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2013-12-14
, 16:50
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Posts: 1,335 |
Thanked: 3,931 times |
Joined on Jul 2010
@ Brittany, France
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#732
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Originally Posted by epmt
Thanks epmt. That is actually what I was trying to hypothesize, but you might have expalined it in proper English.
Very simple and perfectly understandable by Kabouik:
1) There is a pre-order sequence or order of Jollas. The order in which you placed your order in wave one or two.
2) Then Jolla sent out invitations to the Helsinki purchase event. These apparently went out to the first pre-orderers in pre-order sequence. So far, so good.
3) Then Jolla sent out webshop invitations, so you could complete the pre-order. This is where it all started to go wrong. They did not follow the pre-order order, but sent the webshop invitations out in some other order. Some people who pre-ordered later, got their invitations to the webshop earlier than others who had pre-ordered before them.
4) Now there is another order of orders, the sequence in which people placed those orders completions to the webshop itself. This order is dependent on the webshop invitations as well as peoples time of getting to pay the order there etc. Note that because people got invitations not in the same sequence as they made their orders, they could not complete their orders in the same order even if they were as fast as humanly possible.
5) When Jolla started shipping, they did not choose to follow the pre-order sequence, but instead apparently are following the webshop order completion sequence, which can be quite random based on when people got their invites (remember, they didn't come out in order) and when they completed their order, even if they did so before the December 2nd deadline. Even if we disregard the DNA sales and pick-ups, it seems completely inexcusable that they didn't respect the original pre-order order at this point with mail shippings. But for some reason they did not.
The discrepancy between the order in point 1) and the order in point 5), added to the delays in completing the pre-orders and separate DNA sales, has caused many early orders to wait for their orders far longer than those who ordered later. There are several day one pre-orderers who are still waiting for their orders after people ordering much later have already gotten theirs.
Get it now? I think Kabouik was very clear.
Now, if Jolla actually told us some actual information on the shipping process we wouldn't have to keep guessing - but they seem he**bent on feeding us only PR mumbo jumbo.
I have to emphasize, however, that (1) the webshop access mix-up problem likely concerned a minority only (me included), and (2) all that is definitely hypothetical. I might be wrong. What is absolutely sure is that some Day-1 preorderers are still waiting while some later preorderers have already had their Jolla delivered, regardless of Finland priority and DNA pick-ups.
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2013-12-14
, 16:54
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Posts: 98 |
Thanked: 104 times |
Joined on Dec 2013
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#733
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Originally Posted by Kabouik
Thank you.
Thanks epmt. That is actually what I was trying to hypothesize, but you might have expalined it in proper English.
I have to emphasize, however, that (1) the webshop access mix-up problem likely concerned a minority only (me included), and (2) all that is definitely hypothetical. I might be wrong. What is absolutely sure is that some Day-1 preorderers are still waiting while some later preorderers have already had their Jolla delivered, regardless of Finland priority and DNA pick-ups.
Yes, my experience agrees with your hypothesis - so the hypothesis I wrote is actually also my own, not just my interpretation of your analysis.
There are, even in Finland, people still waiting for their day 1, wave 1 pre-orders while later orders have shipped and delivered.
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2013-12-14
, 16:58
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Posts: 98 |
Thanked: 104 times |
Joined on Dec 2013
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#734
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Originally Posted by Morpog
That is a nice photo. May I request cybette follows it up with a brief tweet at this order number they are going now, that help people waiting for results - and perhaps how fast they are progressing, when do they estimate the final packages are sent out etc.
Have you guys missed this tweet from cybette?
https://twitter.com/cybette/status/4...243264/photo/1
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2013-12-14
, 17:05
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Posts: 3,790 |
Thanked: 5,718 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ Vienna, Austria
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#735
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Originally Posted by epmt
Right. Order # and status of order.
This is a forum thread about Jolla pre-order tracking.
Originally Posted by epmt
Just as you could have ignored mine. Silly point. This is a forum, and people tend to exchange opinions in forums.
Someone takes the effort of writing a long informative post - all it takes is a WTF one-liner to bully him. Great going. I'm sure you are happy about your great efforts. You could have, of course, just ignored Kabouik's post if it didn't interest you.
I was - and still am - flabbergasted by the fact that somebody takes hours of his life to construct a theory why orders are being processed in one particular way and not another... and what might be the cause. It astounds me because it does not matter at all as long as they are being processed.
And this is what I, my dear fellow forum user, take as my right here. Say that something is... at least unexpected. That's far from bullying.
Originally Posted by epmt
As far as I understood, they had major difficulties so the shipments started late and still can only be kept up with a lot more effort than they had planned. (I thank all those sailors for their work.) Reason could be anything from a subcontractor going out of business to inadequate timing on Jolla's side. None of the reasons I could possibly think of are of the kind a professional company would make public.
As for going wrong, Jolla's pre-order process certainly went wrong. They said so much themselves. Nobody is saying the devices aren't shipping, they are saying the order and schedule of those shipments went wrong. The details, of course, why and what exactly are cloudy because we have to piece them ourselves.
Why someone takes so much time and effort to establish theories about the sequence in which shipments are being processed and its relation to the pre-orders as well as the actual payments (the latter being the mysterious part) is still way, way beyond me.
OTOH - what's even more of a "WTF did I just read" is this whole conversation we're having. Why did I let you make me explain my short and meaningless interjection of astonishment?
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2013-12-14
, 17:19
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Posts: 1,335 |
Thanked: 3,931 times |
Joined on Jul 2010
@ Brittany, France
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#736
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Originally Posted by benny1967
Well, as already said by epmt in his previous post, and in my reply to Mike a few pages earlier, we are all contributing to a thread on tracking numbers of Jolla devices. Others, me, and you too. We all should be ashamed of the amount of time we have spent here, if I follow you way of thinking.
What is this? Where am I? Is this Candid Camera?
It's not that I wouldn't be intellectually able to grasp what he wrote. It's just beyond me how someone can write a whole thesis on the order in which orders are processed.... and then you come along and literally use words like
Nothing goes wrong. Devices are being shipped, FCS!
I'm sure it took me more time to read and answer the replies to my perhaps-erroneous-attempt to understand where the processing of priorities messed up than writing this wall of text in first place. You also spent more time following a thread you are obviously not interested in than I did to write this thesis you complain about.
To use the arguments of Mike above, sure I might have found AIDS cure if I had used this time more wisely. But this thread we are all contributing to currently has 733 replies and almost 60 000 views, so I was not feeling guilty spending time in trying to understand where the hiccup in shipping process was, as it is basically that hiccup that gathered all of us here. And apparently it interested a lot of people.
Apart from TMO, I sometimes use my energy for other stuff, but I'm afraid you would end up saying WTF too if I'd tell you how useful to society it might not be in some people's opinions. I actually spent 3 full time years writing a thesis on some stupid insects living in areas where nobody lives or even cares, and am now paid for continuing that sort of useless stuff. I don't feel sorry not being Nobel Peace prize or brain surgeon, and I really hope nobody should feel ashamed not to be a Nobel Peace prize or brain surgeon. It's kind of cool that one can decide spending one hour on TMO, or even decide playing Tetris (also works with Angry Birds) while waiting the bus, rather than trying to use this time to solve Alzheimer poorly understood mechanisms.
I use my free time as I want to use it, and so you can decide to use yours to read and even reply how useless it was. And all in all, we are currently both enjoying spending our time hand in hand discussing tracking numbers and boxes in vans.
P.S.
Oh, and from your post just above mine, I'm curious how much time you think I used to draw "theories". I reckon you are overestimating when you say "hours". And I thought I was just sharing my understanding and hypothesis of where the process messed up, not theories.
Last edited by Kabouik; 2013-12-14 at 17:30.
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2013-12-14
, 17:22
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Posts: 98 |
Thanked: 104 times |
Joined on Dec 2013
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#737
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Originally Posted by benny1967
Sure, but all that goes to the status of the order. I guess it is up to the moderators to enforce what they see as relevant, but personally I think a thread with merely status numbers would be quite pointless without any analysis. Those taking the effort to analyze and summarize in my opinion provide great service to other readers of threads like this.
Right. Order # and status of order.
Originally Posted by benny1967
Of course. Then again, originally - as you recall - I actually took my time to explain to you in good faith what Kabouik was talking about. Only afterwards it dawned on me that your entire point was simply to bully Kabouik, not really to seek clarification or add anything to the conversation except ridicule.
Just as you could have ignored mine. Silly point. This is a forum, and people tend to exchange opinions in forums.
Originally Posted by benny1967
I doubt it took hours of someone's life to construct a theory. Some people are perceptive by nature and also write very fast. I had already come up with the same conclusion, from my own experience and by following various news sources. We have probably wasted more time bickering over this than Kaboiuk spent on writing his message that you originally responded to.
I was - and still am - flabbergasted by the fact that somebody takes hours of his life to construct a theory why orders are being processed in one particular way and not another... and what might be the cause. It astounds me because it does not matter at all as long as they are being processed.
Originally Posted by benny1967
I disagree. The way you said it wasn't an expression of disagreement, to me it seemed like an attempt at ridicule.
And this is what I, my dear fellow forum user, take as my right here. Say that something is... at least unexpected. That's far from bullying.
Originally Posted by benny1967
Sure, the reasons might be anything and some might be confidential beyond reproach. Then again, a professional company also wouldn't have messed things up like this either.
As far as I understood, they had major difficulties so the shipments started late and still can only be kept up with a lot more effort than they had planned. (I thank all those sailors for their work.) Reason could be anything from a subcontractor going out of business to inadequate timing on Jolla's side. None of the reasons I could possibly think of are of the kind a professional company would make public.
Jolla have asked for our sympathy because they are just starting up, learning, and they have also expressed their unlikeness to other companies. If so, acting like it in their communication might make that sympathy a lot easier for other people.
Giving out more information would certainly go a long way to boosting their image as a community-oriented, open company. They could still do it quite professionally, simply by cutting out the PR mumbo jumbo and replacing it with a bit more actual information. Nobody is asking them to do it in an unprofessional manner or break confidentiality agreements.
Originally Posted by benny1967
Why would it be strange? That is absolutely normal fare for any pre-order tracking discussion of any product in the history of the universe. What's the point of threads like this, if they are not used to generate insight that people deem helpful? I think Kabouik offered a very plausible theory, one that aligns greatly with my own experience. If you think the theory is wrong, feel free to point otherwise of course.
Why someone takes so much time and effort to establish theories about the sequence in which shipments are being processed and its relation to the pre-orders as well as the actual payments (the latter being the mysterious part) is still way, way beyond me.
Originally Posted by benny1967
Originally I was trying to help you, because it seemed like you didn't understand what Kabouik wrote. I think your astonishment was misplaced and miscommunicated. You disagree and that's fine of course.
OTOH - what's even more of a "WTF did I just read" is this whole conversation we're having. Why did I let you make me explain my short and meaningless interjection of astonishment?
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2013-12-14
, 17:33
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Posts: 455 |
Thanked: 782 times |
Joined on Nov 2009
@ Netherlands
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#738
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Pardon me for barging in, but could somebody tell me what's the necessary alcohol level in one's bloodstream to read and make sense of the last dozen or so posts in this thread? 
I feel as the only sober person on a drunken party of sailors
I feel as the only sober person on a drunken party of sailors
__________________
Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
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2013-12-14
, 17:35
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Posts: 496 |
Thanked: 651 times |
Joined on Jan 2010
@ London
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#740
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Originally Posted by Morpog
And did you miss the fact that unfortunately she does not actually know where those boxes were going? I still maintain we have a discrepancy with the speed with which Jolla are getting phones reasdy to ship (i.e In Picking) and the speed with which they are actually shipping. And no figures or feedback from Jolla in the last two days have led me to believe otherwise.
Have you guys missed this tweet from cybette?
https://twitter.com/cybette/status/4...243264/photo/1
Anyway I will follow all you ignore list rookies and do the same.
Mike, you are added to my own brain's ignore list.
If anyone have or planning to add me or anyone to their list. Please inform anyone. We need more useless posts.
Do something for the climate today! Anything!
I don't trust poeple without a Nokia n900...
Last edited by Dave999; 2013-12-14 at 16:51.