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danramos is offline danramos
2010-06-17 , 19:50
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#201
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
This is not said to defend anyone since I agree with you in principle-- but do we know the responsible party? Nokia, Intel, Linux Foundation, ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zbl-vMN2gzo
 
gerbick
2010-06-17 , 19:58
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#202
I get what you're saying... but to sit there and say to me that "we're the most open" "we contribute the most code" and "we've embraced open source" and you play by archaic, silent rules that have enraged folks to no end in the past... you simply cannot have it both ways.

Nokia is starting to look like a sham in regards to the open source community. They do not contribute the most code - I'm quite sure Google, Novell, IBM, even Microsoft could argue that. They are not as open as the code they swear they support - each and every iteration of Maemo has some very vital and very closed bits.

"Most open" is highly suspect and I've been quiet about that claim - it seems to make Nokia happy to say it, but not do it. And now... you want to publish a wiki, that could only... well, help your effort of making more folks aware that something is actually going on instead of their silence that has so far yielded three things so far:
MeeGo will not be officially supported by Nokia on a recently released phone
MeeGo has no UX that's been shown outside of a few spy shots
Maemo is effectively dead, the last nail was silently placed in and Nokia has not alerted us
I'm quite sure the above will be seen as hyperbole, or sensationalism... but let's be honest. Where is that wrong?

It doesn't matter who the culprit is. If it's Intel, they need to learn that they just cost some attention from the communities that will support them. If it's Nokia, they never knew the community that supported them. If it's the Linux Foundation... they would have said so - I do believe that one.

But as it stands, Nokia is downright clueless. I don't mind being proven wrong. But so far, the rhetoric from those folks is proving me more right than wrong.
 

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danramos is offline danramos
2010-06-17 , 20:06
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#203
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
"Most open" is highly suspect and I've been quiet about that claim - it seems to make Nokia happy to say it, but not do it. And now... you want to publish a wiki, that could only... well, help your effort of making more folks aware that something is actually going on instead of their silence that has so far yielded three things so far:
MeeGo will not be officially supported by Nokia on a recently released phone
MeeGo has no UX that's been shown outside of a few spy shots
Maemo is effectively dead, the last nail was silently placed in and Nokia has not alerted us
I'm quite sure the above will be seen as hyperbole, or sensationalism... but let's be honest. Where is that wrong?
Hyperbole or not, Nokia should be taking notes (since this is the impression they're giving and they should be working to prove these "hyperbole" wrong).

So far, it's incredibly difficult for them to be able to argue these points with any confidence or clarity.
 

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2010-06-17 , 20:16
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#204
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
Maemo is effectively dead, the last nail was silently placed in and Nokia has not alerted us
I have to disagree with this point. Does Maemo still work as a functioning OS? Is the community still developing for it? Also I think on multiple occasions Nokia has said that there will be at least a PR 1.3 update.

So I think the word "dead" would qualify as hyperbole in this instance.
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gerbick
2010-06-17 , 20:17
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#205
Originally Posted by danramos View Post
Hyperbole or not, Nokia should be taking notes (since this is the impression they're giving and they should be working to prove these "hyperbole" wrong).

So far, it's incredibly difficult for them to be able to argue these points with any confidence or clarity.
You know... one thing I have noticed is that Nokia has the stance of that they have absolutely nothing to prove to anybody, nor is anybody entitled to any answer from them other than... they have a new piece of hardware to sell them.
 

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gerbick
2010-06-17 , 20:19
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#206
Originally Posted by cfh11 View Post
I have to disagree with this point. Does Maemo still work as a functioning OS? Is the community still developing for it? Also I think on multiple occasions Nokia has said that there will be at least a PR 1.3 update.
Oh, Maemo 5 is wonderful. But once Nokia shifts away from PR1.3, nothing else will happen to Maemo.

I'm still using a Diablo (Maemo 4.1) device. Not once single Nokia device.

So I think the word "dead" would qualify as hyperbole in this instance.
PR1.3 will add Qt Mobility and more than likely not much more. There are already WONTFIX items in bugzilla. That's how it started with Diablo to the transition to Fremantle.
 
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Texrat is offline Texrat
2010-06-17 , 20:34
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#207
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
Nokia is starting to look like a sham in regards to the open source community. They do not contribute the most code - I'm quite sure Google, Novell, IBM, even Microsoft could argue that. They are not as open as the code they swear they support - each and every iteration of Maemo has some very vital and very closed bits.
I'm betting those "contribute the most code" statements are wrapped in qualifiers...

- most code for phones!
- most code for email clients!
- etc

Because at the Linux Foundation conference recently, it became very obvious that Google is not contributing much to the phone stack (via Android). I'm betting Nokia and Intel lead there (probably Motorola too).
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2010-06-17 , 20:40
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#208
The open OS/closed platform stuff is definitely more than a bit counterintuitive (and counterproductive to boot, no pun intended). So the argument of "we provide the most code!" definitely sounds silly in reality.

However - does any other phone invite you to hack the crap out of it quite like the n900? I think that gives the "most open" claim at least some credence.
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2010-06-17 , 20:41
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#209
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
[...]it became very obvious that Google is not contributing much to the phone stack (via Android). I'm betting Nokia and Intel lead there (probably Motorola too).
With Nokia's oFono, that makes sense.

However, it's not like Android doesn't have Maemo beat in other areas relating to calls.

Android Vs. Maemo
 

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danramos is offline danramos
2010-06-17 , 20:41
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#210
Originally Posted by cfh11 View Post
I have to disagree with this point. Does Maemo still work as a functioning OS? Is the community still developing for it? Also I think on multiple occasions Nokia has said that there will be at least a PR 1.3 update.

So I think the word "dead" would qualify as hyperbole in this instance.
The Commodore 64 is still a functioning device with a functioning OS as well, with a community that still develops for it. It's dead. Anyone doing anything with it today is doing it out of pure hobbyist interest or nostalgia.

Nokia's efforts are providing me with nostalgia lately too.

Just saying.
 

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