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sachin007 |
2010-03-02
, 20:50
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Posts: 2,041 |
Thanked: 1,066 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ Houston
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#41
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I think it is just a matter of time and patience. For example students do not have the money to purchase expensive software's like adobe. So they try to find a cracked version on the internet. But finding a cracked version and making it work seamlessly is not easy. It needs a lot of time and patience. Most of the students have that but do not have adequate money to buy the software. Vice versa business professionals do not have the time and patience but do have money. For them time is more precious than the actual software so they buy it.
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2010-03-02
, 20:56
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Posts: 278 |
Thanked: 303 times |
Joined on Feb 2010
@ Norwich, UK
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#42
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Originally Posted by RevdKathy
This analogy seems rather broken - In itself, I couldn't give much of a toss whether someone had cloned my debit card, were it not for the fact that they cloned it to enable them steal my money (ie take it from me, meaning I no longer have the money theyve taken that I previously did have, ie theft).
So let's see... you put your debit card into a bank machine, and I clone it. You get your card back, in the same state you (voluntarily) put it in the machine and can still continue to use it. So I've taken nothing from you - no foul and no crime, right?
Except that I can also use the clone of your card to achieve the same purpose you use it for - namely removing money from your bank account.
Cloning the card itself isn't theft, and it's why card cloners arent prosecuted for theft, theyre prosecuted for fraud.
This differs from piracy (or the rather bizzare analogy brought up in this thread of a duplication machine being taken into a shop to clone items then leave again) in that in the case of piracy, certainly for 95% of people the cloned item itself (which was copied, not stolen) is the end goal, whereas in the card cloning analogy the cloned item (which was also copied, not stolen) was cloned with a further purpose in mind, ie enabling theft of money.
There's no justification for piracy and saying "well it's not stealing" doesn't defend it, but in a factual sense it *isnt* stealing, and people consistently trying to hammer the piracy argument by saying that it is are tiresome
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2010-03-02
, 20:56
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Posts: 10 |
Thanked: 4 times |
Joined on Jan 2010
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#43
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Originally Posted by RevdKathy
Not at all, in this case the only harm you suffered by copying the data on your card is (maybe) a loss of your personal feeling of well being. The real damage is caused when they take the money from your account. After they transfer the money you no longer have it, so your example does not parallel the copy vs steal argument.
Whether the actual article is removed from the original owner suddenly becomes irrelevent to the discussion, no?
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2010-03-02
, 21:00
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Posts: 2,014 |
Thanked: 1,581 times |
Joined on Sep 2009
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#44
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Originally Posted by nbosch1
Fine - then people can copy all the software they like - they just can't use it. That way everyone will be happy. The people not paying for software will have their copy, and the developer wont have to worry about people using software and depriving them of income.
Not at all, in this case the only harm you suffered by copying the data on your card is (maybe) a loss of your personal feeling of well being. The real damage is caused when they take the money from your account. After they transfer the money you no longer have it, so your example does not parallel the copy vs steal argument.
__________________
Class .. : Power Poster, Potential Coder
Humor .. : [*********] Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Patience : [***-------] Weapon(s): +2 Logic Mace
Agro ... : |*****-----] Relic(s) : G1, N900
Class .. : Power Poster, Potential Coder
Humor .. : [*********] Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Patience : [***-------] Weapon(s): +2 Logic Mace
Agro ... : |*****-----] Relic(s) : G1, N900
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2010-03-02
, 21:09
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Posts: 2,829 |
Thanked: 1,459 times |
Joined on Dec 2009
@ Finland
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#45
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Originally Posted by nidO
Hmmm. I think that Revdkathy tried to say that Intellectual property what you are using to make money/save time (applications) or just for pure enjoyment (music,film etc.) or finding it unusable crap is actually money.
....certainly for 95% of people the cloned item itself (which was copied, not stolen) is the end goal, whereas in the card cloning analogy the cloned item (which was also copied, not stolen) was cloned with a further purpose in mind, ie enabling theft of money.
There's no justification for piracy and saying "well it's not stealing" doesn't defend it, but in a factual sense it *isnt* stealing, and people consistently trying to hammer the piracy argument by saying that it is are tiresome
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2010-03-02
, 21:24
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Posts: 445 |
Thanked: 572 times |
Joined on Oct 2009
@ Oxford
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#46
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The whole 'is it stealing' thing is a huge red herring for this discussion - the law is remarkably clear on this, and remarkably consistent across much of the world. Copyright infringement is not the same thing as theft. You can certainly argue that it's morally as bad, or less bad, or worse, or whatever, and that might be interesting, but getting bogged down in the semantics really is getting no-one anywhere.
Last edited by ewan; 2010-03-02 at 21:33.
Last edited by ewan; 2010-03-02 at 21:33.
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2010-03-02
, 21:29
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Posts: 151 |
Thanked: 77 times |
Joined on Dec 2009
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#47
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Remember Jesus' miracle of multiplication, in which he had a handful of bread and fish and made thousands of copies of them and then distributed for free to thousands of people? Replace "bread and fish" with "Software" and there you go. Piracy.
If anybody gives you crap about piracy they're really just saying they hate Jesus.
If anybody gives you crap about piracy they're really just saying they hate Jesus.
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2010-03-02
, 21:32
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Posts: 122 |
Thanked: 23 times |
Joined on Oct 2007
@ A quiet place.
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#48
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I'm glad I don't have to pay Sony every time I sing one of their songs in my head. I'm sure they have a team of researchers working on it, though.
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2010-03-02
, 21:34
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Posts: 670 |
Thanked: 359 times |
Joined on May 2007
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#49
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Originally Posted by Bratag
Isn't that were DRM comes in (or would do, if it worked)?
Fine - then people can copy all the software they like - they just can't use it. That way everyone will be happy. The people not paying for software will have their copy, and the developer wont have to worry about people using software and depriving them of income.
__________________
Class .. : Lame hacker & beardy boffin
Humour . : [#######---] Alignment: Apathetic anarchist
Patience : [####------] Weapon(s): My cat, my code.
Agro ... : |#---------] Relic(s) : N900, MacBookPro, NSLU2, N800, SheevaPlug, Eee-901, Core2-Quad, PS3
"In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they're not."
--
Beware of extras-devel.
Class .. : Lame hacker & beardy boffin
Humour . : [#######---] Alignment: Apathetic anarchist
Patience : [####------] Weapon(s): My cat, my code.
Agro ... : |#---------] Relic(s) : N900, MacBookPro, NSLU2, N800, SheevaPlug, Eee-901, Core2-Quad, PS3
"In theory, theory and practice are the same. In practice, they're not."
--
Beware of extras-devel.
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2010-03-02
, 21:34
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Posts: 122 |
Thanked: 23 times |
Joined on Oct 2007
@ A quiet place.
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#50
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I also hold the copyright on fire, so everyone who lights a match without paying me is stealing.