He started it!



Well actually I guess I did.



It wasn't my fault, however. Satan made me do it.

Why are there so many wiseass posts in this forum? I'm tired of being insulted. Chris, you usually post very thoughtful comments, this doesn't seem like you. All I did was defend myself against being personally attacked and having completely false claims made about my posts for the purpose of making them look bad.

Yes, you did start it, by attacking, misrepresenting, and maligning my posts for whatever reason I don't know.

I just want you two to stop baiting each other. its ok to be wrong and to disagree. I like you both, and we're more useful to the community when helping others, not arguing

I appreciate that sentiment. But from my perspective we weren't just in some heated internet debate, with two equal sides. My posts were being completely misrepresented. Completely false claims were being made that I said things, which I in fact did not say at all. And these false claims about my posts were being made for the purpose of personally attacking me, not just as part of a disagreement about some topic having to do with the N900. I think if you were in my position you would have taken offense also.

So I really reject the idea that we were both doing the same thing. I was defending myself and pointing out what my posts actually said. Whereas the other poster was making false claims about things I said and personally attacking me. I don't accept that what was happening was just a disagreement, with two equal sides.

Okay, I'll tell you why, because I was thinking the same thing, and then BOOM!, qole posted my thoughts. You were generating too much noise in the middle of some interesting stuff. You were giving me a bigger headache than those n900 videos. Are you satisfied? It wasn't just qole; he didn't randomly choose you, he just drew the shortest straw. Now please, let's move on.

If you really want to move on, you could try not continuing the personal attacks that have already happened. If you're tired of the thread or my posts, you could just ignore them. Anyway, I can only repeat my initial response to qole, because you're doing the same thing he did

1) I started this thread, to discuss the relative merits of the N900 vs. the N86. 2) I made a point about the N900 camera applications seem rushed out the door. 3) I was done with that point a long time ago. 4) But people keep picking up my comments and coming up with a response to what I said about how I don't understand Linux or the development process, etc., and so somehow my criticism of the current state of the N900 camera is unjustified. People also seem like they just can't stand anything negative being said about the N900 (a device which I've repeatedly pointed out that I'm very interested it). 5) So I think it's perfectly legitimate for me to respond to those sometimes rather dismissive critiques of my claim. I have not made my point any more than people have kept responding to it and repeating the other side. Why aren't you directing your snarky remarks at those people as well? I assume because you agree with them and not with me. If you have nothing to add or don't care about the discussion, why don't you just ignore it?

I cared about the discussion, as did others. That's why some of us wanted you to back away from the keyboard. I do it all the time. Here, let's try it together. On three. One, two, three...

So anyhoo.

Are there any other sample videos from the N86 for me to look at, other than the digital zoom example one posted earlier?

I'm just wondering... The N900's video recording seems, to my untrained eye, to have actually gotten worse from the early firmware I first tried at the beginning of September. It has always struggled on scenes with complex motion, like sunlight in water, but in the Summit firmware, it started to struggle even with basic panning.

I thought I noticed a small bit of struggle with the N86's video on the train driving away and the panning... Nothing like the N900's difficulties, but still, noticeable to me.

So, any other N86 videos to compare?

Well, again then I don't know why you are singling me out. As I've pointed out several times now, the discussion you're complaining about involved me and a couple of other posters. It was the other posters, for much of the debate, that kept bringing it back up. And their points weren't even about the N900 per se, but just general comments about Linux and the development process. So I think it's disengenous to single me out and ingore all the other parties that were engaged in the discussion. It seems like your reasons have to be other than what you're stating. Either because you disagreed with me or because you were tired of the discussion.

But, you know, I don't really see it as helpful, generous, in the spirit of the community, or appropriate for posters to take it upon themselves to police the discussion, because they don't like the direction it has taken. Earlier in this thread, there was a long digression and heated debate that I was not part of about pixel density on sensors and now to calculate it (or something like that, I don't remember exactly), which I wasn't really interested in and seemed off topic, so I just stayed out of it and let the other posters settle the debate between themselves. That to me seems appropriate. Let other people have the discussions that they want to have.

And at least that debate was about a topic having something to do with technical issues and tangentially related to the N900. Not just completely off topic personal attacks and attempts to be the police of the discussion. The most extended, most off topic dicussion in this thread was initiated by a personal attack on me and now extended in this vein by yourself, all the while claiming it's because you want the discussion to be of some sort of higher quality. It seems really disengenuous to me in the extreme. I think the snarky remarks and self-appointed attempts to police other members brings the whole tone of the forum down.

There's this video with the N86, from GSMArena:

http://pic.gsmarena.com/vv/reviewsim...arena_v001.mp4

And these videos from All About Symbian:

http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/revie...6/n86video.mp4
http://www.allaboutsymbian.com/revie...6/n86night.mp4

And it looks like more can be found searching around on Youtube.