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zimon	2012-05-06 , 17:08
Posts: 1,341 \| Thanked: 708 times \| Joined on Feb 2010	#1101

I used to think "real" multitasking is a necessary feature for me, but when I think it deeper, the Android has as good multitasking as Maemo/Meego.

1)
In Android, if you want your application to do something also when in the background, you should code a separate service thread which has the code which can be run also in the background. For example, you won't put any GUI-drawing or refreshing code in that thread.

2)
In Maemo/Meego when application goes to the background, it gets a signal and should react to it, so for example the process would not do any GUI-drawing or refreshing while in the background.

When coding with Java, there is nothing to it to code this kind of service-thread which is needed for 1).

Android method (1) doing background running is like "enforcing" mode and Maemo/Meego (2) style of doing it is "permissive" mode.

The permissive style (2) will lead to unefficient and battery wasting applications if the developer is lazy or novice; where enforcing (1) style will better automatically do quality control, so bad behaving applications do not get spread.

When prototyping, then permissive style may be helpful to make developing faster, but it can lead to lazyness and to inefficient code also to be distributed.

When porting non-GUI applications from the desktop-world to a mobile-device, having "permissive" (2) style may seem better. But those are CLI-applications and terminal application can be made that way it always runs in a service mode. (I do not know if there is a such a POSIX/bash compatible terminal application in Android phones.)

And then, there is also "real" (permissive) multitasking possible in the Android with the OverSkreen application.

So getting closer to the topic of this discussion-chain, I think Nokia should break the contract with Microsoft, pay the penalties (can be couple of billion euros/dollars) and start to make both Android and WP8 devices as Samsung does, but Nokia would have PureView. Or join the Tizen-workgroup and buy Alien Dalvik from Myriad to go with Nokia Tizen-phones.

Last edited by zimon; 2012-05-06 at 17:17.

Lumiaman	2012-05-06 , 17:25
Guest \| Posts: n/a \| Thanked: 0 times \| Joined on	#1102

multitasking is nice to have , but much more important is the overall optimization of the OS, and how seamless transitions are. N9 multi~tasking is no different from iphone. Little happens in the background except for the ability to open multiple windows. N9 fails with regards to smoothness and overall transitions

mikecomputing	2012-05-06 , 17:31
Posts: 3,464 \| Thanked: 5,107 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Gothenburg in Sweden	#1103

Originally Posted by zimon

I used to think "real" multitasking is a necessary feature for me, but when I think it deeper, the Android has as good multitasking as Maemo/Meego.

So getting closer to the topic of this discussion-chain, I think Nokia should break the contract with Microsoft, pay the penalties (can be couple of billion euros/dollars) and start to make both Android and WP8 devices as Samsung does. Or join the Tizen-workgroup and buy Alien Dalvik from Myriad to go with Nokia Tizen-phones.

Ohh yeah kill Qt and go Dalvik would help Nokia alot NOT!

Second Tizen? Do you really beleive that will ever happen!? Its even worse mess than Meego was. Take a look at the latest API documentation. Its only copy paste of everything that is HTML5 related from jquery mobile to W3C HTML5 documentations. Some stuff here some stuff there. For that reason N9 already IS "Tizen compliant" cause Webkit is already HTML5.

If Tizen has a chance atleast they should add QML to the portfolio. Or else its just another geekos that is worse than WebOS/Harmattan thats for sure.

There is too many people here who thinks Android would save Nokia. Hell no it would not. How serious would that be to add Android to the portfolio when they already has this mess?

FIrst dump Symbian, Meego and say "next billion is QT" and then in a year come say "Hey lets add Android to the list and kill Qt too"

What they should have done is:

* lobbying as hell for Qt
* Get the damn next billion devices released with fully Qt/Linux and make it open
* Port Qt to WP
* Officially support Qt on Android/Iphone
* stop patenttroll RIM for multitasking and similar when they actually already support Qt
* Stop pissig samsung of and make some kind of deal to add Qt to Tizen.

But this will not happen. But thinking Android would help is just plain ridicilous.

immi.shk	2012-05-06 , 17:40
Posts: 432 \| Thanked: 544 times \| Joined on Feb 2011	#1104

Originally Posted by danramos

You're right, but I couldn't find an appropriate illustration of a big enough hole. ...but then there's THIS huuuuuuge ***hole...

I'd like to think that he's practicing for his new career as a street mime.

OMG.. i thought this might be a serious business kinda thread.. bt its one of the best threads @TMO

__________________
Be the change you want to see in the World - Mahatma Gandhi

[Transform] Easy Debian LXDE to Window Xp, Win7, Win98 Desktop
[Transform] N900 Nitdroid to Cute "iPad Micro-Tablet"
[Transform] N900 Nitdroid to Awesome "HONEYCOMB MICRO-TABLET"
[SOLVED]- N900 Nitdroid WiFi Hotspot(Ad-Hoc WiFi Tether)
[SOLVED]- WiFi[Ad-Hoc] Internet Tethering problem
[INSTALL] Oprea Mobile to PC
LXDE simplified , TMO [Night-Mode]

Last edited by immi.shk; 2012-05-06 at 18:29.

	Dave999	2012-05-06 , 17:45
	Posts: 7,075 \| Thanked: 9,073 times \| Joined on Oct 2009 @ Moon! It's not the East or the West side... it's the Dark Side	#1105

Qt can't save anything. Qt is not important in the future, nokia don't want Qt when they going down the Windows road. I'm sorry to see that and sorry to say that.

Tizen is not ready yet so noone knows. Me atleast, always welcome new OSes and not like some of you are constantly angry with all OSes except one

	daperl	2012-05-06 , 18:22
	Posts: 2,427 \| Thanked: 2,986 times \| Joined on Dec 2007	#1106

@zimon

Looks like ICS can do "real" multi-tasking to me. Thanks to a danramos suggestion, I downloaded an Android app called "Terminal IDE," and here's what I ran on my Galaxy Nexus:

Name: Screenshot_2012-05-06-10-56-35.jpg
Views: 343
Size: 19.7 KB

Name: Screenshot_2012-05-06-10-56-35.jpg
Views: 343
Size: 19.7 KB

Immediately after starting this loop I left this app to run other apps. Coming back to the terminal after a minute I found this:

Name: Screenshot_2012-05-06-11-00-13.jpg
Views: 327
Size: 20.9 KB

Name: Screenshot_2012-05-06-11-00-13.jpg
Views: 327
Size: 20.9 KB

__________________
N9: Go white or go home

immi.shk	2012-05-06 , 18:38
Posts: 432 \| Thanked: 544 times \| Joined on Feb 2011	#1107

Originally Posted by Chuck Norris

Qt can't save anything. Qt is not important in the future, nokia don't want Qt when they going down the Windows road. I'm sorry to see that and sorry to say that.

Tizen is not ready yet so noone knows. Me atleast, always welcome new OSes and not like some of you are constantly angry with all OSes except one

Tizen OS hits version 1.0

	PMaff	2012-05-06 , 20:42
	Posts: 361 \| Thanked: 219 times \| Joined on Sep 2010	#1108

Originally Posted by cBeam

Good news of the day: Nokia's shares stabilized today, the stocks did not decline any further.

(Rumors say that the fact that the stock exchanges were closed today, Saturday, were a major contributing factor)

Maybe it will go on tomorrow:
"ROBBINS GELLER RUDMAN & DOWD LLP FILES CLASS
ACTION SUIT AGAINST NOKIA CORPORATION
...
The complaint alleges that during the Class Period, defendants told investors that Nokia’s conversion to a Windows platform would halt its deteriorating position in the smartphone market. It did not. This became apparent on April 11, 2012, when Nokia disclosed that its first quarter performance would be worse than expected. Nokia expected its first quarter 2012 non-IFRS Devices & Services operating margin to fall by 3%, and projected first quarter 2012 Devices & Services net sales of €4.2 billion. It also disclosed a glitch in its newest Windows offering – the Lumia 900. Nokia had to immediately offer customers an automatic $100, making the phone essentially free.

As a result of this disclosure, the price of Nokia’s American Depositary Shares (“ADRs”) dropped over 16% in a single day.
..."
http://www.rgrdlaw.com/cases-nokiacorp.html

Let's see how big this lawsuit will get.

Btw. look at what Failop blames this time:
"Nokia's CEO Says Carriers Hate Skype, And Its Affecting Windows Phone Sales"
http://www.businessinsider.com/nokia...e-sales-2012-5

ROTFL

Last edited by PMaff; 2012-05-06 at 20:57.

zimon	2012-05-06 , 21:05
Posts: 1,341 \| Thanked: 708 times \| Joined on Feb 2010	#1109

Originally Posted by mikecomputing

Ohh yeah kill Qt and go Dalvik would help Nokia alot NOT!

Android-"ecosystem" is too big to fight against anymore. Too many fans, too many users, too many good applications. So to be succesfull, IMO Nokia should join it some way; either by doing Android-devices or then Tizen-devices with Dalvik VM; Tizen+Android-hybrid.

Second Tizen? Do you really beleive that will ever happen!?

Yes, if there is a Dalvik VM also and both Java-based and native-code based Android applications can be used and they have all needed Android API:s and interprocess interfaces available. I don't believe so much anymore pure Tizen-system, but hybrid Tizen+Android, where real OS underneath is Tizen, which provides Cyanogen-type interface to upper layers.

There is too many people here who thinks Android would save Nokia. Hell no it would not. How serious would that be to add Android to the portfolio when they already has this mess?

Having Samsung Galaxy S3 type of Android device with Nokia PureView camera, would steal SGS3 customers to Nokia. And there will be millions. Samsung has sold SGS2 over 20 millions.

What they should have done is:

* lobbying as hell for Qt
* Get the damn next billion devices released with fully Qt/Linux and make it open
* Port Qt to WP
* Officially support Qt on Android/Iphone
* stop patenttroll RIM for multitasking and similar when they actually already support Qt
* Stop pissig samsung of and make some kind of deal to add Qt to Tizen.

I agree on those. I'd also like to see official or at least semi-official support for Qt in Android, Tizen, iOS and WP. But I do not believe Qt only device will be succesfull anymore, it is too late for that.

Qt and Qt-support and Navteqq would maybe be the valuable things Nokia brings in the soup, when it would join Tizen work group and join somehow Android-system either with Android-devices or Tizen+Android-hybrid-devices.

specc	2012-05-06 , 21:29
Posts: 322 \| Thanked: 218 times \| Joined on Feb 2012	#1110

Originally Posted by PMaff

Maybe it will go on tomorrow:
"ROBBINS GELLER RUDMAN & DOWD LLP FILES CLASS
ACTION SUIT AGAINST NOKIA CORPORATION
...
The complaint alleges that during the Class Period, defendants told investors that Nokia’s conversion to a Windows platform would halt its deteriorating position in the smartphone market. It did not. This became apparent on April 11, 2012, when Nokia disclosed that its first quarter performance would be worse than expected. Nokia expected its first quarter 2012 non-IFRS Devices & Services operating margin to fall by 3%, and projected first quarter 2012 Devices & Services net sales of €4.2 billion. It also disclosed a glitch in its newest Windows offering – the Lumia 900. Nokia had to immediately offer customers an automatic $100, making the phone essentially free.

As a result of this disclosure, the price of Nokia’s American Depositary Shares (“ADRs”) dropped over 16% in a single day.
..."
http://www.rgrdlaw.com/cases-nokiacorp.html

Let's see how big this lawsuit will get.

Btw. look at what Failop blames this time:
"Nokia's CEO Says Carriers Hate Skype, And Its Affecting Windows Phone Sales"
http://www.businessinsider.com/nokia...e-sales-2012-5

ROTFL

The hole just keep getting deeper and deeper for each day. Kind of fascinating to see that it's actually possible to drive a company further and further into the mud like this.