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| The Following User Says Thank You to pycage For This Useful Post: | ||
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2012-02-18
, 18:24
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Posts: 1,513 |
Thanked: 2,248 times |
Joined on Mar 2006
@ US
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#112
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Originally Posted by tso
I wouldn't read too much into there being a separate CD for the source code for a relatively small amount that arguably doesn't violate GPL. But the licensing of the source code is a concern...
The impression i get from the auraslate is that yes they have source code. But said code is not freely redistributable. Note how one need to pay for a CD with the source on it. Basically, they have managed to negotiate a deal where the source for the drivers are licensed on a individual basis.
Originally Posted by tso
Having access to the source code is a relevant fact, but it doesn't prevent you from working on a related area of the kernel if there is also a GPL version of that area of the kernel.
Hell it may even be that if anyone that has looked at the source goes on to make a free version for inclusion into the kernel proper, one risk the kind of lawsuit we observed when SCO claimed IBM had used UNIX code in Linux. Looking at the source may well taint the person from ever working on a related area of the kernel ever again, for fear of unconsciously using something seen and so getting sued. As such, the reverse engineered Mali driver, or no driver at all, may be better than the Auraslate drivers. I am not a lawyer tho.
| The Following User Says Thank You to SD69 For This Useful Post: | ||
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2012-02-18
, 18:54
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Posts: 278 |
Thanked: 114 times |
Joined on Jan 2010
@ SD, CA
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#113
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with what i have amassed so far, i can say that sure you could have an open source tablet, but to make it usable becomes hard because of open source. even finding hardware with open drivers becomes hard. no one wants to give open drivers because they dont want to reveal secrets of the hardware. the company that develops the software always get an interest in it and thus dont want to release it open source.
In short nothing is ever fully open source.
In short nothing is ever fully open source.
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2012-02-18
, 19:12
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Posts: 1,671 |
Thanked: 11,478 times |
Joined on Jun 2008
@ Warsaw, Poland
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#114
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Spark has a working and open source amlogic upstream kernel on it, with touchscreen and so on working. Manufacturer might be violating GPL, but it doesn't mean the Spark with Plasma Active + the amlogic kernel would.
Feel free to buy a Zenithink straight from manufacturer and sue them for GPL compliance. Or from one of the importers who you'll buy from directly most likely, who isn't likely to give a rats *** about GPL and will stare at you blankly when you ask them for source..
What's this more open and cheaper alternative you're speaking of?
Last edited by Stskeeps; 2012-02-18 at 19:17.
Feel free to buy a Zenithink straight from manufacturer and sue them for GPL compliance. Or from one of the importers who you'll buy from directly most likely, who isn't likely to give a rats *** about GPL and will stare at you blankly when you ask them for source..
What's this more open and cheaper alternative you're speaking of?
__________________
As you go on to other communities, remember to build them around politeness, respect, trust and humility. Be wary of poisonous people and deal with them before they end up killing your community.. Seen it happen to too many IRC channels, forums, open source projects.
As you go on to other communities, remember to build them around politeness, respect, trust and humility. Be wary of poisonous people and deal with them before they end up killing your community.. Seen it happen to too many IRC channels, forums, open source projects.
Last edited by Stskeeps; 2012-02-18 at 19:17.
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2012-02-18
, 19:31
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Posts: 470 |
Thanked: 399 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
@ Croatia
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#115
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Originally Posted by Stskeeps
are they or are they not buying a device that violates GPL? it does not matter much in what state they are selling it to us after that as part of our money goes to a manufacturer that violates GPL and there for we are supporting it, although not directly
Spark has a working and open source amlogic upstream kernel on it, with touchscreen and so on working. Manufacturer might be violating GPL, but it doesn't mean the Spark with Plasma Active + the amlogic kernel would.
Feel free to buy a Zenithink straight from manufacturer and sue them for GPL compliance. Or from one of the importers who you'll buy from directly most likely, who isn't likely to give a rats *** about GPL and will stare at you blankly when you ask them for source..
What's this more open and cheaper alternative you're speaking of?
they had a much more open option(plus cheaper, plus more powerfull) that i have already presented here and you can not deny this fact
more open and cheaper is allwinner a10 soc(soc is priced at 7$, amlogic is 13$, tablets go for 100-120$ retail, cheapest zenithink i found is 125$)
dont know how you managed to miss my ranting about this on the last few pages
Last edited by GrimyHR; 2012-02-18 at 19:35.
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2012-02-18
, 20:02
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Posts: 470 |
Thanked: 399 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
@ Croatia
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#116
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This coment i found might explain some things a bit better than me:
"Allwinner chips are some of the few you cannot lock the boot loader from being replaced or downloaded out the device. There are no efuses. Only way to prevent firmware replacement on a Allwinner is use a external rom chip. Problem is the device will still fully boot from USB with what ever is on the USB even if you use the rom chip option. Running third party is alway a option on a Allwinner chip. They cannot be bricked and they cannot be fully locked down. They are more open than most x86 desktop motherboards.
Yes you can always back up the contained firmware from these. Due to design also alway restore that to the device as well.
Allwinner the company behind the A10 is working on getting the kernel sorted so it can be upstreamed.*
So this is a balancing act. You get a A10 you might not get the firmware source from the company that made it but you can replace the firmware with your own."
*kernel is sorted and available already...
Last edited by GrimyHR; 2012-02-18 at 20:06.
"Allwinner chips are some of the few you cannot lock the boot loader from being replaced or downloaded out the device. There are no efuses. Only way to prevent firmware replacement on a Allwinner is use a external rom chip. Problem is the device will still fully boot from USB with what ever is on the USB even if you use the rom chip option. Running third party is alway a option on a Allwinner chip. They cannot be bricked and they cannot be fully locked down. They are more open than most x86 desktop motherboards.
Yes you can always back up the contained firmware from these. Due to design also alway restore that to the device as well.
Allwinner the company behind the A10 is working on getting the kernel sorted so it can be upstreamed.*
So this is a balancing act. You get a A10 you might not get the firmware source from the company that made it but you can replace the firmware with your own."
*kernel is sorted and available already...
Last edited by GrimyHR; 2012-02-18 at 20:06.
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2012-02-19
, 03:36
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Posts: 1,789 |
Thanked: 1,699 times |
Joined on Mar 2010
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#117
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I wonder which is the better budget SoC: The Allwinner A10 or MediaTech MT6575.
If both are at 512MB RAM and 2,000mAh battery...how would you guys compare them in terms of performance and battery life?
A10 vs 6575
1.5GHz(max) - 1GHz (max)
Solo A8 - Solo A9
55nm - (65nm ?)
Mali400 (undervolted and inferior driver) - (SGX540 ?)
$10 - $13 (prices for both drop when ordering in bulk)
Last edited by Kangal; 2012-02-19 at 03:47.
If both are at 512MB RAM and 2,000mAh battery...how would you guys compare them in terms of performance and battery life?
A10 vs 6575
1.5GHz(max) - 1GHz (max)
Solo A8 - Solo A9
55nm - (65nm ?)
Mali400 (undervolted and inferior driver) - (SGX540 ?)
$10 - $13 (prices for both drop when ordering in bulk)
Last edited by Kangal; 2012-02-19 at 03:47.
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2012-02-19
, 08:03
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Posts: 1,671 |
Thanked: 11,478 times |
Joined on Jun 2008
@ Warsaw, Poland
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#118
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Originally Posted by GrimyHR
Again, I'm not in any way representing Spark. Spark's delivered with an image and kernel that's not GPL violating. The markup goes to open source communities, see http://aseigo.blogspot.com/2012/02/s...73221624518884
are they or are they not buying a device that violates GPL? it does not matter much in what state they are selling it to us after that as part of our money goes to a manufacturer that violates GPL and there for we are supporting it, although not directly
they had a much more open option(plus cheaper, plus more powerfull) that i have already presented here and you can not deny this fact
more open and cheaper is allwinner a10 soc(soc is priced at 7$, amlogic is 13$, tablets go for 100-120$ retail, cheapest zenithink i found is 125$)
dont know how you managed to miss my ranting about this on the last few pages
We're getting down to specifics here. But reasons why you wouldn't take allwinner:
1) Tablets with allwinner has exact same problem as zenithink, there has only been leaks of drivers for the tablets, not any official releases. Most efforts take the approach of using the released allwinner sources from allwinner directly.
2) Allwinner does not provide downloadable GLES drivers and other support like amlogic does on http://openlinux.amlogic.com/
3) Allwinner devices require a Windows(!) closed source flasher to flash the devices, http://elinux.org/Hack_A10_devices
In the end, let it be up to yourself to choose if you want one or not - here's a working piece of hardware, with open kernel (though not created by manufacturer) and working and usable open platform, in which the profits go to a open community who hopes to in the future to produce better devices in which they can get out of the hands of those non-compliant device makers.
Just sometimes I wish GNU people would look realistically at the world -- while I'm a big supporter of open source myself, the behaviour of some parts of the open source community reminds me a little too much of the the Butlerian Jihad from the Dune series..
Open source developers need hardware to develop on as well and create greater things using and the embedded world is far from perfect yet.
Last edited by Stskeeps; 2012-02-19 at 09:01.
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2012-02-19
, 09:10
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Posts: 470 |
Thanked: 399 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
@ Croatia
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#119
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Originally Posted by Kangal
6575 has only 720p playback...at least that is the info on various sites....
I wonder which is the better budget SoC: The Allwinner A10 or MediaTech MT6575.
If both are at 512MB RAM and 2,000mAh battery...how would you guys compare them in terms of performance and battery life?
A10 vs 6575
1.5GHz(max) - 1GHz (max)
Solo A8 - Solo A9
55nm - (65nm ?)
Mali400 (undervolted and inferior driver) - (SGX540 ?)
$10 - $13 (prices for both drop when ordering in bulk)
btw gpu is sgx531 crap, at least by these specs:
http://www.etotalk.com/lenovo-a750-3...vga_p2869.html
Last edited by GrimyHR; 2012-02-19 at 09:19.
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2012-02-19
, 09:17
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Posts: 470 |
Thanked: 399 times |
Joined on Jul 2011
@ Croatia
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#120
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btw is that zenithink crap at least unbrickable?
Tidings - RSS and Podcast aggregator for Jolla - https://github.com/pycage/tidings
Cargo Dock - file/cloud manager for Jolla - https://github.com/pycage/cargodock