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silvermountain is offline silvermountain
2010-08-10 , 21:44
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#111
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
Blame was absolutely misplaced. That's not subjective, it's black and white.

And if you read my post before replying you saw that I did acknowledge the whole point about opinions. I'll be the first to defend EVERYONE'S right to hold their personal opinions, regardless of popularity or political correctness. But we're not just talking about holding opinions, silvermountain, we're talking about things like libel and slander.
If you by 'wrongly' meant HOW he called them out then yes I agree with you.
If you by 'wrongly' meant that they were called out without there being any 'reason' (in lack of better word) for it, then I would disagree.

And that blame is not subjective I 100% disagree with. There is always three sides of a story: his, hers and the truth. It is all grey.
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Texrat is offline Texrat
2010-08-10 , 21:48
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#112
Originally Posted by silvermountain View Post
If you by 'wrongly' meant HOW he called them out then yes I agree with you.
If you by 'wrongly' meant that they were called out without there being any 'reason' (in lack of better word) for it, then I would disagree.

And that blame is not subjective I 100% disagree with. There is always three sides of a story: his, hers and the truth. It is all grey.
I mean both, and you're of course free to disagree, but both still remain a fact nonetheless.

Zero reason to attack community contributors. Totally unjustified.

Non-employee community members are not to blame for Nokia's mistakes. Period. Fact. Black and white.
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fatalsaint is offline fatalsaint
2010-08-10 , 21:50
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#113
Originally Posted by silvermountain View Post
If you by 'wrongly' meant HOW he called them out then yes I agree with you.
If you by 'wrongly' meant that they were called out without there being any 'reason' (in lack of better word) for it, then I would disagree.

And that blame is not subjective I 100% disagree with. There is always three sides of a story: his, hers and the truth. It is all grey.
Blaming half the people he did in his rant would be akin to me blaming you.

Damnit Silvermountain.. why haven't you made Nokia listen to us yet? Huh? You should have gotten off your a** and walked on down to Nokia's HQ and FORCED them to listen to the Maemo community! What's wrong with you!!!

etc.

There's no point. Nobody (or very few) of the people that qwerty12 went off on in his tangent had any more authority or control over any of this as you, me, or the homeless man down on Avenue 2. It's insult with no real basis.

I was very sad to see qwerty12's departure. Very, very sad. I hung my head down in depression the day I found his thread that he reached his breaking point. I disagree with all of his presentation (though I understand people get angry), and I disagree with a lot of the targets he pinpointed in his rant. His anger towards Nokia is understandable.. His anger towards people that are really no different than anyone else here.. that's where I got lost.

Yes we have trolls, Yes we have fanbois, as do all communities. The generic sense of "troll" and "fanboy" in his rant I can understand.. when he called on specific people however, they didn't fit either category that I could tell.
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silvermountain is offline silvermountain
2010-08-10 , 22:07
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#114
Originally Posted by fatalsaint View Post
Blaming half the people he did in his rant would be akin to me blaming you.

Damnit Silvermountain.. why haven't you made Nokia listen to us yet? Huh? You should have gotten off your a** and walked on down to Nokia's HQ and FORCED them to listen to the Maemo community! What's wrong with you!!!

I tried...but all the fanbois at the entrance saw me carrying a Droid and started shouting at me to take my iPhone and gtfo.
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imperiallight is offline imperiallight
2010-08-10 , 22:46
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#115
Just read Qwerty12's leaving post. Raw. Some of it corroborates with what us forum 'heretics' say.

I am sure he had his reasons for blowing off like that, being intricately linked to the community and its operation. And I also agree that people should call a spade a spade and see both sides of the coin.

But the the public beration of individuals without right to reply is ungentlemanly. There are also smatterings of grandiosity and anger management problems within it (edit - both things can be explained by the fact he is 16, I didn't know that).
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danramos is offline danramos
2010-08-10 , 22:46
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#116
Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
The attacks from the completely disenchanted are undeserved. Just as everyone is entitled to their unique opinion, so are we all entitled to find our own way forward.
You forgot the other side of that equation that also deserves respect and is clearly being forgotten. Let me illustrate:

Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
The attacks against the completely disenchanted are undeserved. Just as everyone is entitled to their unique opinion, so are we all entitled to find our own way forward.
In essense, I agree. Let's just not forget there's two equally deserving sides of opinions in this that deserve that same respect and opinion. Some of us have been around a while and are soured by these trends.
 
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Texrat is offline Texrat
2010-08-10 , 22:51
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#117
Originally Posted by danramos View Post
You forgot the other side of that equation that also deserves respect and is clearly being forgotten.

In essense, I agree. Let's just not forget there's two equally deserving sides of opinions in this that deserve that same respect and opinion. Some of us have been around a while and are soured by these trends.
I didn't forget it at all. I said it in other posts. So I don't understand your post there at all...

EDIT: I'm actually one of the disenchanted, if that hasn't come across. Just not to the extreme of some.
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danramos is offline danramos
2010-08-10 , 22:52
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#118
Originally Posted by imperiallight View Post
But the the public beration of individuals without right to reply is ungentlemanly. There are also smatterings of grandiosity and anger management problems within it.
It might be, but if he's at a breaking point after enough back-and-forth and wrangling with Maemo (Nokia's Maemo) and wrangling conversations with Maemo members who HAVE a voice within Nokia and Maemo that he and others couldn't have or have been dismissed, sometimes the only thing you CAN do is just throw up your hands, turn around and slam the door on the way out.

I can't say that I disagree one iota with Qwerty12 and his exit. You don't WANT to do there, but sometimes rude isn't always wrong.

Originally Posted by Texrat View Post
I didn't forget it at all. I said it in other posts. So I don't understand your post there at all...

EDIT: I'm actually one of the disenchanted, if that hasn't come across. Just not to the extreme of some.
True enough. Sorry. I suppose I'm just extreme.
 
gerbick
2010-08-10 , 23:11
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#119
I still think that the reason why people are being disgruntled to the point of utter breakdowns is being overlooked. Instead of looking at whom blame was placed upon, the fact that problems exists tend to precede blame.

If there's no problems, the blame game is minor. The problems are not minor, the blame game is unfortunately showing that.

Only remedy is to fix things...
 

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fatalsaint is offline fatalsaint
2010-08-10 , 23:19
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#120
Originally Posted by gerbick View Post
I still think that the reason why people are being disgruntled to the point of utter breakdowns is being overlooked. Instead of looking at whom blame was placed upon, the fact that problems exists tend to precede blame.

If there's no problems, the blame game is minor. The problems are not minor, the blame game is unfortunately showing that.

Only remedy is to fix things...
And now we're back to MY original point in this thread:

What exactly do you expect us to do about it??
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