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Poll: Would you buy an N10 with the above spec?
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Would you buy an N10 with the above spec?

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specc is offline specc
2012-03-19 , 23:58
Posts: 322 | Thanked: 218 times | Joined on Feb 2012
#171
Originally Posted by danramos View Post
Stagnation in lieu of progress.
The point is that Nokia has moved on while fanboys are dwelling in the past. This site and AAS are rather amusing, in slightly different ways.

Then, like a lightning from a clear sky comes the 808 PureView with the most advanced camera technology ever to have seen the light of day. 80 patents protect this technology alone. I'm sure Steve L wet his pants of pure joy and excitement (and lots of AAS people with him)

Nokia today is WP, Lumia, Qt, S40, Meltemi. And it is still a whole lot of Symbian. It is very little Maemo/MeeGo left, but Qt lives on and a Linux core for Meltemi apparently lives on. But most of all Nokia is HW.

The 808 could very well be the last real smartphone. All new OS'es are heading in the "wrong" direction. HW is made according to software spec, not the other way around, and we end up with everything looking and working the same dull way.

Meltemi is made for mid to low end (according to rumors). But being Linux and Qt, there is nothing preventing Nokia from making special devices slightly out of mainstream using this OS. Devices similar to the 808 with out of bounds HW specs. Devices that simply cannot be made with Android/WP due to all the restrictions and slow paste of development. The SGSII is probably the best smartphone overall today even though it is getting old. But there is nothing special about it, it is still just like any other Android phone made according to Google specs.

There is lots of progress going on. Android is part of this, WP and Nokia is part of this. Maemo is not part of this, not anymore.
 

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danramos is offline danramos
2012-03-20 , 00:24
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#172
Originally Posted by specc View Post
The point is that Nokia has moved on while fanboys are dwelling in the past. This site and AAS are rather amusing, in slightly different ways.

Then, like a lightning from a clear sky comes the 808 PureView with the most advanced camera technology ever to have seen the light of day. 80 patents protect this technology alone. I'm sure Steve L wet his pants of pure joy and excitement (and lots of AAS people with him)

Nokia today is WP, Lumia, Qt, S40, Meltemi. And it is still a whole lot of Symbian. It is very little Maemo/MeeGo left, but Qt lives on and a Linux core for Meltemi apparently lives on. But most of all Nokia is HW.

The 808 could very well be the last real smartphone. All new OS'es are heading in the "wrong" direction. HW is made according to software spec, not the other way around, and we end up with everything looking and working the same dull way.

Meltemi is made for mid to low end (according to rumors). But being Linux and Qt, there is nothing preventing Nokia from making special devices slightly out of mainstream using this OS. Devices similar to the 808 with out of bounds HW specs. Devices that simply cannot be made with Android/WP due to all the restrictions and slow paste of development. The SGSII is probably the best smartphone overall today even though it is getting old. But there is nothing special about it, it is still just like any other Android phone made according to Google specs.

There is lots of progress going on. Android is part of this, WP and Nokia is part of this. Maemo is not part of this, not anymore.
I'm not in total agreement with you on this, especially since Windows mobile is hardly "progress" (at least, so far as anything they've shown or planned on so far) and it's most certainly not emulating winning strategies. Nokia had the right idea to try to do SOMETHING to move ahead--but it's like watching a race where one of the athletes sees he's ahead but the others are catching up fast so his strategy is to suddenly slow down and match the pace of the SLOWEST competitor and agree to hold hands and kiss while everyone else wooshes past! And you have to admit that Balmer and Elop make an incredibly vomitous couple adding a creepy factor.

Despite all the talk about how they're crippled, Android and all the others are managing to QUICKLY catch up and (in MANY ways) are out-innovating and out-performing Nokia. It doesn't help that Microsoft insists on very, very limited and already outdated specifications for their platform which they've only RECENTLY loosened up on.

The one thing I wholeheartedly agree with you on: Maemo is, without question, the poster-child for stagnation thanks to Nokia and the lack of opening up many crucial portions of the system and software and thanks to decisions by Nokia to based the whole thing on hardware that was not open-source friendly. It's a shame a large company like Nokia didn't lead the way to MORE openness which they were keen to brag about repeatedly and publicly but failed to actually do most of the time. Nokia left MOST of the requests for open-sourcing dead on arrival, despite a promising wiki and invitation to request it, and effectively excommunicated the Maemo council, rending them impotent and unable to perform their stated duties despite Nokia's stated intentions once again. Remaining here and realistically asking 'what would you like to see in a Nokia N9 successor' is silly, seeing as how both Maemo and MeeGo have both been long abandoned by Nokia and crippled by the lack of open hardware support. That's truly "Stagnation." To illustrate contrast, I've repeatedly pointed about CyanogenMod--who has not ONLY gotten hardware support from many manufacturers (i.e. Samsung, who has not ONLY given free devices to CM developers but even hired the lead organizer/developer from CyanogenMod with the idea that they might even start using CyanogenMod INSTEAD of the stock Google system).
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Nokia's slogan shouldn't be the pedo-palmgrabbing image with the slogan, "Connecting People"... It should be one hand open pleadingly with another hand giving the middle finger and the more apt slogan, "Potential Unrealized." --DR
 

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Lumiaman
2012-03-20 , 01:41
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#173
I did buy nokia stock 6 months or so ago, hoping that windows phone will lift their stock. I am also a believer that Elop needs to be given 3 years to judge his success or failure. I bought lumia 710 and 800 as well as two nokia n9s. My overall impression is that nokia made the right decision to go with windows. Windows is a silky smooth experience compared to n9, I do miss the lack of multitasking and gtalk, but this will be added shortly. Windows will be the third ecosystem without a doubt, but it is unclear what that third means in terms of percentage. I also owned n900 and am not surprised that n9 is the end of the line. N9 could have been so much better, but instead of building on their maemo platform, they strayed to Harmattan that, despite it's good parental genes, was born with so many defects. Harmattan is like an embryo, instead of behaving like a mature platform. It is clear from all this that nokia simply can't do it. They can't compete with the big boys. They can't focus and streamline. They can't evolve in a smooth and mature fashion. My stock hasn't budged much. I still hope that with windows 8 nokia will improve and sell better.
 
Lumiaman
2012-03-20 , 02:29
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#174
http://gizmodo.com/5894693/this-is-w...ndows-phone-ui
 
gerbick
2012-03-20 , 02:36
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#175
Originally Posted by Lumiaman View Post
http://gizmodo.com/5894693/this-is-w...ndows-phone-ui
Been waiting on somebody to post this.

It was done by a then Nokia employee... but it won't be used.

That's worse than Microsoft Bob.
 

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danramos is offline danramos
2012-03-20 , 09:02
Posts: 4,672 | Thanked: 5,455 times | Joined on Jul 2008 @ Springfield, MA, USA
#176
Originally Posted by Lumiaman View Post
I did buy nokia stock 6 months or so ago, hoping that windows phone will lift their stock. I am also a believer that Elop needs to be given 3 years to judge his success or failure. I bought lumia 710 and 800 as well as two nokia n9s. My overall impression is that nokia made the right decision to go with windows. Windows is a silky smooth experience compared to n9, I do miss the lack of multitasking and gtalk, but this will be added shortly. Windows will be the third ecosystem without a doubt, but it is unclear what that third means in terms of percentage. I also owned n900 and am not surprised that n9 is the end of the line. N9 could have been so much better, but instead of building on their maemo platform, they strayed to Harmattan that, despite it's good parental genes, was born with so many defects. Harmattan is like an embryo, instead of behaving like a mature platform. It is clear from all this that nokia simply can't do it. They can't compete with the big boys. They can't focus and streamline. They can't evolve in a smooth and mature fashion. My stock hasn't budged much. I still hope that with windows 8 nokia will improve and sell better.
Three years? I was already told to wait ONE year to see Elop prove himself out. It didn't take Apple three years to turn around in 1997 when Steve Jobs was named interim CEO. If Elop is such hot poop and came straight from Microsoft, why does it take three years? Three years is a LOOONG time to hold your breath in the technology industry--especially for something that has existed in one form or another for more than a decade and tried to sell itself as an all-new OS (which it really isn't) and spent the last year trying THAT hard to sell and STILL failing miserably.

Here's some history, for reference:


Source: comScore (2/11) (http://marketingland.com/googles-sma...d-numbers-6875)

In all the reporting, Windows mobile devices are barely registering in market share and you almost never see people talking about them out in the real world. I mean... really, even RIM is faring better. RIM is tripping and stumbling and even at their WORST they're STILL registering a bigger blip than Microsoft. I'm not sure how Nokia will be able to leverage the Windows mobile platform as a game changer, but it hardly seems any different a fate from their previously most dominant platform, Symbian and its decreasing market and relevance.

Good luck with that stock and your faith in it. heh... as the old saying goes, "the way to make a small fortune in the stock market is to start with a large one."
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Nokia's slogan shouldn't be the pedo-palmgrabbing image with the slogan, "Connecting People"... It should be one hand open pleadingly with another hand giving the middle finger and the more apt slogan, "Potential Unrealized." --DR
Last edited by danramos; 2012-03-20 at 09:05.
 

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zimon is offline zimon
2012-03-20 , 17:59
Posts: 1,341 | Thanked: 708 times | Joined on Feb 2010
#177
Originally Posted by Fuzzillogic View Post
I'm not talking about performance. I'm talking about the html5, and how very ill-adapted it is for making GUI's.
HTML5 is going to be most multiplatform (WORA) application language most likely anyway. I didn't like QML either, but they just want to separate UI from code and make it bloated, so be it, I'll adapt.

http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-...ward-web-apps/
Apparently Web applications--those built with technologies such as HTML, CSS, and JavaScript that run using a browser engine--answer at least some of Google's fragmentation challenges. Web apps rose slightly to 67 percent, passing Android tablets in the last quarter.

"That's the response to fragmentation," King said.
 
captainofiron is offline captainofiron
2012-03-20 , 18:09
Posts: 192 | Thanked: 108 times | Joined on Dec 2011 @ Austin, Tx
#178
I like the size of the N9

I would actually even like it a tad smaller

I wouldnt mind a bigger screen, but only if it didnt make the body larger than the N9
 
specc is offline specc
2012-03-20 , 19:27
Posts: 322 | Thanked: 218 times | Joined on Feb 2012
#179
Originally Posted by danramos View Post
And you have to admit that Balmer and Elop make an incredibly vomitous couple adding a creepy factor.
He he, I have to admit the creepy factor is way up there. Still I think WP and Nokia will do well - eventually. There has never been sold as many WP phones as now, and it's all thanks to Nokia. Microsoft has this strange ability to evolve over time, absorb what is good about the competitors, and eventually end up with a product that is not necessarily the best product, but a product that is most versatile for most people and a product that have all the killer applications. I have seen this with Windows, the Office packages, MS Explorer.

But I have also seen Google evolving. They have succeeded with some things, and failed with other things (Google docs and Chrome OS for instance).

WP is fluent and easy and being improved all the time, Lumia phones are good looking and high quality and apps are added every minute now. I don't honestly see how this will fail, but I may of course be wrong. They may never be larger than Android, at least not in many years, but they will outgrow Apple rather soon on international basis. Besides, the goal is not to be biggest and badest, the goal is to make a self sustainable ecosystem.

Christ, now I feel the urge to get a Lumia phone, if for no other reason than to see how this ecosystem evolves

But I also got to have the 808 and the first OK Meltemi, hmmmm
 
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marxian is offline marxian
2012-03-20 , 19:36
Posts: 2,448 | Thanked: 9,523 times | Joined on Aug 2010 @ Wigan, UK
#180
Why do old TMO users keep coming back with new usernames?

specc == ericsson

Lumiaman == BigBadGuber
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