UPDATE: "1st post" Nokia's Flagship Lumia 900 obsolete in less than a year? ELOP RESPONDS - Page 12 - maemo.org

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gerbick	2012-06-21 , 19:55
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Originally Posted by zwer

The situation is a wee bit different - those are missing from MeeGo (well, Unity3D was ported for MeeGo Harmattan, remember that Samurai game?) and Maemo not due to the inability for those platforms to support such, but due to way too small user base for Adobe/Unity/others to bother with...

Normally we agree zwer. But the WP7 platform is just as small.

But other than that, we agree actually.

Originally Posted by Cue

because they are legacy/dead platforms too. * quickly runs away*

lol... I just wanted somebody to say what I was thinking.

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	Maemomd	2012-06-21 , 19:57
	Posts: 171 \| Thanked: 172 times \| Joined on Jan 2010 @ MA	#112

Originally Posted by Cue

The switch to the NT core will replace CE. So the fact that a phone is currently running CE is irrelevant, that's the point. It's like suggesting that I need to buy a new PC to install a new OS like Ubuntu 12 (Linux kernel) because my current one has Windows 7 (Windows NT4) installed. Why? it can replace it.

The only possible reason that would be true is if the new Linux kernel and driver developers did not bother to support my older hardware as they deemed it not worth it.

I've also just come to the realisation that I have wasted way too much time on this thread.

Again CE is embedded, un-change-able. And yes, this thread is a waste of time, people arguing over things they don't understand.

Different platforms now.

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Cue	2012-06-21 , 20:17
Posts: 840 \| Thanked: 823 times \| Joined on Nov 2009	#113

Originally Posted by Maemomd

Again CE is embedded, un-change-able. And yes, this thread is a waste of time, people arguing over things they don't understand.

Different platforms now.

Now I'm intrigued as to what you mean, that an embedded system cannot be flashed and is therefore unchangable?
can you please elaborate as to what has changed so significantly that it would prevent it running the embedded NT kernel?

You think Windows phones somehow have Windows CE baked in to the electronics?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyglmQmv3uU

I mean this genuinely, if you understand it better then please explain it to me.

Last edited by Cue; 2012-06-22 at 02:25.

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	Maemomd	2012-06-21 , 20:29
	Posts: 171 \| Thanked: 172 times \| Joined on Jan 2010 @ MA	#114

Originally Posted by Cue

Now I'm intrigued as to what you mean, that an embedded system cannot be flashed and is therefore unchangable?
can you please elaborate as to what has changed so significantly that it would prevent it running the NT kernel?

You think Windows phones somehow have Windows CE baked in to the electronics?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyglmQmv3uU

I mean this genuinely, if you understand it better then please explain it to me.

Yes, this is a dual boot from an sd card, it is different, equivalent to Maemo 5/Android hack Twidroid...if you can get a hold of a CE tutorial, you will see what I mean, I mean this earnestly, I have to go back on call now, but will look for one later, promise.

Edit: If I can get one of my MSFT buddies to cough one up, hell yes, will dropbox the tutorial via pm. If they don't allow, that's that, but here is another article explaining it a little better, today's hardware can NOT use NT, plain and simple. And plopping a slow, terrible version can't be done either in the community due to other constraints as well.

http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/...ndows-phone-8/

Last edited by Maemomd; 2012-06-21 at 20:33.

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Cue	2012-06-21 , 20:30
Posts: 840 \| Thanked: 823 times \| Joined on Nov 2009	#115

Originally Posted by Maemomd

Yes, this is a dual boot from an sd card, it is different, equivalent to Maemo 5/Android hack Twidroid...if you can get a hold of a CE tutorial, you will see what I mean, I mean this earnestly, I have to go back on call now, but will look for one later, promise.

Edit:Read the top comment in the video, I think you mean NITDROID too.

From NAND flash:
http://pocketnow.com/android/how-to-...d-memory-video

please, I'm interested in reading it thanks.

Last edited by Cue; 2012-06-21 at 21:22.

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Cue	2012-06-21 , 20:53
Posts: 840 \| Thanked: 823 times \| Joined on Nov 2009	#116

Originally Posted by Maemomd

Edit: If I can get one of my MSFT buddies to cough one up, hell yes, will dropbox the tutorial via pm. If they don't allow, that's that, but here is another article explaining it a little better, today's hardware can NOT use NT, plain and simple. And plopping a slow, terrible version can't be done either in the community due to other constraints as well.

http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/...ndows-phone-8/

That link doesn't explain much at all. There is no mention why the modified NT kernel couldn't support a single core system or lower ram. Todays hardware cannot run the NT kernel because the modified NT kernel has not been written to support it. The reason we will not see a community version is because we cannot modify it, unless your MS buddy can provide kernel source. We only have access to the windows research kernel. I do not have PMs blocked so please do send that dropbox link. Thanks.

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patlak	2012-06-21 , 21:31
Posts: 1,033 \| Thanked: 1,013 times \| Joined on Jan 2010	#117

Originally Posted by Maemomd

Do your research buddy:

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/microsoft/...ows-core/12975

There is a reason 7.8 cannot be 8.

Edit: Also, according to some engineering buddies at Apple, iOS5 for 3gs was NOT the same as iOS5 for 4/4s...they had to serverly tweak it down due to nonmulticore support, almost different entirely...hardware support was not there...

FYI, the 3GS has the exact same hardware as the 4, except RAM. Anyhow, 256MB is sufficient for iOS5 as iPad 1 shows.

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Lumiaman	2012-06-21 , 21:36
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WP8 looks good, really good. I think that this will help MS become a third ecosystem in real force. NOKIA did the right thing to join MS. This is the best move. NOKIA lost the software war, hopefully they dont lose the hardware war. I think that the fact that one will not be able to upgrade from WP7 to WP8, is not a big deal. We couldnt upgrade maemo 5 to 6 on n900, and you cant upgrade 3GS to ios6, etc.

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mikecomputing	2012-06-21 , 22:05
Posts: 3,464 \| Thanked: 5,107 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ Gothenburg in Sweden	#119

Originally Posted by shinogami

Um, correct me if I'm wrong, but in the end (after massive marketing), the Lumia range has sold more than the N9.

Thing is:

Those who bought N9 instead of Lumia won anyway. Because we have a community that still will makes apps. We have more features on the device.

Those buying Lumia are just stupid people who doesn't care cause they just use it as a dumbphone anyway.

Or more like this: They could have bought an S40 instead and still have same stuff as Lumia crap device for alot lower price.

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caa	2012-06-22 , 03:38
Posts: 70 \| Thanked: 185 times \| Joined on Feb 2010 @ UK	#120

Originally Posted by shinogami

I don't get the mentality of people who think something is obsolete just because it can't run the latest version of some software, as if the item suddenly loses all functionality.

Because that is the definition of obsolete? Check here, and here etc.

can't run the latest version of some software == obsolete
item suddenly loses all functionality == broken

Originally Posted by Lumiaman

WP8 looks good, really good.

An improved UI/UX is only one element that the end users consider. The perceived value of the handsets will also come from things like support. By closing the door on more complete OS upgrades for earlier handsets, they could relegate themselves to a second-class smartphone platform in the consumers' minds, they may see the options like this:

iphone/iOS based - long term support for a few years, seen as an investment.
heavily subsidised & budget handsets, WP based, unknown support, not seen as an investment, not a perceived safe purchase.

Originally Posted by Lumiaman

I think that this will help MS become a third ecosystem in real force.

No, I think the only things that may help them do that are:

the massive handset subsidies
the MS cash reserves to allow them to continue the WP subsidies for years
and the contract with Nokia to not make competing handsets.

more than the current quality of the WP handsets themselves.

Originally Posted by Lumiaman

and you cant upgrade 3GS to ios6, etc.

Actually, the 3GS is upgradable to IOS6, please check here, and here.

Apple understands the two generations old 3GS is still for sale so they should probably support it for a while longer. Whereas MS knows the Lumia 800 and 900, and other WP handsets etc are the only options for sale, and announces non-continuation of support (on CURRENT flagship handsets)... the consumer will see a difference.

The 3GS will obviously not be able to run all software available due to hardware or imposed limitations, so it is also partially obsolete but nowhere near the extent of the latest WP farce. (i.e. there is no platform break/shift with the 3GS)... again, the consumer will see a difference.