too owned the nokia n900, in fact i owned five of them. It was my favorite phone and nothing could have been better than the n900.
until the nokia n9 arrived at my home via overnight delivery. i never though i would use a phone which did not have a featured physical keyboard but i am.
when i try to use my n900 after using my n9 for extended times, i just can not. the n9 truly makes you feel that the n900 is now obsolete.
i cN not wait for more nokia flag ship releases which succeed the n9
The real problem i think is one of redundancy: the app launcher already is a task switcher. The switcher itself becomes mostly a place where you need to close tasks, yet it occupies one third of the basic interaction of the phone (i.e. one of the three virtual desktops).
In general use, people just want to start and switch apps, and switching to another app could just as well be done via the launcher. So the task switcher in my opinion should never be one of the primary desktops.
Maybe the list of running apps should just be listed as icons in the roll-down screen you get when clicking on the status bar. Pressing and holding an icon could throw a [close / cancel] popup. If really needed there could also be a small button there to view the open apps in a thumbnail view (such as the current task switcher).
The philosophy of the OS is one of real multitasking instead of 'smart backgrounding', ok i get that. But how many apps really need to stay fully active in the background? Very few in practice i think. So also in that regard it would make more sense to smart background every app by default, and give a manual method to keep an app truly active in the background. This would reduce the number of icons that need to be shown in the status screen, and would remove the need for this dedicated task switcher screen completely. Imo it's a win-win-win situation:
- simpler and more efficient desktop interaction with 2 screens
- more battery efficient (only manually selected apps stay active)
- more control (active apps list can be reached from every screen by clicking status, instead of having to swipe to the task switcher screen first).
Tl;dr the task switcher should not be dedicated part of the main interaction of the phone. 2 virtual desktops (homescreen + app launcher) would be a much more efficient approach for 90% of the normal use cases.