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tiempjuuh is offline tiempjuuh
2015-11-24 , 06:06
Posts: 202 | Thanked: 165 times | Joined on Jul 2012 @ Apeldoorn, Netherlands
#221
Originally Posted by HtheB View Post
What I dont understand is:

https://blog.jolla.com/jolla-tablet-operations/

They say that the first wave is sent... I was in the first wave, got NOTHING. Also, if you read the post, it also shows that they actually many tablets ready to be shipped....

Is the shipping costs just high? I really really dont understand it.

IF they do NOT have the tablets at all... Then I call this a fraud.
And I'm sure there are some laws for this either.
Of course fraud is forbidden by law. But this isn't fraud. You decided to invest in a product which, apparently, will never see the light. That's the risk of an investment. You won't see your money back.
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Dave999 is offline Dave999
2015-11-24 , 06:13
Posts: 7,075 | Thanked: 9,073 times | Joined on Oct 2009 @ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side
#222
Originally Posted by tiempjuuh View Post
Of course fraud is forbidden by law. But this isn't fraud. You decided to invest in a product which, apparently, will never see the light. That's the risk of an investment. You won't see your money back.
Fraud was when they took them money. It's a legal fraud. Say one thing and do another while taking money and hide behind some 3rd party rules. If not fraud, then it's a lie. What about take money via shop when you know you couldn't deliver even the first tablets? Could be fraud. Or just bad behavior.

Hopefully they tablets shows up eventually, and Jolla can pay lastu and the employees gets rehired and we live happily ever after.
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Last edited by Dave999; 2015-11-24 at 06:38.
 

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pichlo is offline pichlo
2015-11-24 , 06:47
Posts: 6,453 | Thanked: 20,983 times | Joined on Sep 2012 @ UK
#223
Originally Posted by HtheB View Post
Also, if you read the post, it also shows that they actually many tablets ready to be shipped....

Is the shipping costs just high? I really really dont understand it.
More like there is no one in the building to package and ship them.

Although I doubt there are many ready to be shipped. Maybe tens, maximum hundreds. Not thousands. The vast majority has not been produced yet.
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gaelic is offline gaelic
2015-11-24 , 06:55
Posts: 201 | Thanked: 410 times | Joined on Dec 2013
#224
Originally Posted by Dave999 View Post
Fraud was when they took them money. It's a legal fraud. Say one thing and do another while taking money and hide behind some 3rd party rules. If not fraud, then it's a lie. What about take money via shop when you know you couldn't deliver even the first tablets? Could be fraud. Or just bad behavior.

Hopefully they tablets shows up eventually, and Jolla can pay lastu and the employees gets rehired and we live happily ever after.
You cannot compare crowdfunding with online shopping.
Crowdfunding is not buying a product, it is investing in a company and expecting a product in exchange. Sometimes your investment is lost.

But: Jolla did a very bad job on communication and in my opinion producing a tablet was not the best idea in the first place. Also the decline in lead personnel was a sign since long now that Jolla is declining and now finished as it seems.
 

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nieldk is offline nieldk
2015-11-24 , 07:20
Posts: 1,298 | Thanked: 4,322 times | Joined on Oct 2014
#225
Originally Posted by gaelic View Post
You cannot compare crowdfunding with online shopping.
Crowdfunding is not buying a product, it is investing in a company and expecting a product in exchange. Sometimes your investment is lost.

But: Jolla did a very bad job on communication and in my opinion producing a tablet was not the best idea in the first place. Also the decline in lead personnel was a sign since long now that Jolla is declining and now finished as it seems.
As for the crowd funding (which Iam part of) no, that is not Fraud. And I have actually told Jolla I changed my 'order' to donation, not expecting anything, in this round.

But, there was one last round. Where some placed a pre-order. That, is another situation, and, if it can be somewhat proven, even the slightest, that Jolla knew that these would likely not be delivered , that, qualifies as fraud, definitely. Of course, given that money was paid by who orderes,.
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billranton is offline billranton
2015-11-24 , 08:14
Posts: 307 | Thanked: 1,460 times | Joined on May 2011 @ Switzerland
#226
Given the pattern of pre-order and delays, it's reasonable to assume that the trouble with the next financial round started around September time. The extra pre-ordered were sold to increase the size of the production batches and save costs. These people took a huge risk to try to make Sailfish work - of course they meant to deliver at the time they were sold. I don't know why anyone would think otherwise unless they specifically meant to attack these guys.

Please remember that the alternative to all these claims of fraud is that a bunch of people are on the brink of bankrupcy after having their funding pulled. Everything they've built over the last few years, even a decade for some, could come tumbling down. Imagine how it must feel to see a bunch of your supposed fans rant on the internet about how you always intended to rip them off. Honestly, you should be ashamed of yourselves.

If the money does come in, that the tablet deliveries get priority over the refunds mentioned in that last blog post. Tom should have to wait at the back of the queue to get his $242 off George Bailey.
 

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nieldk is offline nieldk
2015-11-24 , 08:22
Posts: 1,298 | Thanked: 4,322 times | Joined on Oct 2014
#227
@billranton

I totally agree with you. But facts doesn't change.

My personal stand is, the best way we can help make Jolla get back on its feet's are being supportive. And don't start asking refunds, charge backs etc. Etc.
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pichlo is offline pichlo
2015-11-24 , 08:29
Posts: 6,453 | Thanked: 20,983 times | Joined on Sep 2012 @ UK
#228
Indeed. A bank run is a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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billranton is offline billranton
2015-11-24 , 08:31
Posts: 307 | Thanked: 1,460 times | Joined on May 2011 @ Switzerland
#229
Originally Posted by pichlo View Post
Indeed. A bank run is a self-fulfilling prophecy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPkJH6BT7dM
 

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endsormeans is offline endsormeans
2015-11-24 , 16:35
Posts: 3,141 | Thanked: 8,164 times | Joined on Feb 2013 @ From my Gabriola Island hermitage, near the Edge of the World
#230
oooh.
ouch.
that is one movie with probably the most desperate bank run depicted.
I love "it's a wonderful life"
watch it every x-mas.
but boy that scene sure depicts a grim historical time.
I'd hope no alternate device company has to go through anything like that.
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